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Date: 08/10/18 12:35
P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: SD45X

Test train Wednesday headed west to Watrous.
Leaving Jansen
Gallinas x-overs
706 Semaphores








Date: 08/10/18 13:25
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: KansasRailHead

OutStanding



Date: 08/10/18 13:52
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: highgreengraphics

Great shots! === === = === JLH



Date: 08/10/18 14:04
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: ntharalson

Nice shots, thansk for posting.  

So, what are they testing?  Are they six or four powered axels?  I had thought they were six and the engines parked at Galesburg.  When did they get out to Colorado?  Please keeps us informed. 

Nick Tharalson,
Marion, IA



Date: 08/10/18 14:22
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: zorz

ntharalson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nice shots, thansk for posting.  
>
> So, what are they testing?  Are they six or four
> powered axels?  I had thought they were six and
> the engines parked at Galesburg.  When did they
> get out to Colorado?  Please keeps us
> informed. 
>
> Nick Tharalson,
> Marion, IA

Last I checked, these are P4's with some software improvements since the first ones. The primary different iirc is that the Indian WAP-4's that these are based off of were not optimizing traction as well as BNSF needed (not sure why). These supposedly are much higher tractive effort, both starting and continuous, without the issues of the GE's. They also redid the truck frames in order to reduce issues with hunting on the rear truck at speed.

I'm hoping BNSF does a big order here. The EMD T4's are getting better and I hope they can start to take away orders from GE...I mean Wabtec :P



Date: 08/10/18 14:41
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: krm152

Super outstanding photos.
Progress rail is in to win.
ALLEN



Date: 08/10/18 14:49
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: jointauthority

No. Those of us who run them are hoping there isn’t a big order. Or any order at all preferably.

zorz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ntharalson Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Nice shots, thansk for posting.  
> >
> > So, what are they testing?  Are they six or
> four
> > powered axels?  I had thought they were six
> and
> > the engines parked at Galesburg.  When did
> they
> > get out to Colorado?  Please keeps us
> > informed. 
> >
> > Nick Tharalson,
> > Marion, IA
>
> Last I checked, these are P4's with some software
> improvements since the first ones. The primary
> different iirc is that the Indian WAP-4's that
> these are based off of were not optimizing
> traction as well as BNSF needed (not sure why).
> These supposedly are much higher tractive effort,
> both starting and continuous, without the issues
> of the GE's. They also redid the truck frames in
> order to reduce issues with hunting on the rear
> truck at speed.
>
> I'm hoping BNSF does a big order here. The EMD
> T4's are getting better and I hope they can start
> to take away orders from GE...I mean Wabtec :P

Posted from iPhone



Date: 08/10/18 14:51
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: zorz

Why? Have you run these ones on test? (Honest question)

jointauthority Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No. Those of us who run them are hoping there
> isn’t a big order. Or any order at all
> preferably.
>
> zorz Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > ntharalson Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Nice shots, thansk for posting.  
> > >
> > > So, what are they testing?  Are they six or
> > four
> > > powered axels?  I had thought they were six
> > and
> > > the engines parked at Galesburg.  When did
> > they
> > > get out to Colorado?  Please keeps us
> > > informed. 
> > >
> > > Nick Tharalson,
> > > Marion, IA
> >
> > Last I checked, these are P4's with some
> software
> > improvements since the first ones. The primary
> > different iirc is that the Indian WAP-4's that
> > these are based off of were not optimizing
> > traction as well as BNSF needed (not sure why).
> > These supposedly are much higher tractive
> effort,
> > both starting and continuous, without the
> issues
> > of the GE's. They also redid the truck frames
> in
> > order to reduce issues with hunting on the rear
> > truck at speed.
> >
> > I'm hoping BNSF does a big order here. The EMD
> > T4's are getting better and I hope they can
> start
> > to take away orders from GE...I mean Wabtec :P
>
> Posted from iPhone



Date: 08/10/18 15:12
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: jointauthority

I’ve been on a UP T4 and that wasn’t a good experience and knowing they are going to be missing 2 traction motors you don’t have to run one to know they are going to be garbage....just like the GEs.

If they would be used exclusively on the transcons pulling high priority stacks and racks then they might work out. But that doesn’t happen, and we get to deal with them on undulating territory with loaded unit trains and other heavy manifest.

Posted from iPhone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/18 15:15 by jointauthority.



Date: 08/10/18 15:43
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: zorz

What was bad about the experience? Couldn’t load quickly or slipped too much?

I’m honestly curious as good data on their performance has been hard to come by.

jointauthority Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I’ve been on a UP T4 and that wasn’t a good
> experience and knowing they are going to be
> missing 2 traction motors you don’t have to run
> one to know they are going to be garbage....just
> like the GEs.
>
> If they would be used exclusively on the transcons
> pulling high priority stacks and racks then they
> might work out. But that doesn’t happen, and we
> get to deal with them on undulating territory with
> loaded unit trains and other heavy manifest.
>
> Posted from iPhone



Date: 08/10/18 15:49
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: Brian_P

I heard these units are junk.



Date: 08/10/18 15:50
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: Ritzville

Really NICE shots!

Larry



Date: 08/10/18 16:15
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: NYSWSD70M

I won't speak for him but BLE692 (fairly) recently had a UP EMD T4 and spoke well of his experience with the locomotive. He wrote very detailed report at the time.

These things are new. Time will tell how they will pan out. I can't imagine the P4 configuration will work any better than the GE's however.

Posted from Android



Date: 08/10/18 20:02
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: spwolfmtn

NYSWSD70M Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I won't speak for him but BLE692 (fairly) recently
> had a UP EMD T4 and spoke well of his experience
> with the locomotive. He wrote very detailed
> report at the time.
>
> These things are new. Time will tell how they
> will pan out. I can't imagine the P4
> configuration will work any better than the GE's
> however.
>
> Posted from Android

This is something that I've noticed here on TO, and these new EMD's are a good example; lots of "they are crap", "junk", etc, but know one really has any details or back up for what they are saying.  For all we know, someone is upset because these didn't have heated toilet seats!  Teething issues are to be expected, but considering all that UP has now running around of these new EMD's, and that there hasn't been a lot of news of problems with them over all, I suspect that these engines are doing at least ok.

A couple of weeks ago, I spent a long weekend on the Blue Mountains of Oregon.  I was surprised about how many of these new EMD's that are actually running around now.  In all cases that I saw them, I didn't hear about any problems or failures with them pulling (or pushing) heavy trains on the 2.2% grades.  I did finally get to hear what they sound like under full load (ie Run 8) when I got to chase a westbound up to Meacham that had one of these new EMD tier 4 engines as a single DPU.  From above, all I could hear was the whine of the cooling system fans (kind'a sounded like a huge vacuum cleaner), but I couldn't really make out much in the way of sound from the prime mover itself.  It was remarkable how quiet it was (except for the fans), and it was shoving hard.



Date: 08/10/18 20:16
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: jimB

All of the photos are excellent, but it is great to capture a 21st century unit passing semaphores!

Jim



Date: 08/10/18 20:50
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: exhaustED

As a reminder, BNSF has an order for 10 of these units, supposedly for delivery late 2018... so maybe these test runs are to iron out issues before delivery.



Date: 08/10/18 23:14
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: coach

Thank goodness BNSF saved the Raton Line--can't do testing like this on a busy transcon mainline!   Just like we have "byways" to use instead of Interstates all the time, Raton is like a RR byway--more scenic, less traveled, but still useful.



Date: 08/11/18 05:34
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: ns1000

Thanks for the pics.



Date: 08/11/18 06:32
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: Hookdragkick

Just a cab away from looking like a Booster Unit; I wouldn't mind that. I've relieved a train that had two leading on a 8k ton manifest, but with only one hard pull (heavy grade) and the rest down hill, that's not much to judge by.

Posted from Android



Date: 08/11/18 06:42
Re: P4s T4s Semi 4s
Author: TexasRocket

These were parked in Trinidad for at least two weeks. I saw them Saturday before last wandering into town before camping overnight near Raton.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/11/18 09:53 by TexasRocket.



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