Passenger Trains > TALGOS

Train #29 of today will have 5 more Amfleet 1 cars, (2 feeders and 3 coaches) arriving Chicago tomorrow then leaving on train #7 either tomorrow or Tuesday headed to Seattle.

I missed the story, what happened to the Talgos?

DE30AC Wrote:
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> I missed the story, what happened to the Talgos?


http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,1462526
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,1461455

Unconfirmed report that the cars are 82621, 82609, 82664, 43366, and 43363. Three coaches and two food service cars, enroute to Seattle on 29(05).

Meanwhile, at least one Metrolink trainset is being used this weekend for supplemental Del Mar Race service on the Surfliner route, partially making up for the spare (?) cars that were sent to Seattle Friday night.

So is this a second shuttle of cars from the East to the Pacific Northwest? NARP reported coaches being shuttled late last week. These are in addition? So the Pacific Northwest should have enough cars to replace the Talgo schedules, including the Superliner train set already in place between Vancouver, BC and Seattle. So to recap:

4 - Amfleets sent late last week from the East Coast
5 - Amfleets sent August 5th from the East Coast
10- Amfleets sent from LA to Seattle.
19 - TOTAL

Four Amfleet cars could substitute for one Talgo train set. So at least four train sets could be formed with some extras (3).

>recap:
>
> 4 - Amfleets sent late last week from the East
> Coast
> 5 - Amfleets sent August 5th from the East Coast
> 8- Amfleets sent from LA to Seattle.
> 2- Horizons sent from LA to Seattle.

> 19 - TOTAL

Present 2 sets are 4 coaches and one food service.

So is it safe to say, mundo, that they are likely to get only three train sets formed out of what equipment is being shuffled to the Pacific Northwest? I see that only one train is scheduled to operate between Eugene and Portland, and the Bellingham train will not be operating.

Kudos to Amtrak in getting the equipment shuffled. I will give them that!

Boy, the crews will have fun with them. Have they been trained on them. Some interesting situations might be on hand for them. Each type of car requires some training. I don't beleive that to many of their crews have been trained on Amfleet equipment. Wheel chair lifts ect. Like I said, each car is different. We use to have a crew member working special service to train crews as they were on boaed when we have new equipment on Caltrain.

jp1822 Wrote:
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> Kudos to Amtrak in getting the equipment shuffled.
> I will give them that!

Yes, and now them 70 Amfleets in storage need to get in the shower, cleaned, inspected, and sent out to service complete with a ribbon to ensure the Talgo loss is adequately covered without stretching thin the fleets around elsewhere.

NE933-II Wrote:
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> jp1822 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Kudos to Amtrak in getting the equipment
> shuffled.
> > I will give them that!
>
> Yes, and now them 70 Amfleets in storage need to
> get in the shower, cleaned, inspected, and sent
> out to service complete with a ribbon to ensure
> the Talgo loss is adequately covered without
> stretching thin the fleets around elsewhere.


Question is whether they are stored dead or stored serviceable... Stored Dead would require an overhaul, COT&S, inspections, repaint, new seats, etc.... The process would take roughly 60 days which is hopefully longer then the Talgos will be out of service.

If they are stored Serviceable then basic maintainace, COT&S, overhaul are done already and the cars could probably be reactivated with some minor mechanical work within a week. Amtrak obviously doesn't need all 70 so if they are serviceable then reactivating a handful (20) and putting them to use until the Talgos are back, then putting them back into storage is probably the best choice if Amtrak has to do anything. It's possible they already have enough cars active to cover the Cascades runs and don't need to do anything.

My info is that these 70 cars were stored in serviceable condition, but would require an inspection and routine maintenance to get them back on the road. Amtrak deemed them "surplus" and took them out of service to save money on routine inspections and maintenance etc. Essentially these are the three Clocker train sets (30 cars at least, plus an additional 40 Amfleets).

Most up here have worked on an amfleet or horizon equip. football trains, levenworth trains. turkey trains.The stuff isn't foreign

"Up here?" Does that mean you got 954 to Seattle?

Welcome back!


Pete

Pete.... Well blasted through your place yesterday with the amfleet stuff. We vaned home. Back on the Builder today.

jp1822 Wrote:
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> My info is that these 70 cars were stored in
> serviceable condition, but would require an
> inspection and routine maintenance to get them
> back on the road. Amtrak deemed them "surplus" and
> took them out of service to save money on routine
> inspections and maintenance etc. Essentially these
> are the three Clocker train sets (30 cars at
> least, plus an additional 40 Amfleets).


I hope they stored only the ones with the old red interiors. It would be stupid if they still have cars with the old interiors running while some of the more recently rebuilt ones are stored.

All the cars stored needed overhauls including trucks and inspections etc have lapsed.
The overhaul and brakework plus truck woirk would cost 200k to 300k per car.
They are not stored servicable by any means.

Jaap Wrote:
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> All the cars stored needed overhauls including
> trucks and inspections etc have lapsed.
> The overhaul and brakework plus truck woirk would
> cost 200k to 300k per car.
> They are not stored servicable by any means.

True, but isn't it also true that Amtrak let these overhauls and inspections lapse for the intended purpose of storing "X" amount of Amfleet cars as surplus. All these 70 cars were once in service and didn't just one night fall into unserviceable condition. I agree these Amfleets are not stored serviceable (however they are able to get a waiver to operate as an evac train in New Orleans if needed), as the Turboliners are not stored serviceable. But when the Amfleets were targeted for storage, Amtrak essentially did not touch these cars for maintenance or repairs so to speak. They key is that regular inspections and overhauls (trucks, brakes etc.) were not performed on these cars and as they lapsed, they went to storage. I don't want to start a Turboliner discussion, but its been reported that the Turboliners now have mold growing on the seats as they sit in storage. If Amtrak wants to put these cars in service, it's going to cost them more money right?

And no, not all the cars stored have the red interiors. The older red interiors can still be found in the Amtrak system. However, I would hope that Amtrak did its homework in selecting what cars would head to storage.

How much does it cost annually to maintain an Amfleet coach? The longer that it is in storage, the longer it has to fall further into disrepair - be it mechanical or pure vandalism. I remember seeing former Metroliner cab cars stored in Delaware with windows busted out and all. Now they got restored to run on the Keystone Corridor. Would Amtrak have to spend as much as the did to get these cars back in service if they had kept them in service? Or was it too expensive to try and keep them in some sort of service? It's a cost-benefit issue, and only Amtrak with the maintenance figures would be able to answer that question.

The other main thing that it is not like the 70 cars are in a wreck-repair condition - as many Superliners are at Beech Grove.

Kummant has said that if corridor development takes off, they would have to charge the states to either get new equipment or "overhaul" some of these 70 Amfleets that are in storage. And I am sure if the later is chosen, Amtrak will ensure the a "good price" is charged out. I'd rather see state corridors buy new equipment.

The 30 Amfleet cars that operated on the former Clocker trains simply entered a deadline in the Philadelphia 30th St. Station Coach Yard, before being transferred to storage. Perhaps some "better" cars were switched out, but they were part of the Amfleet pool operating on the NEC spine. I saw this movement with the Clocker coaches and then heard conductors plead that at least two of these former Amfleet Clocker coaches be added to Regional train #170, as it was getting severely overcrowded between Wilmington and NYP (peak period train for a.m. traffic to the Big Apple). Before monthly passes took a steep fare hike, train #170 handled a lot of monthly pass holders, and still does for the most part. This is only one of few Regional trains on the NEC that I book business class - as it can be standing room only in coach due to non-tracking of monthly pass holders commute patterns (i.e. reservation system shows space available, when in fact the train is filled with monthly pass holders). Been there and done that!

How the cost would be spread is of no importance but 70 cars at average of $$250k is still 18 million that Amtrak does not have. complain to your legislatiors on the why not issue.

As for the Turboliners they are history and will never run again.
as long as they sit in Bear and slowly get to state of impossible to repair they head for scrap line.
If anyone tried to put these trains back in service New York State would sue Amtrak for cost of supersteel contract.
Amtrak don't want them but with the NYS money invested in them they can never sell them to anyone but NYS.
If NYS bought them who would operate them ?? not MNCR, not LIRR , nobody wants fuel guzzlers with fixed 5 car consist and minimal seating, plus requirement for extra crew member in form of technisian.

There is a report at another topic that the earliest date to return Talgos to service is Sep 15.

I can only hope that date is realistic and is adhered to; if such be the case, then I believe Amtrak can escape from this predicament without permanent damage. The continued commercial success of the Acelas is indicative of that.

BTW Mr. Jaap, in view of your railroad and maritime Mechanical backgrounds before moving to Engine service, have you a believable estimate for the cost of the required COTS inspections if Amtrak were to have pulled cars from storage to cover this temporary shortfall?