Railroaders' Nostalgia > S.P.'s San Joaquin Bkmn X Brd

I was going to add this to tehachcond's close call, but it doesn't have to do with a close call but my time on working on S.P.'s San Joaquin Brakeman's extra board out of Los Angeles.

I did my Junior year at Cal Poly San Luis Obispo working the "Valley" brakeman’s extra board. As Brian noted, it was a scennie board where the oldest man would go first out on his rest. Being a “pup” there were many weeks I would not even have to lay off during the week, but I would seem to always get out on the weekend. More than once I had to drive like a bat-out-hell to make it from Glendale for Monday AM classes at S.L.O.

My best call would be for 51 Saturday AM. I think I was the senior man on the brakeman's board with a uniform on my ticket. With hardly anyone on the train I could do my homework in the Automat. With 57/58 [The Owl] off the card, we would have a long layover in Fresno which with nothing to do, [other than watch trains], I would set in my room at the Fresno Hotel and hit the books. It didn’t pay much but the year I protected the San Joaquin extra board I got the best grades of my collage experience.

For years, in the Spring the Pacific Railroad Society would run "Wild Flower Specials" round trips from L.A. to Bakersfield. Being 1st out for passenger brake jobs, I was able to sharp-shoot into the crews for a number of this trips. In 1970 the crew dispatcher called and said something like: "Bray is your uniform clean?, . . . then you're called for second 51 on duty seven, with Conductor, well we are still looking for a Conductor." About 30 minutes later, the phone rings again and it's the crew dispatcher again: "Bray you have worked a lot of passenger, do you think you could handle the conductor job on that second 51? Well I had passed my conductor exam just a month before, but had never been used as a Conductor on freight well enough in passenger seervice. I told the crew dispatch that I didn't have a punch or any ticket stock. He said this was a special and I wouldn't have to cut any cash fares and for a punch, he said they didn't care if I just use a dime store hole punch. When the company issued the "Jewelry" for your uniform they included both the silver Brakeman's buttons and hat badge, and the gold Conductor's buttons and hat badge. I quickly change all to reflect my "battle-field" promotion. And, yes I was really excited. I had a number of my model railroad club buddies that were riding the train and I couldn't wait to see their faces when they saw who was the train's Conductor.

So my "cherry" conductor trip had 9 units and 22 cars with something like 500 passengers! Gary McClain captured a shot me talking to some Carmen at BKF on this trip. John Signor included the snap in his "Tehachapi" on Page 203.

Pat

I wish there was a LIKE button

John Gezelius
Tustin, CA

Thanks for sharing the story Pat. I rode several of those Wildflower specials over the years. You were probably on some of them. Of course that was quite a few years before I hired out myself on the SP. Those were fun trips.

Ray

john1082 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wish there was a LIKE button


Here you go John......

V

SLOCONDR

---

Those trips were called the "Mountin Outin" and I rode them all from 1966-1970.
I was on the train on your first Conductor trip and it was a blast as always.
I remember meeting a really nice Trainman named Roger on one of those trips.
TAH

Cabhop Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was going to add this to tehachcond's close
> call, but it doesn't have to do with a close call
> but my time on working on S.P.'s San Joaquin
> Brakeman's extra board out of Los Angeles.
>
> I did my Junior year at Cal Poly San Luis Obispo
> working the "Valley" brakeman’s extra board. As
> Brian noted, it was a scennie board where the
> oldest man would go first out on his rest. Being
> a “pup” there were many weeks I would not even
> have to lay off during the week, but I would seem
> to always get out on the weekend. More than once
> I had to drive like a bat-out-hell to make it from
> Glendale for Monday AM classes at S.L.O.
>
> My best call would be for 51 Saturday AM. I think
> I was the senior man on the brakeman's board with
> a uniform on my ticket. With hardly anyone on the
> train I could do my homework in the Automat. With
> 57/58 off the card, we would have a long layover
> in Fresno which with nothing to do, , I would set
> in my room at the Fresno Hotel and hit the books.
> It didn’t pay much but the year I protected the
> San Joaquin extra board I got the best grades of
> my collage experience.
>
> For years, in the Spring the Pacific Railroad
> Society would run "Wild Flower Specials" round
> trips from L.A. to Bakersfield. Being 1st out for
> passenger brake jobs, I was able to sharp-shoot
> into the crews for a number of this trips. In 1970
> the crew dispatcher called and said something
> like: "Bray is your uniform clean?, . . . then
> you're called for second 51 on duty seven, with
> Conductor, well we are still looking for a
> Conductor." About 30 minutes later, the phone
> rings again and it's the crew dispatcher again:
> "Bray you have worked a lot of passenger, do you
> think you could handle the conductor job on that
> second 51? Well I had passed my conductor exam
> just a month before, but had never been used as a
> Conductor on freight well enough in passenger
> seervice. I told the crew dispatch that I didn't
> have a punch or any ticket stock. He said this
> was a special and I wouldn't have to cut any cash
> fares and for a punch, he said they didn't care if
> I just use a dime store hole punch. When the
> company issued the "Jewelry" for your uniform they
> included both the silver Brakeman's buttons and
> hat badge, and the gold Conductor's buttons and
> hat badge. I quickly change all to reflect my
> "battle-field" promotion. And, yes I was really
> excited. I had a number of my model railroad club
> buddies that were riding the train and I couldn't
> wait to see their faces when they saw who was the
> train's Conductor.
>
> So my "cherry" conductor trip had 9 units and 22
> cars with something like 500 passengers! Gary
> McClain captured a shot me talking to some Carmen
> at BKF on this trip. John Signor included the snap
> in his "Tehachapi" on Page 203.
>
> Pat


That picture was from April, 1971

I'm surprised you worked passenger that early in your career. My limited experience with the SJ Daylight (as a passenger, as this was prior to my SP employment) was that the train crew appeared to be guys far along in years. As example, the brakeman alongside you in the photo looks older. But then I only saw the west end of its run.

Westbound Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm surprised you worked passenger that early in
> your career. My limited experience with the SJ
> Daylight (as a passenger, as this was prior to my
> SP employment) was that the train crew appeared to
> be guys far along in years. As example, the
> brakeman alongside you in the photo looks older.
> But then I only saw the west end of its run.

I think the fact that he had a Passenger uniform was the reason he got to work passenger with so little seniority.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the fact that he had a Passenger uniform
> was the reason he got to work passenger with so
> little seniority.

I've heard the same thing from a one-time SP brakeman who later went to the Santa Fe.

John Gezelius
Tustin, CA

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Westbound Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm surprised you worked passenger that early
> in
> > your career. My limited experience with the SJ
> > Daylight (as a passenger, as this was prior to
> my
> > SP employment) was that the train crew appeared
> to
> > be guys far along in years. As example, the
> > brakeman alongside you in the photo looks
> older.
> > But then I only saw the west end of its run.
>
> I think the fact that he had a Passenger uniform
> was the reason he got to work passenger with so
> little seniority.


That's correct. If a brakeman with hardly any seniority had a uniform and the company needed a Pass. brakeman (or Conductor, if qualified) and none were available on the Passenger X board, they would then reach over to the Brakemen's freight X board and call someone from there with a uniform. This held true with TBM service also. I remember in the early 70's that the regular TBM guy had to layoff on weekends to care for his wife and invariably I got called for his position, which was great for me as the TBM person came out of Los Angeles and got off at Santa Barbara, then had about a 4 hour wait for #98, and I would usually take my wife with me and we'd have lunch and then return on #98 to L.A.


V

SLOOCNDR

SLOCONDR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Westbound Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I'm surprised you worked passenger that early
> > in
> > > your career. My limited experience with the
> SJ
> > > Daylight (as a passenger, as this was prior
> to
> > my
> > > SP employment) was that the train crew
> appeared
> > to
> > > be guys far along in years. As example, the
> > > brakeman alongside you in the photo looks
> > older.
> > > But then I only saw the west end of its run.
> >
> > I think the fact that he had a Passenger
> uniform
> > was the reason he got to work passenger with so
> > little seniority.
>
>
> That's correct. If a brakeman with hardly any
> seniority had a uniform and the company needed a
> Pass. brakeman (or Conductor, if qualified) and
> none were available on the Passenger X board,
> they would then reach over to the Brakemen's
> freight X board and call someone from there with a
> uniform. This held true with TBM service also. I
> remember in the early 70's that the regular TBM
> guy had to layoff on weekends to care for his wife
> and invariably I got called for his position,
> which was great for me as the TBM person came out
> of Los Angeles and got off at Santa Barbara, then
> had about a 4 hour wait for #98, and I would
> usually take my wife with me and we'd have lunch
> and then return on #98 to L.A.
>
>
> V
>
> SLOOCNDR


Hope it wasn't lunch in the automat, V?

WAF Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLOCONDR Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > PHall Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Westbound Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > I'm surprised you worked passenger that
> early
> > > in
> > > > your career. My limited experience with the
> > SJ
> > > > Daylight (as a passenger, as this was prior
> > to
> > > my
> > > > SP employment) was that the train crew
> > appeared
> > > to
> > > > be guys far along in years. As example, the
> > > > brakeman alongside you in the photo looks
> > > older.
> > > > But then I only saw the west end of its
> run.
> > >
> > > I think the fact that he had a Passenger
> > uniform
> > > was the reason he got to work passenger with
> so
> > > little seniority.
> >
> >
> > That's correct. If a brakeman with hardly any
> > seniority had a uniform and the company needed
> a
> > Pass. brakeman (or Conductor, if qualified) and
> > none were available on the Passenger X board,
> > they would then reach over to the Brakemen's
> > freight X board and call someone from there with
> a
> > uniform. This held true with TBM service also.
> I
> > remember in the early 70's that the regular TBM
> > guy had to layoff on weekends to care for his
> wife
> > and invariably I got called for his position,
> > which was great for me as the TBM person came
> out
> > of Los Angeles and got off at Santa Barbara,
> then
> > had about a 4 hour wait for #98, and I would
> > usually take my wife with me and we'd have
> lunch
> > and then return on #98 to L.A.
> >
> >
> > V
> >
> > SLOOCNDR
>
>
> Hope it wasn't lunch in the automat, V?


LOL, Wes... No, I sprung for a great lunch at the beach every time.


V

SLOCONDR

I'll have to see if I can find a couple of those photos. I remember getting a shot of you and Linda (Pat's wife) when we all got off the train for a run by (I don't remember the location).

Most of the trainmen in SLO, in the 60s had uniforms. They had all the commutes in the City to protect when they started out. When they had enough whiskers to hold SLO, down they came to live. They did have a "Penalty Box" in SLO. If you were called for passenger and didn't have a uniform, they held you in the box for 24 hours. When the trainmen were allowed to go anywhere on a bid, we got a lot of guys that never had a set of Blue Surge hanging around to wear. Some traded uniforms with others so the didn't miss a trip. That made for pretty wild fitting outfits.

Last I heard, a store in the City was the only place you could purchase a SP uniform, vest, hat, buttons and hat titles. When Atk came along, SP guys were still holding down those runs with an SP uniform for quite a few years. I don't remember when ATK got their own trainmen and wore different outfits.

I worked the last "Flower Special" from SBA to Surf and return on May 16, 1971. We had the 6458-8122-8109 & 6454. Wright Baker was the Hoghead, I was the Fireman, and we had Jivy Jack as the head brakemen, Ken Cockrell, rear man and C Krueger as the Big O. Went to work at 9:55 AM in SBA and tied up in SBA at 7:06 PM. I made all of $63.56 that day and that included a deadhead from SBA back to SLO.


Nudge

spnudge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't remember
> when ATK got their own trainmen and wore different
> outfits.
> Nudge


We were wearing the AMTK uniforms BEFORE AMTK had their own trainmen, Nudge. It was several years later the guys were forced to return to their original road, or stay with AMTK.


V

SLOCONDR

spnudge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most of the trainmen in SLO, in the 60s had
> uniforms. They had all the commutes in the City to
> protect when they started out. When they had
> enough whiskers to hold SLO, down they came to
> live. They did have a "Penalty Box" in SLO. If you
> were called for passenger and didn't have a
> uniform, they held you in the box for 24 hours.
> When the trainmen were allowed to go anywhere on a
> bid, we got a lot of guys that never had a set of
> Blue Surge hanging around to wear. Some traded
> uniforms with others so the didn't miss a trip.
> That made for pretty wild fitting outfits.
>
> Last I heard, a store in the City was the only
> place you could purchase a SP uniform, vest, hat,
> buttons and hat titles. When Atk came along, SP
> guys were still holding down those runs with an SP
> uniform for quite a few years. I don't remember
> when ATK got their own trainmen and wore different
> outfits.
>
> I worked the last "Flower Special" from SBA to
> Surf and return on May 16, 1971. We had the
> 6458-8122-8109 & 6454. Wright Baker was the
> Hoghead, I was the Fireman, and we had Jivy Jack
> as the head brakemen, Ken Cockrell, rear man and C
> Krueger as the Big O. Went to work at 9:55 AM in
> SBA and tied up in SBA at 7:06 PM. I made all of
> $63.56 that day and that included a deadhead from
> SBA back to SLO.
>
>
> Nudge


Nudge, 1973 was the last PRS Flower Train

SLOCONDR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> spnudge Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I don't remember
> > when ATK got their own trainmen and wore
> different
> > outfits.
> > Nudge
>
>
> We were wearing the AMTK uniforms BEFORE AMTK had
> their own trainmen, Nudge. It was several years
> later the guys were forced to return to their
> original road, or stay with AMTK.
>
>
> V
>
> SLOCONDR


Amtrak uniforms for trainmen appeared in 1974 and of course, Amtrak hired their own crews in 1987

I've got some movie footage of JP working the American Freedom Train.

A shot with him on the rear platform at Chatsworth on the way to SBA and a shot of getting off the 49 in Indio.

WAF Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SLOCONDR Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > spnudge Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I don't remember
> > > when ATK got their own trainmen and wore
> > different
> > > outfits.
> > > Nudge
> >
> >
> > We were wearing the AMTK uniforms BEFORE AMTK
> had
> > their own trainmen, Nudge. It was several years
> > later the guys were forced to return to their
> > original road, or stay with AMTK.
> >
> >
> > V
> >
> > SLOCONDR
>
>
> Amtrak uniforms for trainmen appeared in 1974 and
> of course, Amtrak hired their own crews in 1987


Thanks Wes.

V

SLOCONDR

Gee, Pat, up in SF you had to qualify as a passenger conductor by going down to the SF stationmaster's office to check out assorted gold accessories, along with a punch, ticket stock, etc., BEFORE, repeat BEFORE, your tag was amended (except in extra-special emergencies, which couldn't have been more than half of the time). You guys down in the Valley certainly had a loosey-goosey way of doing things...

A related story: Many of you will recall the infamous young San Jose switchman who got drunk, swiped the depot goat and headed east, eventually rear-ending Tommy Moran's caboose near Lick (as I understand the details).

After he got back to work (different times, eh?), I one day spotted him making a quick exit out of the Bayshore yard office with a red-faced Jim Bays (the beloved-by-most-except-W.M.-Jones terminal superintendent) nipping at his heals. All that I witnessed was Jim shouting "...and don't ever let that happen again!"

Turns out that the guy (who would rather have gone sober than work passenger) got a call for a Commute conductor job from a desperate crew clerk. The culprit tried to decline the call by stating that he was not "qualified", nor did he have a uniform. The crew clerk responded that this was OK, and otherwise he would turn him in for refusing call. So the guy reluctantly took the call (aware that he was always was on thin ice to start with), but never sold a ticket in the course of a double, two round trips. When Bays called him on the carpet, he supposedly explained that he was not qualified to sell tickets, and he took the call just to help out. His argument was quite thin, given what was involved in qualifying. I happened to catch the tail-end of The Bear's response.

Incidentally, SP uniforms survived until the mid-90's on the Peninsula. Caltrain's first uniforms were identical to the SP's, because the trainmen were allowed to vote on a uniform style. Since maybe 80% of them were ex-SP Commute guys, you can see how that happened. I lent my SP uniform to a Caltrain new hire (I had crossed to the right side of the cab, by then.), and he was thrilled to traipse through the cars dressed up like an old head. The uniform, in all of its moth-eaten, threadbare glory, still hangs in my closet, because no way am I going to dumpster this reminder of great times and (mostly) good people.


E.O. Gibson
The Dome O' Foam



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/22/14 16:11 by hogheaded.