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Nostalgia & History > Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited


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Date: 10/09/11 08:25
Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: KeyRouteKen

Here are a few more glimpses of the Santa Fe in the Eastbay. Dates and other info not available, but my good friend Evan Werkema will probably provide this info.

Photo 1. Santa Fe's BERKELEY Depot.

Photo 2. Santa Fe thru Albany, CA. The San Francisco Chief operated over this old track thru these neighborhoods. Amazing, huh ?

Photo 3. Santa Fe thru El Cerrito, CA. That is ALBANY HILL in the background.

Photos courtesy of John Illman.

KRK








Date: 10/09/11 08:29
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: KeyRouteKen

Or maybe you guys would prefer somethking like a "double-headed PFE train" on the Santa Fe, crossing over the Southern Pacific mainline. Check out that impressive 'pole line' .
Location ?? Evan Werkema will probably tell us.

Photo courtesy of John Illman.

KRK



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 08:31 by KeyRouteKen.




Date: 10/09/11 08:57
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: DavidP

Is Berkeley depot the one that housed a Mexican restaurant in the 1980s? What's it used for now?

Dave



Date: 10/09/11 09:18
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: KeyRouteKen

DavidP Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is Berkeley depot the one that housed a Mexican
> restaurant in the 1980s? What's it used for now?
>
> Dave

The Berkeley depot, now a Montessori school: http://g.co/maps/hm37q

KRK



Date: 10/09/11 09:54
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: lwilton

KeyRouteKen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Photo 2. Santa Fe thru Albany, CA. The San
> Francisco Chief operated over this old track thru
> these neighborhoods. Amazing, huh ?

Blowing the picture up bigger than it will go, the track actually looks pretty darn good. Seems nice and level, I don't see any of the usualy dips and bumps typical of lousy track, and I don't see any 'floating' spikes. It looks like that might be street-running track back a block or so, I can't tell for sure.

What strikes me about the image, and strikes me of many similar city images of more than 40 years or so ago, is the sheer amount of what looks like *trash* along the ROW. I don't know if it was just an artifact of B&W photos, or if it really was trash. Having lived in a somewhat-country area in that era, I can say from memory that the sides of the roads were lined with blowing paper bags, hamburger wrappers, old coutches and matresses, and all manner of ugly trash. So I suspect that stuff that looks like trash in the image probably mostly really is trash.

I'm certainly not a fan of LBJ and his Great Society ("Let's all stop making things and become garbage collectors instead"), but I will say that it did have the effect of cleaaning up the sides of the roads. It's just a shame it also got us out of the business of making things.



Date: 10/09/11 10:47
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: railstiesballast

The Oakland Extension hosted troop trains during the 1960s, "rainbow" consists from all over the country.

The anti-war protesters tried to block the tracks and it was a zoo to try and see them, but the deadhead returns were non-events; I got a chance to see color schemes never otherwise around California.

The FBI accused the protesters of spying and having secret information because they knew when to expect the trains. It was too simple: like-minded people living in Bakersfield and Fresno just made a phone call when they saw a troop train. Maybe the FBI was unaware that a stainless steel train was normal and a train of PRR, ACL, IC, NYC, etc. cars was not.



Date: 10/09/11 11:13
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: kurtarmbruster

Very interesting views! What is the PA-powered train in El Cerrito--a Bay Area section of the Grand Canyon, maybe? Thanks, Ken. Kurt.



Date: 10/09/11 12:40
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: SierraRail

What year was the Santa Fe track through Berkeley removed?



Date: 10/09/11 12:42
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: stash

Final train in May 1979. Track removed later that year as I recall.


SierraRail Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What year was the Santa Fe track through Berkeley
> removed?



Date: 10/09/11 12:44
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: stash

Subsequent to the depot closing it was the Santa Fe Bar & Grill. Southwestern cuisine. Now a school.


DavidP Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is Berkeley depot the one that housed a Mexican
> restaurant in the 1980s? What's it used for now?
>
> Dave



Date: 10/09/11 12:46
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: stash

I believe that is The Scout, train 2. Eventually that number would apply to the new San Francisco Chief.

The signal (number 32) was the western end of ABS on the Oakland District, the territory between Richmond and about Conlon Ave. in El Cerrito. El Cerrito itself was at MP 4.5 but originally used the name Dwight.

All the buildings along side the railroad except one were demolished for redevelopment in the 1980s. The final building, hard to see on the photo (Apex), was just recently knocked down. BART el trackage was constructed next to the Santa Fe in the late 1960s. Their El Cerrito Del Norte station would occupy the background of this photo today. Albany Hill is the one thing in the landscape that has not changed.


kurtarmbruster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Very interesting views! What is the PA-powered
> train in El Cerrito--a Bay Area section of the
> Grand Canyon, maybe? Thanks, Ken. Kurt.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 12:54 by stash.



Date: 10/09/11 12:57
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: stash

Photo 1 is an eastbound train stopping at Berkeley. MP 8.0.

Photo 2 is at Brighton Ave. in Albany. The building between the engine and gondola is on Brighton. Hill Lumber Co. was located there and was switched until the end of service in 1979. All the homes to the left of the engine were demolished for the BART elevated track in the late 1960s (BART's Richmond line). Today the Oakland District right of way is a trail in Albany and El Cerrito and part of Richmond.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 12:58 by stash.



Date: 10/09/11 13:35
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: stash

That location is at Carlson Blvd. in Richmond which was crossed by another bridge just to the left of this photo. The train is westbound (Richmond to Oakland), but geographically running eastward. This was the steepest grade on the district and the helper could possibly we cut off west of the bridge to return to Richmond.


KeyRouteKen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Or maybe you guys would prefer somethking like a
> "double-headed PFE train" on the Santa Fe,
> crossing over the Southern Pacific mainline.
> Check out that impressive 'pole line' .
> Location ?? Evan Werkema will probably tell us.
>
> Photo courtesy of John Illman.
>
> KRK



Date: 10/09/11 14:01
Re: Santa Fe "Oakland Extension" re-visited
Author: zephyrus

Neat pictures, Ken. Always enjoy seeing the Santa Fe and the Oakland "branch" strikes me as one of their more obscure urban operations.

Thanks!

Z



Date: 10/09/11 14:19
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: timz2

What's the photographer standing on for pic #2?

Last pic looks like an eastward train on
the SFe main line crossing over the SP--
i.e. on the bridge that's still there.
SP milepost 16 and the one-mile board
for Richmond just past the overpass.



Date: 10/09/11 14:49
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: mundo

The heavyweight train should be north section of 24. Connecting train to train 2, was not numbered train 2, and should all be well before the Scout which was train 1-2 prior to the San Francisco Chief.



Date: 10/09/11 16:11
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: stash

23rd & Broadway & Carlson view likely from the Santa Fe bridge. Santa Fe had two bridges: one over 23rd Street and the other above the SP and Carslon Blvd.
Looking left would be eastbound on the SP. Richmond depot is about a half mile from this location. Note SP pole line on the geographic west side of their tracks.

The Santa Fe bridges and fill were removed in the 1980s to rebuild this major intersection and eliminate the street crossing with SP. 23rd St. dips under the railroad, now UP.

Credit Richmond Public Library for the old photo. Two years before this pic, it was vacant land by that car dealership.



timz2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What's the photographer standing on for pic #2?
>
> Last pic looks like an eastward train on
> the SFe main line crossing over the SP--
> i.e. on the bridge that's still there.
> SP milepost 16 and the one-mile board
> for Richmond just past the overpass.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 16:12 by stash.




Date: 10/09/11 16:24
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: timz2

You seem to be saying the doubleheaded
freight is going compass-east on the
SFe Oakland Dist-- in which case the
SP would be crossing beneath it from
1:30 to 7:30 o'clock, relative to the
SFe train. I'm saying the SFe freight
is headed compass-NNE on the main line
with the SP passing beneath from its
10:30 to its 4:30, a mile northwest
of the SP Richmond depot.

In other words, in the pic the 45-degree
angle between the tracks is in the wrong
place to be the Oakland District. We're
agreed the camera is looking sort of
compass-southeast down the SP; if this were
the Oakland Distr bridge then we'd be
looking at a rear-3/4 view of the SFe
train as it headed compass-east.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 16:30 by timz2.



Date: 10/09/11 16:40
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: Out_Of_Service

timz2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You seem to be saying the doubleheaded
> freight is going compass-east on the
> SFe Oakland Dist-- in which case the
> SP would be crossing beneath it from
> 1:30 to 7:30 o'clock, relative to the
> SFe train. I'm saying the SFe freight
> is headed compass-NNE on the main line
> with the SP passing beneath from its
> 10:30 to its 4:30, a mile northwest
> of the SP Richmond depot.
>
> In other words, in the pic the 45-degree
> angle between the tracks is in the wrong
> place to be the Oakland District. We're
> agreed the camera is looking sort of
> compass-southeast down the SP; if this were
> the Oakland Distr bridge then we'd be
> looking at a rear-3/4 view of the SFe
> train as it headed compass-east.

Santa Fe due east ... SP se-nw direction




Date: 10/09/11 16:41
Re: SFe Oakland Dist
Author: stash

Good observations. Upon closer study this appears to be the Santa Fe flyover east of the Richmond depot near the Chesley wye on the SP (now used by RPRC). Not the Oakland District at all; the bridge is too short. What do you think?


timz2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You seem to be saying the doubleheaded
> freight is going compass-east on the
> SFe Oakland Dist-- in which case the
> SP would be crossing beneath it from
> 1:30 to 7:30 o'clock, relative to the
> SFe train. I'm saying the SFe freight
> is headed compass-NNE on the main line
> with the SP passing beneath from its
> 10:30 to its 4:30, a mile northwest
> of the SP Richmond depot.
>
> In other words, in the pic the 45-degree
> angle between the tracks is in the wrong
> place to be the Oakland District. We're
> agreed the camera is looking sort of
> compass-southeast down the SP; if this were
> the Oakland Distr bridge then we'd be
> looking at a rear-3/4 view of the SFe
> train as it headed compass-east.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/11 16:42 by stash.



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