Western Railroad Discussion > That EMD Drumbeat

I talk about the "EMD Drumbeat" quite a bit, describing the deep bass of EMD road units while working hard. While I'm sure most older railfans know what I'm referring to, I feel sorry for the young generation of railfans who may never get to experience what used to be so common in the west. You used to be able to visit such places as Mullan Pass where 20 cylinder SD45 variants pushed heavy trains over the Rockies, or SP's Cascade Pass in Oregon where a heavy lumber drag turns back on itself at the Salt Creek Trestle filling the valley with the sounds of hard working EMDs. But now you would be hard pressed to find a all EMD consist, let alone older units without the exhaust silencers.

Now that I'm behind the throttle, I just love the sound all that much more. I've found that notch 6 delivers the best bass, and when I pass through a forested area, the reverb is just thrilling. Such as it was last night climbing the Deep Creek Hill with 36 loads of grain and a pair of SD40 variants. The train was light enough I could make the hill in notch 6 despite the rain. The pine trees were just echoing back a wonderous sound and the best part was when I topped the hill and pass under BNSF's ex-GN Columbia River Sub. The abutments for the bridge above returns the bass in full effect, and you can literally feel it. It's quite the experience.

Ted Curphey
Ontario, OR



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/26/14 08:53 by funnelfan.

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Nice pictures of EMD's working hard, and your right, can't best that deep sound bouncing of the walls of canyons. It even sounded great when I was a kid on the California coast hearing SP's(SD&AE) covered wagons and GP's working hard after going over the 15MPH diamond in town and powering up the 65 car train again heading towards Tijuana, Tecate and El Centro in the Imperial Valley.

Larry

Back in the summer of 2005 I sat next to the Greenhorn Trestle waiting for a BNSF coal train with all EMD power: BNSF SD70macs on the nose, 5 MRL mid train helpers and 5 on the rear. I sat there for almost a half hour listening to the amazing sounds echo off the hills around until finally it appeared through the pines. Not only did a hear it but I felt it inside of me. Such an awesome sound.

I grew up taking day trips to the Cajon Pass but only my days as a youth at the Tehachapi Loop did that wonderful sound bring back memories of rail-fanning with grandpa.

Great memories.

Zak Gardner / Glendora, CA.

Great analogy.....that EMD sound is my favorite whether it's from a pair of Erie-Lackawanna SD-45's on NY-100, 4 Conrail GP-40's on TV-LA, or a gaggle of CP SD-40's on a 252, Thankfully on some occasions, we can still experience it, but as they say, " get them while they last".

The coolest of the coolest sound show I ever heard was in 1975 a few miles west of Easton, Washington as a Milwaukee Road westbound drag made its way up to Hyak. The block signal was on red FOREVER and I could hear those SD40-2's on their knees for a half hour before the train showed up.

So very cool!

Ryan Reed
Cheney, WA

Posted from Android

I can totally relate....I can feel it now remembering many years ago standing under the bridges (Mission/Golden State frwy.) over the Shops lead tracks and feeling that throbbing on my chest as the pull starts for heavy eastbounds headed towards Yuma and beyond...nothing like it

BB

Posted from Android

I really enjoy your eye for photography Ted, and these are no exception. One nit, you can't mention the sound of EMD V16s and 20s working hard without bringing in my home turf - Donner Pass. YOu could even stand on the north shore of DOnner Lake, and hear that sound high above on the now abondoned Track 1. It was great stuff!

Elizabeth Allen

A couple of things about EMD Run 6 to keep in mind. The turbo is not yet exhaust driven, it is still connected to the gear drive to power it. At this point it is working like the Roots blowers do on non turbo units, it is needed to scavange the air out of the two stroke cylinders. When the turbo clutch drops out in throttle 7 or 8 the turbo sound really changes the sound. At 6 throttle there are fewer detonations so the sounds are more distinct and do not run together.

Posted from Windows Phone OS 7

I first noticed the tree sensation riding the Cumbres & Toltec and noticed the sound got louder when trees were close by and thick. I would have thought it would have dampened the noise and therefore it came as a surprise.

I remember being in the Rockies and hearing the D&RGW pounding up grade with SD and GP 40's. The sound carried for miles Loved it!

Growing up in Ramsey NJ on the EL(former Erie) I could hear the sd45's coming for the longest time. Ramsey was the top of the grade From Ridgewood so w/b's really worked hard and once they passed town you could here them throttle back and that sound was just memorable, reverberating through through the valley starting the short decent to the Ramapo river valley. The 45's just seemed to have that extra harmonic throb that the v16 lacked. My other most memorable experience with v20's was recently after the NYSW had opened its original main line via Sparta Jct they were running stacks with 4 45's I chased a w/b one Friday night and he was plodding along on the un-rebuilt portion of the main to Butler NJ at 10mph. Once clear of Butler he could throttle up so parked up past Excelcior Mills on Hamburg Tpk listening to the 45 churn thru the tight valley when he got to the grade crossing some guy handed up coffee to the crew on the fly. Then he let the throttle out and wow was that loud and thunderous. Thanks for posting brought back good memories, all gone now!

GREAT job on Pics 2 and 3!!!

I will have to agree.....EMDs do sound GREAT in the mountains....!!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/26/14 16:53 by ns1000.

I was doing a truck delivery for OAK HARBOR FREIGHT LINES as a driver in the ex-SP West Oakland yard. The delivery was between 2 buildings with metal sheeting.

A brace of 3 new SD-70M's was sitting there on the tracks nearby, then throttled up a few notches to move elsewhere. It was a great sound, and I could feel the vibrations in my chest. The metal sheeting started to rattle a bit--that was great! Those SD-70M's do sound great at the lower RPM's with that EMD 710 engine.

If EMD goes to a 4-stroke engine, aka 265H engine, then I'll be sad.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/26/14 17:01 by coach.

Betsy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I really enjoy your eye for photography Ted, and
> these are no exception. One nit, you can't
> mention the sound of EMD V16s and 20s working hard
> without bringing in my home turf - Donner Pass.
> YOu could even stand on the north shore of DOnner
> Lake, and hear that sound high above on the now
> abondoned Track 1. It was great stuff!
>
> Elizabeth Allen


Thanks. That was my point is you could go almost anywhere in the west to catch that familiar sound, Donner, Tehachapi, Cajon, Solider Summit, Stevens, Marias, and Dragoon.

Ted Curphey
Ontario, OR

As an SP engineer, I always felt with 3 or 4 SD40's on a hill the units would sort of scream. Same train same hill with SD45's and it was more of a rumble. I don't know why those 4 extra cylinders would change the sound but it did...Just my perspective!

fbe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A couple of things about EMD Run 6 to keep in
> mind. The turbo is not yet exhaust driven, it is
> still connected to the gear drive to power it. At
> this point it is working like the Roots blowers do
> on non turbo units, it is needed to scavange the
> air out of the two stroke cylinders. When the
> turbo clutch drops out in throttle 7 or 8 the
> turbo sound really changes the sound. At 6
> throttle there are fewer detonations so the sounds
> are more distinct and do not run together.
>
> Posted from Windows Phone OS 7

I think I like notching up from 4 to 8 on a 4 unit SD40-2 short train shooter. It's not just the sound, but also the acceleration that slams you back into your seat as you watch the speedometer go from 6 to 60 with the window open and the TURBO screaming SPEED, SPEED, SPPEEEED! (Oh, -ahem- er, excuse me while I get control of myself...)

Betsy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I really enjoy your eye for photography Ted, and
> these are no exception. One nit, you can't
> mention the sound of EMD V16s and 20s working hard
> without bringing in my home turf - Donner Pass.
> YOu could even stand on the north shore of DOnner
> Lake, and hear that sound high above on the now
> abondoned Track 1. It was great stuff!
>
> Elizabeth Allen

That's what first came to my mind when Ted started this thread: Hearing SP "big blocks" clawing their way up to the West portal Donner Summit through the snow sheds past the Sugar Bowl ski hill. You'd hear them looong before you'd see them creeping through one shed out into the open before ducking into another. Really good memories.

FMs, 2 stroke English Electrics, and other 2 strokes tend to share this drumbeat sound with EMDs. On the other hand, 4 strokes sound like they are about to fall apart. Anyone should realize that a smooth running engine is better than a rough running engine; its rather elementary.
ALLEN

Great trio.
JB

fbe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A couple of things about EMD Run 6 to keep in
> mind. The turbo is not yet exhaust driven, it is
> still connected to the gear drive to power it. At
> this point it is working like the Roots blowers do
> on non turbo units, it is needed to scavange the
> air out of the two stroke cylinders. When the
> turbo clutch drops out in throttle 7 or 8 the
> turbo sound really changes the sound. At 6
> throttle there are fewer detonations so the sounds
> are more distinct and do not run together.
>
> Posted from Windows Phone OS 7

Good story but it's Notch 5 rather than Notch 6 where the EMD turbo kicks in. And...there's nothing like being in the cab of of 645 units (in my case mostly SD40-2s or a few SD45T-T and SD40T-2 "Tunnel Motors") but there was nothing like the rythmic sound when backing down from Notch 8 to 7 (a very dramatic shift), and if three 645 locos in a consist, the "oscillating" and "rythmic effect" three of them had/have when all were in Notch 6. Or even with an 710--powered engine SD70M or SD70ACe in front of two "SD40-2Rs" (and now, "SD40Ns" on the UPRR), backing off from Notch 8 to 7, then 6, then 5. And that "oscilatting effect." From in the cab, yes! But also from trackside. Also, on older Dash Twos and pre-Dash Twos--and EMD F40PHs--the way the engine would gradually rev up to Notch 5 as soon as you go to Set Up in Dynamnic Braking!!! A very impressive sound. And later-model and rebuilt units have had this eliminated until a unit gets above a certain DB Amperage these days for fuel conservation purposes and etc., but there are still a few out there that still "rev up to Notch 5 RPMs" as soon as you enter the Dynamic Braking zone. A wonderful sound whether in FRT or PSGR on EMDs, and whether in straight Dynamics or "Blended Dynamics" on Amtrak psgr units...

Note: with the SD70Ms/SD70MACs/SD9043ACs, (but not the SD60s and SD60Ms), as soon as one goes into Notch 6, the computer immediately puts the prime mover into Notch 8 RPMs! (Also on the psgr F59 and F59PHI Series). But after about 60 seconds or so, if one stays in Notch 6 and doesn't advance the throttle upward, the RPMs drop back down on the newer 710s to "true Notch 6 RPMs," and conversely, after working Notch 8 for a time, if backing down to Notch 7, or 6, the true RPMs for those throttle notches come into play. Not quite sure why the EMD computer calls for "Notch 8 RPMs" as soon as one gets to Notch 6 on the later-model 710s, only that it is so... And it is a rather impressive sound effect.

But nothing beats "downshifting" a solid set of EMD SD40-2s from Notch 8 to 7, then to Notch 6, when the true "oscillation" of sound sets in. It is impressive to hear from either in the cab or from trackside!!! ;-) Happy Thanksgiving, All

ryan199 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The coolest of the coolest sound show I ever heard
> was in 1975 a few miles west of Easton, Washington
> as a Milwaukee Road westbound drag made its way up
> to Hyak. The block signal was on red FOREVER and I
> could hear those SD40-2's on their knees for a
> half hour before the train showed up.
>
> So very cool!
>
> Ryan Reed
> Cheney, WA
>
> Posted from Android

Reminds me of a couple of the ruling grades on the Sedalia Sub when I was working Jefferson City to Kansas City!!! A Z-Train, one could get up them at around 15-20 below Track Speed. And if deadheading on the Amtrak "Mule" (when I often would get "stick time" in up front) back then with a single F40 and 4-5 cars, almost track speed. But just two SD40-2s (and often the ex-MP units w/o Dynamic Brakes) on a manifest, and it would take a half hour or more to attack the same grade or more. And the tremendous THUD of the "downwhift" of Transition of the EMDs (or GEs) when the speed got below 20 MPH, and eng RPMs would drop instantly to Notch 6 (while Throttle still in Notch 8), then backward transition, a HUGE "THUD" literally like a tremendous backshifting of gearing, then the RPMs would zoom back up to Notch 8 RPMs. I always marveled at why a knuckle was never pulled during this normal procedure?!? As it was quite a noticeable thing with regard to the sudden loss of train speed, sudden change in Amperage, then sudden RE-Increase in power!!! Climbing those ruling grades. I'm sure all that have climbed heavy hills can "relate."