Passenger Trains > Greenbrier Express Cars Sold, Some Cheap

The Greenbrier Express cars were sold Thursday for amounts ranging from $135,000 to just $10,500.

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/travel/275794171.html


Marty Bernard

The auction was a success and all 13 cars sold for an average price of $ 61,000.00 which is decent considering that 9 of the 13 were completely gutted inside. We who worked hard on the project were sad to see it end but happy that the cars have new owners who will give them the TLC they deserve.

One door closes and another opens.

Ross Rowland

I've never understood the appeal of "gutting" a car. To me, 90% of the charm of a heritage railcar is keeping the interiors exactly the way they were built by Budd, SLC, P-S, etc.

I do know some PV owners who have removed some of the former roomette space to make an open living area or dining room but anything further is a rape of a nice car if you ask me.

Bob

co614 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One door closes and another opens.
>
> Ross Rowland

Ross, you are to be commended for being so positive.

The billionaires of the world seem so shallow. What would I do if I had the money of Bill Gates? Well, I would have bought the former West End of the B&O when CSX was wanting to sell it a few years back. I also would have bought the 614 and dozens of passenger cars when they were available. Guess what I'd be doing with my 1-1 scale train layout?

Bob



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/20/14 07:16 by bnsfbob.

Is there a list of who purchased the cars?

Ross

You're absolutely correct. I know you gave this your all, and I deal with some of the same obstacles. Looking forward to your next project.

Ed

co614 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The auction was a success and all 13 cars sold for
> an average price of $ 61,000.00 which is decent
> considering that 9 of the 13 were completely
> gutted inside. We who worked hard on the project
> were sad to see it end but happy that the cars
> have new owners who will give them the TLC they
> deserve.
>
> One door closes and another opens.
>
> Ross Rowland

We already had a car but we got a great deal on Northwest Rail electrical panels.

bnsfbob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've never understood the appeal of "gutting" a
> car. To me, 90% of the charm of a heritage railcar
> is keeping the interiors exactly the way they were
> built by Budd, SLC, P-S, etc.
>
> I do know some PV owners who have removed some of
> the former roomette space to make an open living
> area or dining room but anything further is a rape
> of a nice car if you ask me.
>
> Bob

"Gutting" the car is the first step that must be taken
in order to do heavy repairs and upgrades to the wiring,
plumbing, HVAC, insulation and myriad other things.

Realist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> bnsfbob Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I've never understood the appeal of "gutting" a
> > car. To me, 90% of the charm of a heritage
> railcar
> > is keeping the interiors exactly the way they
> were
> > built by Budd, SLC, P-S, etc.
> >
> > I do know some PV owners who have removed some
> of
> > the former roomette space to make an open
> living
> > area or dining room but anything further is a
> rape
> > of a nice car if you ask me.
> >
> > Bob
>
> "Gutting" the car is the first step that must be
> taken
> in order to do heavy repairs and upgrades to the
> wiring,
> plumbing, HVAC, insulation and myriad other
> things.


Nobody said you can't put the "old" interior back in when you're through with the heavy work.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Realist Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > bnsfbob Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I've never understood the appeal of "gutting"
> a
> > > car. To me, 90% of the charm of a heritage
> > railcar
> > > is keeping the interiors exactly the way they
> > were
> > > built by Budd, SLC, P-S, etc.
> > >
> > > I do know some PV owners who have removed
> some
> > of
> > > the former roomette space to make an open
> > living
> > > area or dining room but anything further is a
> > rape
> > > of a nice car if you ask me.
> > >
> > > Bob
> >
> > "Gutting" the car is the first step that must
> be
> > taken
> > in order to do heavy repairs and upgrades to
> the
> > wiring,
> > plumbing, HVAC, insulation and myriad other
> > things.
>
>
> Nobody said you can't put the "old" interior back
> in when you're through with the heavy work.

Exactly!

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Realist Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------

> >
> > "Gutting" the car is the first step that must
> be
> > taken
> > in order to do heavy repairs and upgrades to
> the
> > wiring,
> > plumbing, HVAC, insulation and myriad other
> > things.
>
>
> Nobody said you can't put the "old" interior back
> in when you're through with the heavy work.

These and other car interiors are at the dump. Also, the master craftsmen who could snake wires, pipes and ducts anywhere don't exist any more. All construction these days is dumbed down to the lowest common denominator of mass production and unskilled labor. 60hp power-sprayers have replaced the artisan's brush.

BTW, my Dad was a master electrician and he had custom tricks and specially-designed snakes that allowed him to pull wires anywhere. Anywhere! My dad is gone but I have his snakes and he taught me how to use them. Have a restoration project? Better grab me and the few other master craftsmen left while we are still around. Have a demolition project? Take your time - there are hundreds of experts out there.

Bob

You can please some of the people all of the time.
You can please all of the people some of the time.

But you can never please all of the people all of the time.

jst3751 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You can please some of the people all of the
> time.
> You can please all of the people some of the
> time.
>
> But you can never please all of the people all of
> the time.

And you certainly can't please everyone on the Passenger Board!

bnsfbob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The billionaires of the world seem so shallow.
> What would I do if I had the money of Bill Gates?
> Well, I would have bought the former West End of
> the B&O when CSX was wanting to sell it a few
> years back. I also would have bought the 614 and
> dozens of passenger cars when they were available.
> Guess what I'd be doing with my 1-1 scale train
> layout?
>
> Bob

Gates spends money on trivia such as curing and controlling TB, HIV, pneumonia, and providing safe drinking water.
http://www.gatesfoundation.org/what-we-do

Lurch_in_ABQ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Gates spends money on trivia such as curing and
> controlling TB, HIV, pneumonia, and providing safe
> drinking water.
> http://www.gatesfoundation.org/what-we-do

Such a lack of imagination. The guy is just plain dull.

Bob

I will take the gates foundation over most current millionaires. He seems to be following the Salvation Army: "Doing the MOST good."

The fate of these cars' interiors notwithstanding, it's interesting to note that the White House was "tunneled" in 1949, rebuilt structurally from the inside out, and then the historic interiors were reinstalled. Preservationists would be aghast these days, but it can be done.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House#mediaviewer/File:Truman71-305-1.jpg

What was the configuration of the White House? Pullman, Budd or ACF?


(just kidding)


davew833 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The fate of these cars' interiors notwithstanding,
> it's interesting to note that the White House was
> "tunneled" in 1949, rebuilt structurally from the
> inside out, and then the historic interiors were
> reinstalled. Preservationists would be aghast
> these days, but it can be done.
>

davew833 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The fate of these cars' interiors notwithstanding,
> it's interesting to note that the White House was
> "tunneled" in 1949, rebuilt structurally from the
> inside out, and then the historic interiors were
> reinstalled. Preservationists would be aghast
> these days, but it can be done.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House#mediavie
> wer/File:Truman71-305-1.jpg

Interesting. However, like I posted earlier, the craftsmen who do this work are in declining supply. Maybe governments can afford to pay for the few that are left but not a struggling rail entrepreneur.

I just inventoried my Dad's tool collection for insurance purposes. Over 1500 items of all types. 7 room sized pieces of equipment. Over 75 different handheld electric, electronic or pneumatic tools. He also had architects/drafting/surveying equipment, which I elected to sell. Men like him hardly exist anymore. Heck, they don't even teach shop in school. When it breaks - throw it away.

Bob

Slightly off the subject, but still interesting to remember that during the renovation, often called the "Truman" restoration, the first family lived at Blair House. There was a Puerto Rican nationalist terrorism attack on the US House of Representatives during that period, where gunman started shooting in the chamber, and wounded at least 5 Congressmen. There were also two assassination attempts on the President during the time frame.

It's often easier to demolish a building rather than restore it, as anyone in that business will tell you. College campuses frequently gut historic buildings in order to preserve the outward look. It is not unheard of but it is truly a labor of love. The White House wasn't really all that historic anyway, since it was burned and mostly demolished previously thanks to our British friends.

One of the big issues with both Pullman and Budd cars was the vast amount of asbestos installed within them, particularly in the roof cavities (where the HVAC is), the undercar piping, and of course sometimes in the wall panels and electrical systems. Sometimes the floor had a layer of poured concrete with asbestos fibre mixed in with it. As we all know, asbestos will not hurt you if you encapsulate it leave it alone, but if you drill it, hammer it, blow air across it, etc., your passengers will end up in one of those class action lawsuits as seen on TV. The car owners will be up the proverbial New York Central creek (or brook, as the case may be). Probably best to strip it all out once and for all.

While we all like preservation of historical items and structures, common sense must eventually prevail.

I can also identify with the poster regarding the lack of qualified craftsmen. There is still one typewriter repairman working in Chicago, although semi-retired. I am sure this is true elsewhere. When was the last time you heard of anybody who would fix a busted VCR or a tube-type radio? When the last one goes, the lights will be turned out, and perhaps the twitter feeds will continue but will there be anybody left to know about it?

One good thing about it, in the past it was said to be a troublesome situation to be "all thumbs." But in future generations to come I expect human beings will consist of an oversize head plugged into some sort of computer, and there will be no arms, legs, or feet. Just two huge talking thumbs.

So when does what used to be a bad thing become a good thing?



davew833 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...the White House was
> "tunneled" in 1949, rebuilt structurally from the
> inside out, and then the historic interiors were
> reinstalled. Preservationists would be aghast
> these days, but it can be done.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House#mediavie
> wer/File:Truman71-305-1.jpg



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 09/21/14 13:49 by NewRiverGeorge.