Passenger Trains > A nasty Lake Shore Limited trip!

On 6/9/03 I traveled from Rochester NY to Boston on the LSL,a 10 hour trip in coach. I soon discovered that all the toilets were not working properly, were overfull or out of service.There was a steady flow of passengers walking the train inspecting each coach for a working toilet.Each passenger had no choice but to leave their excrement,toilet paper, and urine in the toilet bowl on top of all the previous deposits.This sewerage reached the top of the bowls and slopped over with the train motion.The stench was horrible and the health danger was great. Many people complained to the crew who said there was nothing they could do. During my 10 hours on this train there was never a PA announcement concerning the toilet situation. The conductor, in my opinon, was neglegent in not taking any action .He could have held the train in the stations for people to use those rest rooms.He could have called ahead to have a station agent arrange for a supply of plastic garbage bags by a taxi driver from a convenience store.Campers and boaters use plasic bags when necessary.It was a very nasty and unhealthful situation that probably will cost Amtrak some customers.

Sounds like the "friendly" Southern Pacific, circa 1969!

It sounds like the mechanical forces at Chicago didn\'t do their job.

Again.

I can\'t believe that they couldn\'t do SOMETHING while the train was in Albany being separated into 48 and 448. At least, the train crew could have called someone at Sunnyside Yard in New York to meet the train in Albany and at least try to get a couple toilets fixed.

This is an extremely serious problem. I wonder how many people on the train swore "Never Again."

If you haven\'t already, please send a copy of the letter to Amtrak\'s Customer Relations Department, and it wouldn\'t hurt to send it to Mr. David Gunn, Amtrak CEO as well.

Use the following address:

Amtrak
Attn: Customer Relations
60 Mass. Ave., NE
Washington, DC 20002


--Harris Cohen

> On 6/9/03 I traveled from Rochester NY to Boston on the
> LSL,a 10 hour trip in coach. I soon discovered that all the
> toilets were not working properly, were overfull or out of
> service.There was a steady flow of passengers walking the train
> inspecting each coach for a working toilet.Each passenger had
> no choice but to leave their excrement,toilet paper, and urine
> in the toilet bowl on top of all the previous deposits.This
> sewerage reached the top of the bowls and slopped over with the
> train motion.The stench was horrible and the health danger was
> great. Many people complained to the crew who said there was
> nothing they could do. During my 10 hours on this train there
> was never a PA announcement concerning the toilet situation.
> The conductor, in my opinon, was neglegent in not taking any
> action .He could have held the train in the stations for people
> to use those rest rooms.He could have called ahead to have a
> station agent arrange for a supply of plastic garbage bags by a
> taxi driver from a convenience store.Campers and boaters use
> plasic bags when necessary.It was a very nasty and unhealthful
> situation that probably will cost Amtrak some customers.
>
> [%sig%]

You ABSOLUTELY should send a copy of this report to high Amtrak management. You might want to copy the state Health Departments in New York and Massachusetts, too.

There is no excuse for the situation you describe. Yes, the crew was stuck with a problem that should have been dealt with before the train ever left the yard in Chicago, but it became their duty to take appropriate action, even if it meant holding the train in stations for "bathroom breaks."

While riding the eastbound Capitol Limited on April 29, the train experienced a similar failure in Connelesville Pa. when the crew tried to switch in an errant locomotive that had been left in the yard just east of the station (probably by a westbound Capital). Before coupling the locomotive to the train consist, the crew had disconnected the non-emergency electrical system. They were not able to reconnect the system after they coupled the engine into the train consist.

As a result, "potty" breaks were taken for the entire train at Cumberland and New Martinsburg. To reduce the stench, windows were open in the doors to each car.

We arrvied five hours late into Washington.

There are also facilities to service bathrooms at Albany. If they encountered problems in upstate NY, they surely should have been rectified there.

This should be sent as recommended to Amtrak, the health departments of the states the train passed through, to NARP, and to your representatives in Washington (not that it will do any good).

This is a MAJOR health hazard. People tracking human waste throughout the train due to overflowing toilets is unacceptable.

The crew and Amtrak has no excuse for this. Unless of course this is the first time they\'ve ever had to deal with such a problem and there wasn\'t anyone to call for assistance or advice, NOT !!!

Too bad they couldn\'t use that hour and half dwell time at Albany to fix the bathrooms. Had a similar experience a couple of years ago on #29, which was dispatched from DC with 50% of the revenue cars having no working toilet, despite the 25 hour turn around time for the equipment.

Dave

Okay, supposed I\'m a dining steward or cook, where do I go? Imagine them going into a bathroom clogged up, and just knowing that they were in there with the "smell," and just knowing that they will be cooking or touching your food!

What about the conductor or chief of onboard person? Where do they use the bathrooms??

It\'s likely that the crew used bathrooms in the Crew Dorm Car or possibly in one of the sleepers. The Cafe Car, usually has a bathroom in it and considering that\'s where the crew is generally stationed, that\'s probably the primary bathroom used by the crew. I\'m not sure if most passengers even know the bathroom is there?

I had similar experience on the Silver Meteor last year. The train was 7 hours late and south of Washington the crew started closing the bathrooms because the toilets were full. By Philadelphia they were all closed, so there were no toilets for the remaining 1 and half to New York. It blew me away that they didn\'t drain any of the toilets during the 1/2 hour stop at DC to change the engine. Even for a simple problem like this they couldn\'t fix the problem or they just didn\'t care.

I had the same situation a few years ago on the Cresent. Full toilets thru the entire train.

man I an gonna swear off the train now!!!

and how is it that you never hear of this on planes?

how is that something that flies and needs compact things can work so well...and something that is big as hell and lumbers along the ground works so poorly

Just to reassure PTRA - I\'ve never had this problem (Thank God) The closest I ever came was on the last morning of a WB CA Zephyr, when the car I was in got a little too full and we had to use the next car over for about 20 minutes until we got to Reno, where something called "Johnny on the Spot" took care of the problem.

I don\'t think they normally did that at that stop - I think they just took the initiative to call ahead and have someone there to deal with it.

The orgional posting is now in the hands of Lake Shore Management.

ellissimon wrote:

> There are also facilities to service bathrooms at Albany. If
> they encountered problems in upstate NY, they surely should
> have been rectified there

... if you\'ll pardon the pun.

This is a bunch of crap to say the least. Gunn deserves a letter so he can immediately fire every employee that screwed up on the train. All of them.

After decades in the passenger train business, one would think Amtrak knows better. Apparently not, on the Lakeshore Limited.

Even if it began from the initial terminal, the train should be been stopped and annulled immediately. Drag the equipment to a spur track and charter some aircraft to fly the customers to their destinations.

Who says stop the train at stations for restroom breaks? That\'s not only stupid, but ties up the main line and delays other trains. On top of that, most Amtrak restrooms are filthy.

If the top guy, Gunn, cannot rid the company of the incompetent personnel who let this train out of the gate, Gunn himself needs walking papers.

This is not the way to run a business, Amtrak.

At the risk of beating the subject to death; doesn\'t Amtrak have a standard operational plan for this type of problem. Surely after 20 plus years of operation, problems like this, that reoccur, would result in a standardized response.

Contracts with "honey hut" pumpers, directions to employees, authorizations for the onboard crew to make arrangements in emergencies, a three-ring binder with tabs for each anticipated emergency and a response, carried by each onboard chief of services.

I tend to agree with Stash, the whole damn crew should be fired or at least suspended for 30 days. Their response had to be either a deliberate "screw you" to the passengers or a conspiracy to embarass Amtrak. You\'d have to work at being that stupid, it couldn\'t "just happen".

From what I\'ve seen from various trips over the years, this is the kind of thing that crews let happen just so they have bragging rights among themselves.