Steam & Excursion > Some photographers

Something that continues to get my goat are these photographers who have gone out recently and photographed the N&W 611, then they have the nerve to complain about the fact that the operator of these last trips placed certain cars in the consist where the colors of these cars do not blend in with the locomotive and other cars in N&W colors.  I asked this one particular person ( I'm not sure if he is a member of T.O. or not) did you purchase a ticket?  Did you send them a donation?  You know the answer, well he didn't do either, yet here he is now complaining.  If you are reading this, get over it fellow.  Just be damn glad that the Norfolk Southern Railroad is allowing steam to operate in 2016, and next time, buy a ticket and stop complaining.  To me the train looked great and operated perfectly, and folks that I know said that they had a great time.  Thank you to all who make these trips possible.
John

Well said! It's kind of odd to make that complaint given the mismatched consists that made up passenger trains for so many years, pullmans, through service, mergers, jointly operated trains and so on. Just look at the photos from the period.

Sounds like the 611 operation was VERY prototypical.

The 611 trips are not operated for the benefit of a few picky railfan photographers.  They need to get over themselves; but they won't.
Maybe they could charter a photo passenger train sometime.

Some people take this hobby way way to seriously. wow

The way I understand it is, the decision was made to move the dome cars up towards the front of the train after many requests by those who are actually buying the premium tickets to ride in the dome cars.  Can't blame them one bit for appeasing the ones who are helping them pay the bills...as opposed to the ones on the ground who didn't buy a ticket!

We rarely if ever made a trip with 1522 where we didn't get a carload of free advice.  You just learn to ignore it unless someone carries it too far.
Only time I agreed with them was our first trip with that sign across the front of the boiler braces.  None of us liked it either.   I think somebody stole it during the night on the next trip.  We were heartbroken.  NOT!

Much ado about nothing.

People complain all the time.  Some people just slip into a habit of complaining about everything.  We all have fallen into a rut where we complain more than we should.  It might last a few minutes, or years.  Often a reflection of other things in thier life......

Personally, I haven't donated or bought a ticket to every single steam engine that I've seen - even if I have taken a few photos.  Have I ever complained about something about what was done?  Probably, although complaining to a buddy and complaining on a public medium such as TO are completely different.  I have a right to do either.  Does it make me a bad person?  I suppose it depends on how vocal the complaint is - and what it is about.    I appreciate the efforts of those in steam preservation and do my best to play my part in helping the cause - but I can't donate to everybody.  Who can?    Doesn' mean I cant chase a train and take pictures.   Does anyone really care that people do this?   Seriously? 

The response and behavior-critique about the picture-taker's complaints is as old as the invention of photography.

Complainers, to operators of railfan specials, complained about seat-equipped gondola cars in consists, about open platform observation cars next to the locos, about additional water cars for locos, about open-door baggage cars, about too much smoke, about not enough smoke, too much whistling, not enough whistling, about open window cars with heads out of every window (while negotiating tight curves).....about everything you can imagine.... And things you can't imagine!

And the author is right, SUPPORT the operation with ticket purchases.....then, if you'd rather be trackside, & you're not on the train -----folks on board will gladly occupy your donated seat.   Many times people with limited-motion disabilities would gladly love to have your seat ---- so you can feel magnanimous in your generosity, together with helping to support your 'self-validation' hobby.

And I'm sorry, line-side picture-taker, your pictures aren't all THAT good, anyway.  
You won't be on the cover of Trains magazines,
You'll have your pictures on the wwweb, along with about 30,000 other duplicates, by other complainers, of your 'priceless' snapshot.

Yes, back when we were running the High Iron Company trips, we got hundreds of written letters and cards with the VERY SAME complaints as in today's Tweet-World...
Our office manager, Don Smith, kept all of them all in a folder he called the 'Funny-File'.  
We had complaints from the same crowd with the Same gripes as today.

A long time ago, one of the former directors of Steamtown, Vermont.....threatened to drape the NKP 759 in a full length, canvas cover --- removable at photo run-by locations.  The complaints, threats and screaming from the "free-loader crowd" was INTENSE!
These guys became apoplectic about that possibility, AND the said director was grumpy-enough that his threat was taken as being a serious reality.  The howls went on for weeks....  ( Sadly, the draped 'Berk never materialized...).

These events &  trips can all END abruptly, and then you will never have the feelings of gratification that you, at least, had $upported the trips when they WERE run.

We never thought that there'd be excursions even running in 2016.
And, yet, here we are. 

And thanks  to a few very supportive folks in 'the industry', in the craft of preservation of operating steam, in the Regulators' fields and the speciality suppliers' fields....here we are still steaming into the 21st Century.  Many unsung heroes labor intensely to bring these complex journeys into reality......and the sniveling complainers are grotesque in their audacity, and crudely selfish In their tone.  Gimme a break!

We're still stuck with the same old complainers ----that go back 150 or more years.....

If they had cameras in Christ's day, this 'crowd'  would be complaining at the perceived 'obstructions' at the crucifixion!
"You're spoiling my PICTURE!" ---- they'd complain.....


W.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/16 16:26 by wcamp1472.

Right on, Wes.  These complaints always remind me of the old joke about the guy who always complained about not winning the lottery, and complained to God, who responded "Buy a ticket, Maury!"   I most times buy tickets to ride behind steam excursions.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/16 16:53 by nycman.

Thanx, nycman,

I also send in contributions in support of those organizations, mostly small, and operators that I have confidence in.
My tax guy encourages me to up my amount of contribution$, because I am currently WAY below what the IRS looks at as being  "suspicious".

Miserly, stingy,  is not a label that I want to be hung with.
I'd  like to grow in my giving, to be known as generous....

I still remember establishing our friendship, while next to the 4449!
How are you doing?

And yes, when I hit the Big One, we'll build a couple of Niagaras and a couple of Hudsons (using and incorporating up-dated technology)...

The copies are cheaper than the costs of one original...while you're building ONE, the copies are  "gimmies".  
There's patterns to made, jigs to build, castings to pour, machine tool set-up times, etc....so that after putting in all that work,
you might as well cast 2 or 3 more, machine a couple of copies while the lathes and milling machines are 'set-up', while you're at it!
The copies are cheap...

Wes.

PS...
We'd probably burn a different type of solid fuels, rather than coal ---- keeping some of the compressed burn-ables, plastics, cardboard out of the land fills, etc. As oil burners we'd incorporate used/waste restaurant fryer fats....keeping that glop out of the landfills, too.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/16 16:57 by wcamp1472.

Very well stated, Wes -- and I agree completely.

Gordon

The complainers sound like a bunch of "keystones". (Former? Member here)

Posted from iPhone

I photographed and videoed it and thought it looked awesome the way it was...


Jay

Face it, folks:  There are a few jerks in every endeavor.

Some endeavors are blessed with more than their fair share.

P Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Much ado about nothing.
>
>...complaining to a buddy and complaining
> on a public medium such as TO are
> completely different.

> Does anyone really care that people do this?  
> Seriously? 

I agree - it's all in the nature of the complaint.

Reminds me of the photos you see posted where
someone is walking in front of a parked train yet
the photographer will caption the photo as if the
person was risking their life crossing the track.

I do not know the nature of the complaint but
often I hear people simply suggest one thing
or express a regret regarding the outcome of
a decision made for reasons unknown.  THis
is far from being a obnoxious.

Would I upset everyone here if I photographed
N&W #611 and said "sucks about the diesel"?
If I told you I made a donation, would that
make it OK?  If I told the VMT I made a dona-
tion, would they remove the diesel?

It's all in the nature of the "complaint", or at
times, a personal observation made from one
railfan or photographer to another with simialr
interests.

And for those that are downright obnoxious,
does, in fact, anyone really care?.

/Mitch

And as a side note: Along the lines of "See
something, say something" - some complai,.
errr, I mean, constructive criticism can in
fact lead to a better event the next time
around. 



 

Did I miss something?  I really didn't hear too much complaining about the placement of cars on these trains.  Everyone I met lineside last weekend just seemed happy the thing was running. 

Bridge60 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Did I miss something?  I really didn't hear too
> much complaining about the placement of cars on
> these trains.  Everyone I met lineside last
> weekend just seemed happy the thing was running.

Ditto.  Haven't heard a single complaint both weekends.  There's far more complaining here about complainers than actual complaints...

In my opinion, this is the best steam show we've had in the east in almost 20 years.  And I very much appreciate it.  Enjoy it while it lasts, you never know when it might end.

-James
http://www.steamtrainvideos.com

ClubCar Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Something that continues to get my goat are these
> photographers who have gone out recently and
> photographed the N&W 611, then they have the nerve
> to complain about the fact that the operator of
> these last trips placed certain cars in the
> consist where the colors of these cars do not
> blend in with the locomotive and other cars in N&W
> colors.  I asked this one particular person ( I'm
> not sure if he is a member of T.O. or not) did you
> purchase a ticket?  Did you send them a
> donation?  You know the answer, well he didn't do
> either, yet here he is now complaining.  If you
> are reading this, get over it fellow.  Just be
> damn glad that the Norfolk Southern Railroad is
> allowing steam to operate in 2016, and next time,
> buy a ticket and stop complaining.  To me the
> train looked great and operated perfectly, and
> folks that I know said that they had a great
> time.  Thank you to all who make these trips
> possible.
> John

While I agree with your basic premise there's a couple of things that have bugged me about this whole thread, the big one being this notion of if you didnt buy a ticket and didn't ride the train, you're not entitled to have an opinion about the trips.

Don't get me wrong, I found nothing to complain about the trips last weekend but if I did, I'd sure as heck will make my opinions known. Despite not shelling out money for a ticket, I have contributed monetarily to the FireUp611 campaign in the form of purchasing merchandise as well as cash donations. For someone in my position that has been paid to ride trains for a large part of career, the prospect of riding a fan trip is not appealing to me, especially since insurance policies covering these trips won't allow for riding in the vestibules or in open air cars so one can not only see but also hear, feel, and smell the steam locomotive in action which is something those of us that do line side photography to get to experience. These steam organizations also need to realize while most of pics railfans take while following these trips won't be commercially used, they are still a great source of free advertising, especially on social media.

Off my soapbox.

BNSFDS

Posted from iPhone

When I was out there 4/9-10, there was no line-side complaining about the consist, either. An occational gripe about the diesels, but mentioning a 2.2% grade will shut people up pretty quickly.

Bridge60 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Did I miss something?  I really didn't hear too
> much complaining about the placement of cars on
> these trains.  Everyone I met lineside last
> weekend just seemed happy the thing was running. 

Search for posts here by "andersonb109." Pretty much complained about something on every 611 post from that weekend.
~wko