Western Railroad Discussion > question on bnsf "short turn" crew pools in seattle area

Hey, random question here. In these parts (seattle etc) we have road pool crews (south, from auburn to vancouver; east, from interbay to wenatchee; etc), we also for some time have had what are called "K" crews, or shuttle crews, which operate in the greater metropolitan area and usually operate with symbols K-INBINB (interbay K crew), K-AUBAUB (auburn K crew), K-EVEEVE (everett K crew), etc.

Recently I have been hearing a new type of crew called a "short turn" crew. These are different from K crews but i am imagining it is a bit similar. One difference is that these crews typically request a meal break somewhere during their shift, communicating with the appropriate dispatcher to make this happen.

can anyone tell me about this "short turn" crew pool and how it is different from a "K" crew?

Thanks

brandon in seattle

The K symbol was used for manned helpers.

Here's a non-specific reply to your specific question account of local agreements sometimes tend to vary. In general, on the BNSF, shuttle jobs are usually advertised assignments like a road switcher that have regular on-duty times, days off, etc.
In contrast, STAS or short turn around service (former ATSF Coast Lines) is unassigned and is called as needed and is not pool service. It is filled from the respective extra boards or from whatever the sources of supply that protect the extra work.
STAS can work in any direction out of the home terminal and can make multiple trips not to exceed 25 miles outside the switching limits on a time/mileage basis. Freight rate (130 miles minimum)applies and overtime commences after the expiration of 8 hours or 130 actual miles in aggregate have been run off.
The payment of a second day (additional 130 miles in lieu of overtime) is due if required to depart on a subsequent trip out of the home terminal after 8 hours on duty.

Your conditions in Seattle may vary.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/17 07:28 by Chico43.

My neck of the ATSF woods requires a brakeman on a short turn.

Chico43 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's a non-specific reply to your specific
> question account of local agreements sometimes
> tend to vary. In general, on the BNSF, shuttle
> jobs are usually advertised assignments like a
> road switcher that have regular on-duty times,
> days off, etc.
> In contrast, STAS or short turn around service
> (former ATSF Coast Lines) is unassigned and is
> called as needed and is not pool service. It is
> filled from the respective extra boards or from
> whatever the sources of supply that protect the
> extra work.
> STAS can work in any direction out of the home
> terminal and can make multiple trips not to exceed
> 25 miles outside the switching limits on a
> time/mileage basis. Freight rate (130 miles
> minimum)applies and overtime commences after the
> expiration of 8 hours or 130 actual miles in
> aggregate have been run off.
> The payment of a second day (additional 130 miles
> in lieu of overtime) is due if required to depart
> on a subsequent trip out of the home terminal
> after 8 hours on duty.
>
> Your conditions in Seattle may vary.

GN and NP had it, called Short Turn Around Rule. I used it a lot with NP crews. I can't think of one occasion of using it with a GN crew as there was nowhere to go within 25 miles. That rule has probably survived in some form, whether GN and NP agreements still exist or not.

TAW

Thanks everyone for the responses.

Sounds like the key differences are that short turn crews do not have regular shifts, on duty times, etc. and also they might include brakemen.I dont believe that the K/shuttle crews have brakemen.

sounds like it might be an old practice that is being used more here recently. i definitely never heard this term before recently, and i listen to the scanner ALOT. on the other hand, K crews have been ever present since 2008 when i first started using a scanner. i know that BNSF lately has been looking for ways to have a more flexible/pliable workforce...

FWIW the "K" symbol in my post definitely does not apply to manned helpers.