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Western Railroad Discussion > Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Refiner


Date: 06/05/13 06:15
Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Refiner
Author: BobE

An interesting twist to the crude-by-rail story....Canadian oil piped to Wyoming to be loaded to a train. Not sure who is building the terminal or on what rail line.


HOUSTON - Spectra Energy Corp (NYSE: SE) today announced an open season for crude oil shipments on the Express pipeline from Hardisty, Alberta, Canada to all points along its system, including a new proposed interconnection to a rail terminal under development in Casper, Wyoming. The open season begins today and will run until August 9, 2013, with service beginning as early as October 1, 2013.



"Open season" in pipeline-speak is a request to producers to nominate (commit) volumes to be carried via the pipe.

BobE



Date: 06/05/13 07:19
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Lackawanna484

This might tie back to the Granite Peak oil terminal project. There are several projects in the Casper - Guernsey area, as well as the proposed west to east pipeline that might tie into Keystone XL.

I believe the Granite Peak project is already loading, but it's being expanded to take several simultaneous unit trains.



Date: 06/05/13 08:59
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: GTWMISteve

Is Casper on BNSF or UP? If BNSF I remember from Trains on Location video that this line isn't the best for unit and or heavy tonnage trains.

Posted from Android



Date: 06/05/13 09:21
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Realist

GTWMISteve Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is Casper on BNSF or UP? If BNSF I remember from
> Trains on Location video that this line isn't the
> best for unit and or heavy tonnage trains.
>
> Posted from Android


That would be BNSF>



Date: 06/05/13 12:35
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: FrontRangeTrains

There's suppose to be a rail loading facility in Casper, Douglas, and Guernsey on the BNSF. I also heard this oil is suppose to ship down to Texas as well. I guess we'll see what happens down the road.

John Crisanti
Longmont, CO
John Crisanti Photography



Date: 06/05/13 13:18
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: TCnR

GTWMISteve Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is Casper on BNSF or UP? If BNSF I remember from
> Trains on Location video that this line isn't the
> best for unit and or heavy tonnage trains.
>
> Posted from Android


Casper to Guernsey to the outside world is pretty clean. Casper to Denver is challenging but they run all sorts of stuff on it anyways, DPU Coal, stacks etc. Everything but Amtrak.

I'd like to hear more about a Video of the Casper/Guernsey/Denver area, if it's not a PRB Coal subject anyways.



Date: 06/05/13 13:39
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: FrontRangeTrains

A friend of mine from BNSF told me that the oil traffic would be some directional thing. Oil loads would run via Sterling on the CB&Q to Denver and the empties would run via Cheyenne up the C&S to Wendover, etc. Running a loaded oil train would be a nightmare up Altus Hill north of Cheyenne, that's if they want to run a full long oil set. Another reason why the C&S doesn't see coal loads except for the Platte River train that is only 75 cars.

John Crisanti
Longmont, CO
John Crisanti Photography



Date: 06/05/13 14:33
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: TCnR

Altus hill is one of those hidden wonders in Western Railroading.

But shipping Oil north to Casper doesn't sound right anyways. Sending oil south around the loops between Wendover and Wheatland would be doable, interesting but doable... not that I'm the subject matter expert. But Loads through Guernsey, Sidney and Stierling, with MT's up Altus sounds right. Plenty of empty track on that half of the FRS.



Date: 06/05/13 16:33
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Guernsey_Switch

The Casper line has undergone improvements over the last few years. There is actually a coal train that runs from Orin Junction to Glenrock if I recall correctly. A large oil train can easily run from Casper to Orin, as it is mostly river running.
From what I have heard, oil loads will run through Guernsey, then down to Sterling just like all of the coal loads do. That Altus hill makes south bound trains struggle.
Like the coal empties the Front Range Sub sees, the empty oil trains would be able to head North over the Front Range off to the oil loading facilities.



Date: 06/05/13 16:47
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Bob3985

Guernsey_Switch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Casper line has undergone improvements over
> the last few years. There is actually a coal
> train that runs from Orin Junction to Glenrock if
> I recall correctly. A large oil train can easily
> run from Casper to Orin, as it is mostly river
> running.
> From what I have heard, oil loads will run through
> Guernsey, then down to Sterling just like all of
> the coal loads do. That Altus hill makes south
> bound trains struggle.
> Like the coal empties the Front Range Sub sees,
> the empty oil trains would be able to head North
> over the Front Range off to the oil loading
> facilities.
I have seen southbound sulphur trains on the C&S and don't forget the Rawhide coal loads south to the plant north of Wellington.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY



Date: 06/05/13 18:39
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: FrontRangeTrains

Bob3985 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Guernsey_Switch Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Casper line has undergone improvements over
> > the last few years. There is actually a coal
> > train that runs from Orin Junction to Glenrock
> if
> > I recall correctly. A large oil train can
> easily
> > run from Casper to Orin, as it is mostly river
> > running.
> > From what I have heard, oil loads will run
> through
> > Guernsey, then down to Sterling just like all
> of
> > the coal loads do. That Altus hill makes south
> > bound trains struggle.
> > Like the coal empties the Front Range Sub sees,
> > the empty oil trains would be able to head
> North
> > over the Front Range off to the oil loading
> > facilities.
> I have seen southbound sulphur trains on the C&S
> and don't forget the Rawhide coal loads south to
> the plant north of Wellington.

Those trains are 60 - 75 cars long and are 9,000 - 10,000 tons with power arrangements of 2x2 generally.

John Crisanti
Longmont, CO
John Crisanti Photography



Date: 06/06/13 00:38
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Guernsey_Switch

Bob, I have heard these trains are supposed to be 118 cars, at the very least, the Casper facility will be capable of loading trains that size. I know the oil trains running out of Cheyenne are much shorter. I'm just speculating. Like everybody else, I'll have to wait and see what happens.

Posted from Android



Date: 06/06/13 19:06
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: 2ebright

Sounds like an end run around the Keystone pipeline.

Dick



Date: 06/07/13 06:46
Re: Oil: Pipeline from Canada to Wyoming to Rail to Ref
Author: Lackawanna484

2ebright Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sounds like an end run around the Keystone
> pipeline.
>
> Dick


The folks in Alberta are getting very desperate about unloading their oil. The discount is growing, and existing pipelines are already subscribed.

BC is resisting increased transit capacity, QC has little interest in the AB oil, so the shippers don't have a lot of choices.



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