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Passenger Trains > Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video)Date: 05/11/16 12:11 Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public DemoFrom NPR News - May 11th, 2016
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/05/11/477645103/elon-musks-hyperloop-dream-is-about-to-have-its-1st-public-demo Moving right along! I'm amazed to see something other then a study come to fruition! Click on link to watch the video clip of the test "Out in the Nevada desert today, the world got a good look at the first public test of the Hyperloop — a concept that could someday become a new mode of transportation." As an interesting side note: "French railways invest in 700mph inter-city 'hyperloop' super-tube train which could make HS2 obsolete" - Independent; May 4th, 2016: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/french-railways-invest-in-700mph-inter-city-hyperloop-super-tube-train-which-could-make-hs2-obsolete-a7012866.html "The SNCF, creator of the high-speed train concept, have decided to invest Euros 80m in one of two American companies which are developing the “hyperloop”, a wheel-less train or capsule projected through a tube with relatively small energy needs." /Mitch Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/16 12:38 by Mgoldman. Date: 05/11/16 12:31 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman There is (at least) one competing company not to be confused with Hyperloop One known as
Hyperloop Transportation Technologies, Inc. It would appear that Hyperloop One will use a system whereby the carriage travels through a pressurized tube propelled by a magnetic linear induction motor (think: today's fastest roller-coaster rides which do not need to be dragged to the top of an arch). A prop-fan would inject air underneath the carriage eliminating friction (like an air hockey table). Hyperloop Transportation Technologies, Inc, on the other hand is proposing a similar system though the carriage will not only be propelled by magnets, but would also levitate by the same means. No propjet? Hyperloop Transportation Technologies, Inc. : http://hyperlooptransp.com/#!/ PLAYA VISTA, Calif., May 9, 2016 /PRNewswire/ - "Jumpstartfund's Hyperloop Transportation Technologies, Inc. (HTT) announced today a base technology of the Hyperloop™ System: passive magnetic levitation, originally developed by Dr. Richard Post and his team at Lawrence Livermore National Labs (LLNL) as part of the Inductrack system." 189 mph - it's so passé! Wouldn't it be great to once again lead vs follow (decades behind?) /Mitch Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/16 13:26 by Mgoldman. Date: 05/11/16 17:07 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Westbound No doubt this system could be wonderful. The only question is how soon will they be requesting government (taxpayer) funding?
Date: 05/11/16 17:27 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Lurch_in_ABQ Just tack Hyperloop taxpayer funding onto Tesla tax credit taxpayer funding.
Date: 05/11/16 19:14 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: atsf121 While I think it might take a while to build something we could ride, it sure is interesting and seems to have potential.
Posted from iPhone Date: 05/11/16 19:33 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman Westbound Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > No doubt this system could be wonderful. The only > question is how soon will they be requesting > government (taxpayer) funding? And why not? Sure beats 79 mph, 110 mph or even 160 mph. Is there any transportation system in the US that is not subsidized? As it is, China is already de- bating the merits of investing in the company itself. No doubt they'll shortly thereafter "re-invent" the tech- nology and export it back to us. /Mitch Date: 05/11/16 19:51 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: railstiesballast Air friction near sea level at these speeds is too much to overcome economically, that is why jets fly up in thin air or why a system like this needs a nearly vacuum tube or a blanket of air that moves with it.
Inquiring minds want to know how much power it takes to move air though a tube this size at nearly 700 MPH...? Date: 05/11/16 20:34 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: abyler Fails to discuss how it handles curves and grades. Just saying it will be built elevated outside of cities fails to account for the cost of such a right of way and especially building it to tolerance
Also fails to account for safe headways which feeds into practical capacity and thus economics. How are capsules "turned" at the end of the line? How is the evacuated pressure of the tubes maintained at the stations? Are there any intermediate stations or does this fall into endpoint fallacy? What does a Hyperloop switch look like and how does it work? Date: 05/11/16 21:14 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman railstiesballast Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Air friction near sea level at these speeds is too > much to overcome economically, that is why jets > fly up in thin air or why a system like this needs > a nearly vacuum tube or a blanket of air that > moves with it. > Inquiring minds want to know how much power it > takes to move air though a tube this size at > nearly 700 MPH...? How much energy does it take to keep a plastic puck moving on an air hockey table? Now picture that table in a room where the air has been evacu- ated. "Hyperloop pioneers counter that their technology will eventually win out due to lower costs (once a hyperloop pod is underway it can sustain its speed with very low energy use) while producing no carbon emissions (a critical element in global warming). /Mitch Date: 05/11/16 21:16 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman abyler Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Fails to discuss how it handles curves and grades. > Just saying it will be built elevated outside of > cities fails to account for the cost of such a > right of way and especially building it to > tolerance > > Also fails to account for safe headways which > feeds into practical capacity and thus economics. > > How are capsules "turned" at the end of the line? > > How is the evacuated pressure of the tubes > maintained at the stations? > > Are there any intermediate stations or does this > fall into endpoint fallacy? > > What does a Hyperloop switch look like and how > does it work? This was a news story - not the owners manual. Do you really believe those issues were not evaluated before they began to move forward? A Google search will answer most of your questions. /Mitch Date: 05/11/16 21:23 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman More - plus photos (and a pan shot, too).
USA Today: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2016/05/11/hyperloop-one-debuts-future-tech-nevada-desert/84236120/ "We think we can move cargo by 2019 and passengers by 2021..." (Sure - optimistic, but recall when the CA HSR, if it ever gets built and remains HSR, is expected to be finished.) "It won't be cheap - at $6 billion dollars to build a system that runs from LA to SF" - Ha, that beats 68 billion dollars for big heavy trains built by a German company running at speeds 80 mph slower with less frequency. And potential to run at speeds 500 mph faster in the future. /Mitch Date: 05/12/16 00:26 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: railwaybaron HYPERLOOPY says it all.
Date: 05/12/16 07:07 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: NewRiverGeorge The good news is we got the passengers there in 15 minutes.
The bad news is they were all brain dead when they arrived. Date: 05/12/16 08:24 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman NewRiverGeorge Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > The good news is we got the passengers there in 15 > minutes. > The bad news is they were all brain dead when they > arrived. That reminds me of something I read in a book about the Concorde... A reporter is claimed to have been invited for a flight early on in the process and upon return during an interview with one of the engineers, he states something along the lines of; "What's the big deal, it felt like any other flight he had ever taken" to which the engineer states: "That was the hard part!" From the USA Today story: "...noted that humans in a hyperloop pod wouldn’t feel the acceleration as it would happen more gradually, eventually hitting close to 750 mph" BTW - I am in no way vested in either of these companies - just a big fan of technology. I was too young to remember the Moon shot - I feel that such leaps in technology should not occur "every other lifespan", lol. I see the "Hyperloop" today as some saw the automobile in the time of horse and carriages. Faster, cheaper, greener, and American made. What's the hold up? . /Mitch Date: 05/12/16 12:15 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: rosenth not a new idea by the way: [url=http://https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swissmetro]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swissmetro[/url]
Date: 05/12/16 12:58 Moon Shot and Radio Bounce Author: NewRiverGeorge My uncle was in the TV studio in New Mexico where the moon landing footage was shot.
Of course he could not talk about it while he was still alive. This also reminds me of people who say they have recently received radio station signals from the early days of broadcasting. I mean that signal took a long time to get back, it must have bounced off of something far, far away. The very first steam locomotive must have been very traumatic to some people as well. Just saying. Date: 05/12/16 13:59 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman rosenth Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > not a new idea by the > way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swissmetro 1990 - interesting, never knew about that. But... how about NYC in 1867? True, not magnetically levitated nor propelled, it was still a system designed to be operated in an evacuated tube. Incidentally, Musk's system was not initially designed with maglev in mind, rather, a swoosh of air (air bearings) in a low pressure tube. NYC's Beach Pneumatic Transit: http://www.nycsubway.org/wiki/Beach_Pneumatic_Transit (Mark - you see, we've been waiting a long time, lol) /Mitch Date: 05/12/16 14:02 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: abyler Mgoldman Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Do you really believe those issues were not > evaluated > before they began to move forward? Yes. > A Google search will answer most of your > questions. I doubt that very much. It will probably show a bunch of slick visuals and no real engineering. Date: 05/12/16 14:12 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: abyler Mgoldman Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > "We think we can move cargo by 2019 and passengers > by 2021..." > (Sure - optimistic, but recall when the CA HSR, if > it ever gets built > and remains HSR, is expected to be finished.) Totally unrealistic timeline. The person saying that has no conception of eminent domain infrastructure construction. > "It won't be cheap - at $6 billion dollars to > build a system that runs > from LA to SF" - Ha, that beats 68 billion dollars Its impossible to go LA to SF for $6 billion. Its 2 million feet, which would require around 40,000 piers if it was all in the air (which it won't be). That's just $150,000 per pier + two large 50' tubes + all systems for each pier locations + a pro rata share of terminal and equipment costs. It must be designed for seismic loading as well in California. For some perspective, a single Amtrak catenary pole with foundation is around $100,000. A more realistic number would be $40 billion assuming no tunneling and no major bridges, both of which are false assumptions. It would also be impossible to follow existing highways or rail lines because at 750 mph, the radius of horizontal and vertical curves that would be within human comfort limits would not be anywhere near what is found on the existing right of ways. At a minimum safe 6 minute headway (3 mphps safe breaking + 2 minute safety margin), system capacity would be lower than a single hourly train. The whole thing is preposterous. Emperor has no clothes. Date: 05/12/16 14:23 Re: Elon Musk's Hyperloop Dream Has Its 1st Public Demo (Video) Author: Mgoldman abyler Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Totally unrealistic timeline. And yet, I'll bet it will happen before you ever see the completion of the CA HSR system, which will likley find itself mixed in with commuter trains running well under 200 mph. The devil is in the details, sure. But, it's smaller, can be built in a cut and fill or suspended, greener, faster, and possibly, home grown and home built. They state the first "American" system will likley be built elsewhere - though, I can imagine viable economics of building a line mostly through the desert between LA and LV. You otherwise imply the most modern system possible in the US would be a hybrid with HSR, err, higher speed rail, running with freight and/ or commuter trains for a good portion if built. (Where's our flying cars, lol) /Mitch (Beam me up) |