Western Railroad Discussion > EMD sells 300 6000HP SD90AC to China ... this is a NSD

The engines will be a "new variant" of the H engine used on UP's 62 and CP's 4 SD90ACs. Someone else on the eastern discussion said it wouldn't be an H engine but an upgraded 710. To get 6000 HP out of the 710, EMD would have to use the 20-cylinder 710 and wind it up from 5000 HP to 6000 HP. No need to go there ... it will be the H engine.

OK ... probably not officially called an SD90AC and some differences re clearance limits, etc., but internally ... it's an SD90AC!

Go to: http://www.emdiesels.com/en/company/news/links/20050907_China_locomotives.htm

Electro-Motive Diesel Inc. Announces Sale of 300 Diesel-Electric Locomotives
to Ministry of Railways in China


Beijing, China - Representatives from the Ministry of Railways (MoR), Dalian Locomotive Works (DLoco) and Electro-Motive Diesel Inc. (EMD) signed an agreement today for the supply of three hundred 6,000 horsepower locomotives, EMD's most powerful diesel-electric locomotive. The locomotives feature the latest heavy haul traction systems used on North America's major Class l railways and are being jointly designed and manufactured with DLoco under a technology license in Dalian, China.

The MoR has embarked on an extensive program to upgrade the rail system throughout China, and the application of these highly reliable, high powered diesel locomotives for mainline operations will enable the MoR to significantly increase the speed and throughput of its railways.

Mr. John S. Hamilton, President and CEO of EMD noted "This is a very important business development for our company. We have worked for many years in developing the right combination of technology with the ability to localize manufacturing capability to meet the needs of our partners and customers. We are confident this is the beginning of a long and fruitful cooperation among the MoR, DLoco and ourselves, and we will all benefit greatly from this contract."

Work has already started on the detailed design of the locomotives to make them applicable for use by the MoR. Teams are also developing the production plans for the portion of the locomotives that will be manufactured in China. These efforts will result in the first locomotives being available for testing in China in the latter half of 2007 with full production running over the following two years.

The locomotives will be powered by EMD's 16-cylinder 6,000 hp engine, will use the latest AC traction drive systems and will be capable of meeting USA EPA Tier 2 emissions regulations, making them some of the most environmentally friendly locomotives in the world.

Mr. Jerry Greenwald, Chairman of Electro-Motive Diesel, Inc. stated "We are very pleased with the award of this important business. This contract is a very important step in solidifying long-term cooperative relationships in China. The Chinese locomotive market has terrific opportunities for future growth and joint development, and we are delighted to be able to participate in it."

Where did you read it was going to be SD90AC's?

It will likely be some export variant of the SD90AC.

As for model, knowing EMD and based on what they've done before, it'll probably be called something silly like the SD90MAC-H-C.

Are they the UP 90Macs they are returning? or 300 other they have to build? Isn't UP returning there fleet of 90Mac-H's and keeping the 9043Macs?

greendot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The engines will be a "new variant" of the H
> engine used on UP's 62 and CP's 4 SD90ACs. Someone
> else on the eastern discussion said it wouldn't be
> an H engine but an upgraded 710. To get 6000 HP
> out of the 710, EMD would have to use the
> 20-cylinder 710 and wind it up from 5000 HP to
> 6000 HP. No need to go there ... it will be the H
> engine.

Officially, EMD will give you 5000 HP@900 RPM on a 20 cyliner 710 engine. We did get them to go to 5500HP @1000 RPM for a boat we're doing, as a continuous rating, but that was a one-time deal. The 265H engine is alive and well, and as noted in another post, we are designing tugs with pairs of the 16's.

Bob

Yes, 5500 marine HP is possible from a 20-710G3C engine, as compared to 5000 locomotive HP. The difference is the marine application is slightly "easier" on the engine from the perspective of vibration, thermal loads, etc. You also have essentially-unlimited cooling capacity, unlike a locomotive which has to contend with tortuous temperature conditions in certain tunnels. Incidentally, how do you cool an EMD on a salt-water boat? Water-to-water heat exchangers with fresh/treated water in the engine loop and raw sea water in the external open loop?

I'm glad the 20-cylinder primer movers are still being built, even if for marine applications. I think had UP gotten the SD80MAC instead of the SD90MAC, they'd still have a long life ahead of them.

In answer to a question above, the UP is keeping the 300-plus SD9043AC's, which are quite reliable engines...they have similar reliability ratings to the SD70M's (which are tops in reliability on the system).

The first 20 or so SD90AC's will be kept (I guess because those were purchased outright?), while, yes, the rest of the SD90AC's will be returned to the lessor. It will be quite interesting to find out who gets these units. Probably a lease fleet. Another possibility would be for a lease fleet to get them, and install 4000 or 4300 HP 710 engines in them...I could see CEFX doing this, quite easily. Such a move would be the ultimate irony, considering that the SD9043AC's were built with the intention of later re-engining them with the 6000 HP H-engine.

Hmmm, just think if the CNW went through and got those SD80MAC's they trying to get just before the UP merger.
hey some paint one up in CNW and post the pic here.

greendot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, 5500 marine HP is possible from a 20-710G3C
> engine, as compared to 5000 locomotive HP. The
> difference is the marine application is slightly
> "easier" on the engine from the perspective of
> vibration, thermal loads, etc. You also have
> essentially-unlimited cooling capacity, unlike a
> locomotive which has to contend with tortuous
> temperature conditions in certain tunnels.
> Incidentally, how do you cool an EMD on a
> salt-water boat? Water-to-water heat exchangers
> with fresh/treated water in the engine loop and
> raw sea water in the external open loop?


Greendot, which engine is going to be used in the 4000Kw locomotive that EMD and Vossloh are building for Europe. I was guessing the 20V-710G3, but now I am not so sure.

anybody notice that the name of EMD's pres is Hamilton? Isn't that where Winton Engine used to be located, Hamilton, Ohio? That's where all those thousands of EMD prime-movers trace their ancestry. Just going off on a tangent.