Passenger Trains > Empire Builder ?

I want to ride the Empire Builder from Chicago west to Seattle or Portland and then turn around and come back. According the schedule the layover time is about the same. Which is the better place to layover for the 6 hrs or so?

Thanks

Country Boy

Definitely Portland. The Seattle train station is a dump (as a Seattlite, I can say that ;-)plus, I think the ride to Portland along the Columbia is a little bit better than the ride to Seattle (although the coastal section is nice)

Thats a real tough call to make, but I\'d have to say Portland.

Best reason to lay over there for the day is Powells "city of books" bookstore a short walk from the station. Makes Borders look like a 7-11, they had a coffee shop way before anyody else ever thought of it. Thousands of used books along with the new, literally a city block of books.

Ya might want to spend the night just for that! As long as you\'ve travelled so far, ya may as well then you could ride the MAX and see other rail stuff there.

PH

I\'m also partial to Portland. Union Station is within the "Fareless Square" bus service for downtown Portland so you can easily get downtown for a bite to eat.

You have to see Powells to believe it. Shelves seven high and tweleve feet long on railroads alone. Take any bus toward downtown, get off at Burnside, and five blocks west to 10th.

Ride the MAX light rail. Any bus free to downtown to where they cross and ride it west to Beaverton/Hillboro for a buck twenty. Go through a tunnel that has the deepest underground station in the US. Maybe get off there and visit the Portland zoo.

Consider coming into Portland, getting a bite to eat, and catching the 12:30 Cascade Talgo to Vancouver, WA. Watch trains for four hours at Vancouver and catch 28 there. Ballews at the Crossing is a restaurant a couple blocks from the Vancouver station and show your AMTRAK ticket for a discount.

And I like the Columbia River Gorge better than the northern route. If you are interested, just say so and I\'ll send you some info on what to see from the train in the gorge.

jb

The only thing the Seattle section has going for it is a dining car, and some good mountain railroading. IMHO, you can eat a fine meal some other time, and you already had the good mountain scenery west Of Glacier Park.

IMHO, compared to Portland, Seattle is a dump, has no rail transit, has vagrants all over town, and a seedy station.

Go enjoy the sightseer lounge car, the Columbia River, and Portland

CountryBoy wrote:

> I want to ride the Empire Builder from Chicago west to
> Seattle or Portland and then turn around and come back.
> According the schedule the layover time is about the same.
> Which is the better place to layover for the 6 hrs or so?

I\'m going to disagree with some of the opinions (because I can!) - while Seattle\'s train station is definitely a dump compared to Portland\'s, the area around King Street Station is nicer than Seattle. In PDX, you\'ve got the Greyhound Station across the street, then numerous homeless shelters and abandoned warehouses, the Burnside Bridge (enough said!), and the north end of Waterfront Park. If you arrive on a Saturday or Sunday, the bums will be cleared from under the Burnside Bridge for Saturday Market, which is a decent place to be.

Also - there aren\'t that many "touristy" things to do in downtown Portland - yes there is Powell\'s, and you could venture to Washington Park to the Rose Gardens, the Forestry Center, the Zoo, or the Japanese Gardens...or take the 83 bus to OMSI on the other side of the river (or just walk to it, if you\'re up to a 2 mile walk along the eastside river esplanade!)

In Seattle - there is the entire waterfront that is beckoning, the Seattle Center (the Space Needle is there), the Monorail, the Waterfront Streetcar, and Pike Place Market (which is open every day).

However...if I were you and had about an extra $100 - take the Empire Builder to Seattle, then take one of the evening Cascades trains to Portland (leaves Seattle around 5:30 or so, right after the Empire Builder), spend a night in Portland, and take the Empire Builder from PDX the next day.

wigwagfan wrote:

> CountryBoy wrote:
>
> However...if I were you and had about an extra $100 - take
> the Empire Builder to Seattle, then take one of the evening
> Cascades trains to Portland (leaves Seattle around 5:30 or so,
> right after the Empire Builder), spend a night in Portland, and
> take the Empire Builder from PDX the next day.
>
> [%sig%]

Countryboy, I agree with wigwagfan on this one. If you can, take #7 to Seattle, spend a little time, then take #509 to Portland, overnight there, and take #28 back home. You get to experience the best of both worlds. If you are coming all the way out here, you might as well stay a day (see below for my turnaround on the Starlate, it is not really fun)

Depending if you are going coach or sleeper, your body can use a days rest from the train. I know that, after being stuck in coach at least in one direction of my trips listed below, and you will ache.

Warren - Seattle
Who did a 10 hour Emeryville turnaround on the Coast Starlate mid April (hoping to get a Keddie Wye Detour, NOT!), AND took the Empire Builder last week to Essex/Shelby, taking #11(a bus, thanks to that damm crane in Dunsmuir)/#28 and #7.

Should you decide to do the trip, check into an "Explore America" pass. I can\'t find it on the AMTRAK web site but "Julie" at 1-800USARAIL can direct you to an agent that knows about it. From Chicago to the west coast you would need a two region (zone?) pass. It allows three stopovers. Price is $360 before May 16 and $400 after that until the fall.

With the pass you could do CHI/SEA (stop one), spend the night, catch a Cascade Talgo to PDX, and then do PDX/CHI. Portland would not count as a stop because you are catching the next train out of there to your destination. Now you still have a ticket with two stops on it so do a couple day trips out of Chicago either south or west. Maybe do Joliet for stop two and Memphis for stop three.

Also, should you decide to do Seattle first and take a Talgo to PDX, don\'t go all the way to PDX. Get off in Vancouver and watch trains for a few hours.

jb

Thanks for all the suggestions. it does give me something to think about

I have to do this on the real cheap and use my company bennes

If you have to make the turn in one day, I suggest taking #27 to Portland arriving 1010am #506 departing 1230pm to Seattle connecting to #8 departing 445pm. # 27 can be up to 3+ hours late and you can still make the connection to #506 at Vancouver. I have to agree with some of the other posters that an overnight stay in a hotel would be a good idea after several nights on the train.

The #506 to #8 connection looks good on paper but be aware that it is not a guarenteed connection. #506 is a different trainset than the #504 trainset from Eugene and #506 waits for #504 to arrive in Portland before departing. #504 runs on the UP and is frequently late so #506 is late leaving Portland.

jb