Steam & Excursion > Before You Buy A Used Locomotive Check Your States Boiler Laws!

Pictured here is one of the few failed purchases of a used logging locomotive in the last 20 years of steam powered logging railroads.

In this fine color shot we see the distinctive lines of a Pacific Coast Shay specifically built for logging in the Northwest.  Here familiar lettering gives her away as Rayonier In #91.  However the pine forests in the photo show that this is certainly not Railroad Camp, Washington where she worked for her whole logging career.

The date of this photo is the late 1950's and #91 has been replaced on the spur lines out of railroad camp by Baldwin rod engines.  She was still in fine operable shape in Washington so Rayonier put her up for re-sale rather than scrap her.  Soon the folks at the Feather River Ry in Feather Falls, California found out about her availability and traveled to Railroad Camp to check her out.  She passed their inspection and a deal was struck and the big 3-truck Shay was shipped to Feather Falls to be put in service.

Unfortunately when the California boiler inspector came to check out #91 he discovered that Rayonier had done certain boiler and firebox repairs that, while legal in Washington State, were definitely not legal in the State of California.  No amount of arguing with the inspector would change his mind and the Feather River Ry folks were faced with either performing expensive repairs to #91 or simply to use her as a parts source for the other 3 remaining Shays on the FRRy roster.  We can see by this photo, they chose the latter.

The real insult to injury here was the fact that #91 was chosen to replace FRRy #5 a big 3-truck Willamette who had developed some boiler problems herself.  #5 had already been scrapped by the time that #91 arrived.  When all the dust settled it was determined that the repairs to #5 would have been much cheaper than all the expense of inspecting, buying and shipping #91 who failed inspection upon her arrival in California.

Live and learn.

Martin



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/15 03:40 by LoggerHogger.

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Why would these engines be subject to state regulation?

-John

Most if not all states have those laws governing boilers in there states. Washington is diffrent than Oregon on some of theres. Smaller model boilers in some states are regulated to the point certain sizes are required to have inspections. Even air compressors used in businesses were required to be inspected in WA state at one time.

BAB Wrote:
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> Most if not all states have those laws governing
> boilers in there states. Washington is diffrent
> than Oregon on some of theres. Smaller model
> boilers in some states are regulated to the point
> certain sizes are required to have inspections.
> Even air compressors used in businesses were
> required to be inspected in WA state at one time.

Washington has very restrictive rules on scale miniature railroad boilers.  The Kitsap Live Steamers hate them.
Now Oregon has very tight rules on air compressors.  I used to see great looking air compressors in both Sears and Wards catalogs, but some had small print stating:  Cannot be sold in Oregon.

Some cities in California such as in the San Mateo area have tight electrical codes such as:  A 6-volt low voltage doorbell circuit must
be in Conduit.   C'mon--  are they kidding ?   See what I mean!

KRK

KeyRouteKen Wrote:
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> Some cities in California such as in the San Mateo
> area have tight electrical codes such as:  A
> 6-volt low voltage doorbell circuit must
> be in Conduit.   C'mon--  are they kidding
> ?   See what I mean!
>
> KRK

Ken, I would have to wonder if a regulation like that predates romex and was founded in the era when individual wires were run in buildings.

Air compressor tanks 5 cu ft or larger still are inspected.  Smaller tanks will still a safety valve op check by some inspectors.
Boilerkiller

BAB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most if not all states have those laws governing
> boilers in there states. Washington is diffrent
> than Oregon on some of theres. Smaller model
> boilers in some states are regulated to the point
> certain sizes are required to have inspections.
> Even air compressors used in businesses were
> required to be inspected in WA state at one time.

Still are. Pressure vessel inspections are done every two years by a State cert. inspector, at least here in the Mining Industry.

Cheers, Dave

Many building and safety codes show signs of "input" by trade union groups that want to prohibit new technology that requires less skill to install.  For example, back about 65 years ago, my dad gave my brother and me a "behind the scenes" tour of the new San Marino post office that he and his colleagues had just moved into.  One of the things he showed us was the "wiped lead" joints on some of the drain pipes.  He explained how part of becoming a journeyman plumber was being able to do the painstaking process of making one of these joints.  Indeed the word plumber is derived from the Latin word for lead.  One could imagine  that someone who had learned the "old school" method would look askance at today's plumbers who use hose clamps, socket wrenches and neoprene sleeve to connect ABS plastic drain pipes.

boilerkiller wrote:

>Smaller tanks will still a safety valve op check by some inspectors.

What does this mean?  (it's hard to comprehend sentences if there's misspellings or words left out)

I think it is supposed to read "Smaller tanks will still REQUIRE a safety valve OPERATIONAL check by some inspectors."

How would these State boiler regulations, inspection schemes affect common carrier railroads.  Surely, UP, NP, etc. did not have every boiler inspected in every State the locomotive might have operated in.  Didn't ICC have its own Federal boiler regs?  If the Rayonier Shay in question was operated by a common carrier RR would the Federal regs have trumped the State's?

Last time I looked into the istuation (15-20 years ago), the Federal regs pre-empted state regs, including boilers on industrial steam locomotives -- not sure for boilers on models like live steamers. Keep in mind that what the law permits and enables the CFR/FRA to oversee and how strictly to do so and what the FRA actually does are two different things, based its manpower levels (number of inspectors), Congressional funding, and how much it can get away with not doing (tourist lines and mseums are lower piority than the country's railraods). IOW, the boiler on shay in question was pre-empted from State jurisdiction at least 20 years ago.

Back in the day, if you were not a registered common carrier railroad, the ICC (now FRA) had no oversight over any industrial railroad.  Remember logging railroads were basically plant railroads and only required to conform to state pressure vessel codes and state railroad guidelines.  

In California Roaring Camp and Yosemite Mountain Sugar Pine do not fall under FRA rules, only state.

FRA rules apply if the railroad is 24" gauge or over, AND is non-insular, i.e. crosses a public roadway or crosses over one with a bridge or trestle.

Connections to non-insular railroads must be severed 30 feet back to be considered insular.

-M

Mike Massee
Tehachapi, CA
Photography, Railroading and more..

>FRA rules apply if the railroad is 24" gauge or over, AND is non-insular, i.e. crosses a public roadway or crosses over one with a bridge or trestle.

Actually, the regs apply to "insular" but the FRA created this semantic ruse in order to sidestep regulating them. It's a manpower and fudning thing. If an "insular" rr ever has a big problem (kills more than two people in one accident), the regulatory authorities will descend.

I don't recall how nor the details but live steamers and roller coasters have been excluded from FRA purview.