European Railroad Discussion > Isle of Man Horse Trams to End Service

Very sad news from the Isle of Man. According to BBC News, The Douglas Horse Trams which have been in operation for 145 years will no longer operate because the city of Douglas Council says they are "no longer financially viable." What's next, the Manx Electric or Steam Railway? Happy I got to ride and photograph this unique system on two occasions before it's demise. Last runs were last September with no announcement of pending closure. Maybe the horses are happy though. 

From the Douglas Horse Tram Website

http://www.douglashorsetramway.net/

Even in the MERS newsletter the discontinuation of the Horse Tram has been kicked around for almost as long as there has been a horse tram. It was a great thing while it lasted. At least I got to ride it once during my visit to Isle of Man.

Jim

A real shame.  Are they forgetting the Tourist $$$$$$$ that keeps the town going.?

mundo Wrote:
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> A real shame.  Are they forgetting the Tourist
> $$$$$$$ that keeps the town going.?

Except of course they are not $$$$$$ but £££££££ and €€€€€€€!

Much more to the point is what do they mean by financially viable? Is this the only reason for anything exisiting? Heaven help us if it is!

Anyone have a clue on what kind of sums are we talking about? Any chance of transferring this operation to local railhorsefans?

McKey Wrote:
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> Anyone have a clue on what kind of sums are we
> talking about? Any chance of transferring this
> operation to local railhorsefans?

Great idea!
I've never met one before but I'm sure they must exist.

Railhorsefans of the world unite! You've got nothing to lose but your reins!

Iihaaa....  ;D

But seriously, what is the minimum sum to run the operation occasionally? Somehow this sounds like an idea to discuss a bargain with someone that might wish to financiate operation further. Winter is safely several Months away from the hot tourist season...? 

 

I was actually serious about it being a good idea!
I cannot believe the costs are so huge that it cannot be made operational with the right enthusiast support, which I why I am so cynical about the "financial viability" issue. I suspect the closure plan may be a device to flush out other sources of support, in which case a bit of honesty might be welcome.

Sounds logical.

Just think how many old time railroads around the World are run with railfan power! Why would it not work here too?

spflow Wrote:
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> I suspect the closure plan may be a device to flush out
> other sources of support, in which case a bit of
> honesty might be welcome.

The Great Laxey Mine Railway and the Groudle Glen Railway are both volunteer efforts.

http://www.laxeyminerailway.im/

http://www.ggr.org.uk/

Both are good operations and quite worth seeing and riding.

I would think there would be enough interest to at least operate the Horse Tram on the weekends. The Horse Tram is just another one of those things that makes Isle Of Man special.

Jim

The horse trams only operated May-September in recent years. Another issue not mentioned is they want the tracks out of the roadway. Traffic is heavier than in past years and the powers that be think it's an accident waiting to happen. There was a proposal to relay the entire ROW along the beach side of the roadway but nothing ever came of it. I fear this is only the beginning. The Manx Electric parallels a road almost the entire way. And as I recall, only one of the level crossings are protected by signals. No gates anyplace. The route can be driven in much less time. Will that be next? Ride while you can. 

andersonb109 Wrote:
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Another issue not mentioned is they
> want the tracks out of the roadway. Traffic is
> heavier than in past years and the powers that be
> think it's an accident waiting to happen. There
> was a proposal to relay the entire ROW along the
> beach side of the roadway but nothing ever came of
> it.

Sadly this confirms my suspicions that the so-called "financial viability" assessment is very two-dimensional. How do they value the benefits of a unique operation and set them against the costs of an accident or more traffic congestion? The actual cash sums are probably quite trivial but the external costs and benefits would seem to be massive. At the very least someone in the IoM highways dept should spell out some facts so that public judgemnts can be made.
 

Is there any public fund that could support the possibly needed changes? I believe U.K. has many excellent museums, and money to create those must have come from somewhere else than ticket income or local public authorities.

I don't know a lot about IOM government. But from what I do know, it is almost like a separate country. They have their own currency (although Sterling is accepted). And their own legislature. And different tax laws that make it a shelter for corporations. They also have their own flag and it's logo is on everything including all the railway equipment. So that could possibly affect the ability to obtain some sort of heritage funds from the main U.K. government?  I'll try to find out more when I'm there in April for a charter on the Steam Railway and post any findings.

Oh, I did not realize they were partly autonomic, and funds maybe harder to find because of that.

Hopefully things will clear out and horse drawn trains run again.

McKey Wrote:
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> Oh, I did not realize they were partly autonomic,
> and funds maybe harder to find because of that.
>
> Hopefully things will clear out and horse drawn
> trains run again.

The IoM is a self governing Crown Dependency of the UK, which essentially means it controls domestic policy, including finance, whilst foreign policy is in the hands of the UK government. The IoM is not a member of the EU, which is where much of the funding for projects such as the Welsh Highland Railway came from.

There is now a petition against eliminating the Horse Tram. It is tacked onto the official website for the Horse Tram so I feel it is legit and will be considered. 

Official Horse Tram website. 
http://www.douglashorsetramway.net/

Petition 
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/douglas-horse-tramway-to-be-scrapped-manx

That Jim Bainter guy from Cincinnati United States is me!

Jim