Steam & Excursion > UP 4014

Any news? The silence is killing me.

Keystone1 Wrote:
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> Any news? The silence is killing me.

Key,

When and if something happens EVERYONE will know. There are so many folks waiting on this, if a single flake of rust fall off the engine, you'll know.

When it happens... it happens.

J.

Gee...my secret lab that still does Kodachrome, wants to dump their last batch of chemistry...

Its killing me too!

I know a guy who knows a guy who heard some guys talking in a bar that no decisions have been made.

My totally uneducated wild guess foamer speculation...
UP's offered something - maybe an SD40 and promise of an excursion.
The SoCal guys are holding out for more, like a million in cash too because they're afraid of member backlash over "giving away" the crown jewel.

So, if they don't come to agreement (and I wouldn't bet on it) then I expect we the unwashed public will never hear anything. UP may find another 4000 to restore, or more likely just drop the whole project.

Waybiller makes some interesting observations. The last I heard, from a VERY reliable source, was: Quite a few "members" and "others" have already aligned to take legal action against ANY and/or ALL board members that vote to let the 4014 go ANYPLACE!

HotWater Wrote:
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> Waybiller makes some interesting observations. The
> last I heard, from a VERY reliable source, was:
> Quite a few "members" and "others" have already
> aligned to take legal action against ANY and/or
> ALL board members that vote to let the 4014 go
> ANYPLACE!


I hope to God that is not the case.

If so, then a boycott of the museum would be in order.

HotWater Wrote:
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> Waybiller makes some interesting observations. The
> last I heard, from a VERY reliable source, was:
> Quite a few "members" and "others" have already
> aligned to take legal action against ANY and/or
> ALL board members that vote to let the 4014 go
> ANYPLACE!


Sounds like a bunch of fools to me.

That's just ridiculous... as if Union Pacific didn't have any other options for obtaining a Big Boy! Given the extensive and expen$ive restoration ANY of the eight surviving Big Boys are going to need, I can't imagine picking 4014 over any of the others creates any significant cost savings. There are plenty of cautionary tales out there about what happens when a museum burns their bridges with a Class 1 railroad, and none of them are pretty.

4018 would likely be the easiest to move back to Cheyenne, as its just been readied for transport and is about to take a ride across Class 1 rails anyhow. The Frisco museum could likely use the cash from a 15 year lease to develop their museum. However, I still find it odd to go after a Big Boy when you have a Challenger that would take much less to run already in your possession. The general public doesn't know the difference between "largest operating steam locomotive" and "largest steam locomotive." The PR difference in value is negligible in my opinion, but as the old saying goes...what do I know?

P Wrote:
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> HotWater Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Waybiller makes some interesting observations.

>
> If so, then a boycott of the museum would be in
> order.

Boycott, Boycott is that a reasonable response from a reasonable person?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/26/13 19:03 by ATSF429.

P Wrote:
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>>
> If so, then a boycott of the museum would be in
> order.

And that would accomplish what?

Guys.

Do you have a clue to how this could work? First, a decision will be made in Omaha to do this or not. Does anybody have any info on that? Then each of the extant locomotives will be assessed, and not necessarily by folks from the steam program as they are for the most part to well known. A report will be made to the decision makers above as to the feasibility and costs of each loco evaluated. If it is decided to proceed, a Representative will contact the owning organization with a proposal. All of this will be kept under legal wraps until a deal is done if it is done at all. The UP (or whomever) may be talking to more than one group to see who they can get the best agreement with. None of this will happen fast. None of this will happen where we the casual fan will see it. It will be done in law offices with strict NDA's (Non Disclosure Agreements). Would I like to see this happen? Just as much as anybody else. Will we know about it soon. Don't bet on it.

J.

In the mean time get the Challenger back out on the rails. What an absolute waste just letting it sit there. It's damn near a Big Boy anyway. All this talk about maybe restoring a big boy when apparently there isn't even time to work on the Challenger. I don't get it.

Xander24 Wrote:
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> In the mean time get the Challenger back out on
> the rails. What an absolute waste just letting it
> sit there. It's damn near a Big Boy anyway. All
> this talk about maybe restoring a big boy when
> apparently there isn't even time to work on the
> Challenger. I don't get it.


I'll second THAT!

HotWater Wrote:
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> Xander24 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > In the mean time get the Challenger back out on
> > the rails. What an absolute waste just letting
> it
> > sit there. It's damn near a Big Boy anyway. All
> > this talk about maybe restoring a big boy when
> > apparently there isn't even time to work on the
> > Challenger. I don't get it.
>
>
> I'll second THAT!

I would like to third that.

Unless some of these posters are from the museum that wants to keep the 4014 all to themselves, I'm suprised I have to explain the reason why I would propose a boycott of the museum. Seriously?

In almost any museum, the purpose usually is to preserve artifacts for the enjoyment of others and for future generations. What better way would there be than to have someone else bankroll a complete restoration of one of the most prized artifacts in steam railroading history? (I feel like I'm stating the obvious here) I'm sure there would be a way to reasonably arrange for the UP to restore this and make the museum happy - it's just a matter of working out the details. It seems there are those in the museum that wish to keep the toy all to themselves. I understand it is 'thiers', but it seems pretty selfish and self centered to tell the UP to go away.

One suggestion would be to write in the contract that if the UP failed to keep the locomotive in operating condition (certified), then it would be returned to the museum (at UP's expense) if it were out of commission more than a certain amount of time (5 years??) This would assure the locomotive could be enjoyed by the general public and if they failed to run it, then the museum gets it back. Seems reasonable to me.

A boycott is designed to show displeasure with an organization, BTW, and if you feel displeasure with their decision to tell UP to 'go away', then a boycott would be appropriate. Make sense?

It took 5 years to move ATSF 3751 after the original plan to clean and restore it was proposed.

J.Ferris Wrote:
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> Guys.
>
> Do you have a clue to how this could work? First,
> a decision will be made in Omaha to do this or
> not. Does anybody have any info on that? Then each
> of the extant locomotives will be assessed, and
> not necessarily by folks from the steam program as
> they are for the most part to well known. A report
> will be made to the decision makers above as to
> the feasibility and costs of each loco evaluated.
> If it is decided to proceed, a Representative will
> contact the owning organization with a proposal.
> All of this will be kept under legal wraps until a
> deal is done if it is done at all. The UP (or
> whomever) may be talking to more than one group to
> see who they can get the best agreement with. None
> of this will happen fast. None of this will happen
> where we the casual fan will see it. It will be
> done in law offices with strict NDA's (Non
> Disclosure Agreements). Would I like to see this
> happen? Just as much as anybody else. Will we know
> about it soon. Don't bet on it.
>
> J.


OK, if not the steam crew, then just exactly who would
have the knowledge to inspect and assess steam locomotives?

I remember a post some time back by someone who claimed the
Engineering Dept. was going to do the boiler inspection.
The Engineering Dept. is the TRACK department; they don't
know beans about locomotives.

Honestly this whole "restore a Big Boy" deal seems fishy to me. Mainly because no one has said why. It's going to cost a ton of $$ and I just can't see the 50th anniversary as really justifying it. I feel like lots of us have our railfan hats on while looking at this and that can make this look like it makes more sense than it really does.

UP is a business and to me this just does not make any business sense given the operating steam UP already has in the stable. My money is that this whole idea quietly dies on the vine.

TH

thetrick Wrote:
> UP is a business and to me this just does not make
> any business sense given the operating steam UP
> already has in the stable. My money is that this
> whole idea quietly dies on the vine.
>
> TH

According to one of the SEVERAL rumors going around, this started when someone with a love of trains, & the cash resources to do so, approached the UP about doing a restoration for the Big Boy. Without the financial backing of this investor, the idea of restoring the Big Boy would've likely never came up on it's own in Omaha. Again, this is one rumor out of a few. Take it for what it's worth.
-Des