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Passenger Trains > Amtrak 601Date: 05/27/15 16:19 Amtrak 601 Author: DECA34 Anyone have any info on how much damage was done to the new 601 power, that was involved in the Phil. PA Incident ?
Date: 05/27/15 16:28 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: GenePoon Not specifically in dollars yet, but you can say, "A lot," including serious structural damage.
This isn't going to be a patch-it-up job at the Wilmington Motor Shop. The builder, Siemens, is going to have to be involved, especially with apparent collision post damage to the carbody, a crushed rear roof, and a complete reconstruction of everything on the underbody. According to a recently-retired Amtrak employee who used to be in Mechanical, what could save it from being cannibalized and scrapped is that it is so new, it may cost more to pay off the note on it than to fix it and still have it to use. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/27/15 16:29 by GenePoon. Date: 05/27/15 22:16 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: msullivan1993 Although it was an extremely unfortunate incident, would Siemens gather information on the accident to make sure there aren't any other serious structure flaws with the locomotive? Just a thought.
Date: 05/28/15 07:29 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: CCT41 Siemens and Amtrak will evaluate 601 after the NTSB and FRA are done with their investigations, and formulate a plan for it's repair. It was amazing, that 601 went back to Wilmington on it's own wheels.
Date: 05/28/15 08:32 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: Out_Of_Service msullivan1993 Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Although it was an extremely unfortunate incident, > would Siemens gather information on the accident > to make sure there aren't any other serious > structure flaws with the locomotive? Just a > thought. FLAWS ??? FLAWS ??? did you see what the electric motor went through and how it held up and the aaaaamaaaaazingly great condition it was in after that tragic incident ... the unit was LAUNCHED up from an innner track with a superelevation of 6" OVER another track also with 6" of super anf dove into a depressed area at least 15ft below the grade of the RofW nose first and traveling in dirt and debris for approx 150ft while coming in contact with steel catenary beams ... and with all that, the engimeer SURVIVED with no seat belt with just a serious cut on his head and only minor non-life threatening injuries ... why on earth would AAAANYONE want to change the integrity design of the power unit ... Posted from Android Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/15 13:42 by Out_Of_Service. Date: 05/28/15 08:39 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: phillytrainman Yes, it was amazing it could return to Wilmington on its own wheels. Even after the pantographs and HVAC units being ripped off, the machine room was intact except for the missing roof section. All those design review meetings come back to me now.
Date: 05/28/15 08:45 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: prr60 Out_Of_Service Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > msullivan1993 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Although it was an extremely unfortunate > incident, > > would Siemens gather information on the > accident > > to make sure there aren't any other serious > > structure flaws with the locomotive? Just a > > thought. > > FLAWS ??? FLAWS ??? did you see what the electric > motor went through and how it held up and the > aaaaamaaaaazingly great condition it was in after > that tragic incident ... the unit was LAUNCHED up > from an innner track with a superelevation of 6" > OVER another track also with 6" of super anf dove > into a depressed area at least 15ft below the > grade of the RofW nose first and traveling in dirt > and debris for approx 150ft while coming in > contact with steel catenary beams ... and with all > that, the engimeer SURVIVED with no seat belt with > just a serious cut on his head and only minor life > threatening injuries ... why on earth would > AAAANYONE want to change the integrity design of > the power unit ... > > Posted from Android I'm suspecting this means to search for hidden or otherwise undected structural flaws caused by the accident. I don't think it means that the design itself was an issue. Siemens engineering people could assist with this by determining high structural stress points based on the accident dynamics. The work will require getting to all the underlying structure and use non-destructive testing techniques to look for cracks that may be too small to see visually. Just because the unit looks more or less OK, that does not necessarily mean there are not serious issues. Date: 05/28/15 08:56 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: Lackawanna484 prr60 Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- (snip) > > I'm suspecting this means to search for hidden or > otherwise undected structural flaws caused by the > accident. I don't think it means that the design > itself was an issue. > > Siemens engineering people could assist with this > by determining high structural stress points based > on the accident dynamics. The work will require > getting to all the underlying structure and use > non-destructive testing techniques to look for > cracks that may be too small to see visually. Just > because the unit looks more or less OK, that does > not necessarily mean there are not serious issues. > I wonder how an off the shelf European version, not built to US buffer etc standards would have made out? The general consensus is the European standards are less "solid" than US requirements. Date: 05/28/15 09:10 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: phillytrainman European standards do not come into play here. These locos were bulit to U.S. standards for sturcture and welding, The Eurosprinter and the Vectron were the basis, but Siemens had to adapt the carbody sturcture to U.S. standards. The location of one of the cab entry steps was even adjusted as the cut-out for it was within carbody structure. ACS-64s were bulit with CEM and all the analysis that goes with it working with FRA and the Volpe Center.
Date: 05/28/15 09:12 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: phillytrainman You're right. A European version probably would not have made out as well.
Date: 05/28/15 11:51 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: Lackawanna484 phillytrainman Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > European standards do not come into play here. > These locos were bulit to U.S. standards for > sturcture and welding, The Eurosprinter and the > Vectron were the basis, but Siemens had to adapt > the carbody sturcture to U.S. standards. The > location of one of the cab entry steps was even > adjusted as the cut-out for it was within carbody > structure. ACS-64s were bulit with CEM and all > the analysis that goes with it working with FRA > and the Volpe Center. Right, and that's why I asked the question the way I did. IF the 601 had been built to European standards, and the accident occured here, would the outcome for the engine be any different? We had long threads after the Talgo accident in Spain and the ICE train / can opener in Germany with partisans on each side arguing their positions. From time to time people will argue that the US should allow European standards on an "as is" basis. The diversity of locomotive and car manufacturers, in that telling, allow Amtrak etc more flexibility in equipment procurement. (Not meaning to pick a fight, merely opening up the discussion on why (I think) European standards should not be allowed in the US) Date: 05/28/15 12:34 Re: Amtrak 601 Author: phillytrainman Acknowledged and absolutely. Your point is on target. Glad the U.S. (FRA) standards were applied.
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