Canadian Railroads > Coal Dust Containment on CP?

There is a case before the US Surface Transportation Board concerning the BNSF's attempt to charge a fee to apply a dust containment chemical to coal loads (and the resistance to paying the fee from the shippers).

This dust containment is motivated by the past history of coal dust contaminating track ballast and causing water to be trapped in the roadbed, causing premature failure of concrete ties, a well documented engineering problem.

I thought I had heard that this problem also arose on CP or CN lines and was resolved with a sharing of costs between the RR and the shipper. Can any Canadian TO members correct or refine this vague idea of mine?

Thanks In Advance

A graphic demonstration of why:

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2114678,2115555#msg-2115555

Bill Miller
Galt, ON

The mines in south-eastern British Columbia spray the coal loads with a water-latex mix and they are re-sprayed while climbing Notch Hill west of Salmon Arm BC.

There have been various law suits regarding coal dust from communities along the route from the mines to Roberts Bank.

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Living near the mainline in Chase, BC it is not the loads that are the issue as most are resprayed at Carlin but the m/t's that are shedding a significant amount of dust on the return trip.
Bob

Who pays for the sprayer operation and maintenance at Carlin, BC.,
the shipper or the railroad?
Sid.

Wow, a spray-in-motion facility on the main track. Thanks for sharing.

This raises a number of questions:

1. Does that facility have clearance for domestic double stacks and dome cars? Or does such traffic have to use the steeper original track?

2. How fast can coal trains pass through the spray-in-motion facility? Track speed? I realize they aren't making great speed on the Notch Hill grade, anyway. (Which is perhaps why they located it there.)

3. When the weather is bad (e.g., rain, snow, high wind), how is the quality of the latex coating affected?

4. Coating the empty cars sounds like a great idea. Perhaps they could put in another facility for trains leaving Roberts Bank?

5. Are CN coal trains coated this way, too? Does CN also do this on the main line somewhere?

Thanks in advance,

Rob L.

Most westbounds use this track. Associated equipment is a lunar white flashing signal which indicates the coal spray system is operative and prepared to spay the train. It is automatic, however the RTC (train dispatcher) has to activate the system. Speed through the sprayer is 10 mph (average speed for a coal load is 12-13 mph at this location).An automated radio "talker" notifies the train when the spray process is complete. An electric eye shuts off the spay between cars. I'm not sure how the system knows not to spray mid train remotes. Possibly this is another RTC controlled function.

I don't know who pays for the re-spray. As the initial spray is right beyond the loading silo, I suspect the mine handles the first application.

The run-off is contained.

eminence_grise Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The mines in south-eastern British Columbia spray
> the coal loads with a water-latex mix and they are
> re-sprayed while climbing Notch Hill west of
> Salmon Arm BC.
>
>

A bit like how we glue down our ballast in modeling form?

Rick

The spraying at the mine took place starting in the 1970's, the re spraying started in the 1990's.

The Carlin Road re spray takes place 300 miles into the journey. It was found that the initial coating has ceased to be effective by this point in the journey. The biggest factor contributing to this was the forced air ventilation system used in the MacDonald tunnel in Rogers Pass.

Here's a video of CP's Notch Hill system in action:

http://www.rail-videos.net/video/view.php?id=2678

Very slick how the spray is timed to not spray between cars. I suspect not spraying the power is a function of the aforementioned electric eye and an AEI reading ahead of the sprayer.

Doug Stark

That is a truly Genius invention, someone really deserves credit for that.

I have been wondering how this system works in the cold weather.
It would seem to me that the first spray would freeze, just like
a blanket, and the second spraying would not be necessary?
Just a thought.
Sid.

Thank you, gentlemen.