Passenger Trains > And so it begins - Amtrak closes off platform access fr

Armed Amtrak police guards and armed uniformed military personnel posted on the LIRR level turning away any passengers attempting to use the lower concourse to board Amtrak trains.

I'm sure the Boston Massacre is being used as an excuse for this latest bit of security theatrics.

No security whatsoever at intermediate stops of course, demonstrating that all the hassle is just for show.

Please don't tell me to be thankful I am not being xrayed, groped, and strip searched yet.

Be thankful you're not being xrayed, groped, and strip searched.

Oops. My bad.

Once again, "Homeland Security" and affiliated forces are putting on an act which amounts to
closing the barn door after the horses have escaped.

It is done in the interest of "making it look like we're doing something."

Posturing. Play-acting.

This includes the President.

Amtrak's policy of hoarding/herding enhances the possibility of inflated fatalities should a bombing occur.

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Amtrak's policy of hoarding/herding enhances the
> possibility of inflated fatalities should a
> bombing occur.

But they won;t figure it out until an unfortunate mishap takes place.

Usually the unsafest place is the line leading to the security area, unless it is itself carefully secured.

Many more people have been AND (not very bold prediction given the neighborhood) WILL BE killed, raped, robbed, etc. at Amtrak's North Philadelphia station, where I board many mornings, and where there is no police or security presence whatsoever, than have ever been harmed at PSNY, where there is ten zillion times the police presence and still a million ways to foil the Keystone Kops act. That ratio of harm to policing at those two sites should tell you everything you need to know.

Had I been malicious, I would have simply walked across the concourse and walked quickly down the unguarded up escalator to the LIRR level. Had I been really malicious, I would have boarded at New Rochelle.

Unfortunately, the situation and response is hopeless, but not serious.

abyler Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Armed Amtrak police guards and armed uniformed
> military personnel posted on the LIRR level
> turning away any passengers attempting to use the
> lower concourse to board Amtrak trains.

I'm not sure if I understand what was happening here. Were the cops preventing you from using the LIRR platforms as a shortcut to get to the Amtrak platforms?

stevedavis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> abyler Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Armed Amtrak police guards and armed uniformed
> > military personnel posted on the LIRR level
> > turning away any passengers attempting to use
> the
> > lower concourse to board Amtrak trains.
>
> I'm not sure if I understand what was happening
> here. Were the cops preventing you from using the
> LIRR platforms as a shortcut to get to the Amtrak
> platforms?

A very large and tall policeman and a solider(!) stood at the top of the LIRR concourse platform steps and denied entry to anyone who attempted to board the train stated on the downstairs departure board to be boarding at that gate. I'm 6'-2" and 200 lbs, and they both were much larger than me. No screwing around with little 5'-2" women police officers here!

Presumably, they were not smart enough to close off the NJT concourse gate yet. Maybe I will try that tomorrow.

So they were preventing Amtrak passengers from boarding Amtrak trains through the gate that Amtrak told the passengers to board through? How did they expect Amtrak passengers to board?

The Boston bomb was at the finish line, not at some non-descript place along the route. I'd assume it went off late since more people were there an hour prior.

As for these Amtrak Keystone Kops, a terrorist need only wait for a legitimate LIRR train on Track 13/14 to leave his "belongings" and thereby affect Amtrak & NJT after rush hour when using those tracks.

This is why they want to move to the Post Office: play line-up in a straight line at Ding-Dong School at their own gates.

GenePoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Once again, "Homeland Security" and affiliated
> forces are putting on an act which amounts to
> closing the barn door after the horses have
> escaped.
>
> It is done in the interest of "making it look like
> we're doing something."
>
> Posturing. Play-acting.
>
> This includes the President.

And if they didn't do this "play-acting" the majority of the public would roast them alive for not doing anything.

Human nature.

Z

What I can't understand is the security rationale. It isn't like they search you when you board at the Amtrak gates. Of course, I don't undertand the kindergarten walk in Chicago either where they have the Amtrak gates cordoned off and you have to use the cattle pen of a waiting room and can't just board from the corridor. Especially when Metra gates are completely wide open when a train is loading. Or LA, where you pretty much can go anywhere, any time.

When I see many cops roaming around individually I perceive them as doing something productive, especially with a German Shepherd walking his master.

When I saw 6 of them (with a dog) bull-$hitting near a token booth/subway entrance at GCT this morning, and none on the platform, I am not impressed.

stevedavis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So they were preventing Amtrak passengers from
> boarding Amtrak trains through the gate that
> Amtrak told the passengers to board through? How
> did they expect Amtrak passengers to board?


Not the case. Somebody is mad because their shortcut has been taken away. You can't really get mad because you're actually being made to board where you're supposed to. The shortcut is nice, but it was a convenient loophole, not a right. Get over it.

Thought homeland security was here to prevent what happened......"We're here from the Government to help"

I'd like to say a word or two in defense of the NY Army National Guard people who have been assigned to Penn Station NY, the Port Authority Bus Terminal, and other locations since September 12, 2001. These citizen soldiers have been told to perform police duties for 12 years.

I've spoken with a few of them over the years. They're from every part of NY, doing their call-up and training time at the bus station, etc.

If there's a need for expanded security presence during the 12 years, I think they should have police assigned to police jobs. Not soldiers.

The NG has a better lobby. Man-days = retirement points and points go towards promotions in an indirect way.

John Gezelius
Tustin, CA

john1082 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The NG has a better lobby. Man-days = retirement
> points and points go towards promotions in an
> indirect way.

It would figure the whole thing is a pension scam. i certainly don't see how having people trained as warriors and equipped with automatic weapons is going to do anything useful in a crowded train station. What are they gong to do? Spray the crowd with machine gun fire if a bomb goes off? If there is no real intention of using their heavy weaponry except to look scary, then it needs to be realized the real danger is some nut taking the weapons from them.

abyler Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> john1082 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The NG has a better lobby. Man-days =
> retirement
> > points and points go towards promotions in an
> > indirect way.
>
> It would figure the whole thing is a pension scam.
> i certainly don't see how having people trained
> as warriors and equipped with automatic weapons is
> going to do anything useful in a crowded train
> station. What are they gong to do? Spray the
> crowd with machine gun fire if a bomb goes off?
> If there is no real intention of using their heavy
> weaponry except to look scary, then it needs to be
> realized the real danger is some nut taking the
> weapons from them.

There's no danger in that. As I recall reading, those weapons are not loaded.......

1976 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> stevedavis Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > So they were preventing Amtrak passengers from
> > boarding Amtrak trains through the gate that
> > Amtrak told the passengers to board through?
> How
> > did they expect Amtrak passengers to board?
>
>
> Not the case. Somebody is mad because their
> shortcut has been taken away. You can't really
> get mad because you're actually being made to
> board where you're supposed to. The shortcut is
> nice, but it was a convenient loophole, not a
> right. Get over it.

Only in the land of the free. :)