Western Railroad Discussion > Leaning Containers

Good afternoon,

So seems every few months BNSF sets out a stack car or set at Tehachapi due to a container leaning.  They set out at the siding off main 2 just east of the depot.  So what causes this?  Seems the bottom container would be sitting on the bottom and the top would be on top of the lower one.  Would one of the locking things fall out?   How would they fix this, we have seen them setout a few times, and then picked up a day or two later. No cranes came, and the containers are still on the car. 

Thank you in advance for any replies,

6088

Shifted load inside the container can cause it to lean.

          Yes, I believe you are correct. The bottom container would be on the bottom and top one would be on top. . . . . . . . ????

Usually they're loaded with pizza, hence the occasional leaning container of pizza. Thank you, I'll see myself out.  

skinem Wrote:
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> Usually they're loaded with pizza, hence the
> occasional leaning container of pizza. Thank you,
> I'll see myself out.  

Before you leave, got another one?  Made me laugh!

mapboy

mapboy Wrote:
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> skinem Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Usually they're loaded with pizza, hence the
> > occasional leaning container of pizza. Thank
> you,
> > I'll see myself out.  
>
> Before you leave, got another one?  Made me
> laugh!
>
> mapboy

Ditto!

Posted from Android

skinem Wrote:
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> Usually they're loaded with pizza, hence the occasional leaning container of pizza. Thank you,
> I'll see myself out.  

That was so bad it was really good!!! It took me a minute to catch that one - nice!!

There's a detector just west of Monolith that catches these.

Invariably, a leaning container is always a shifted load inside. 

In one oddball case I can remember, we had a single container arrive on a hitch car (spine) that had somehow moved off the 4 'dogs' that hold it in place and was rubbing against a wheel.  It over heated and caused the contents to catch on fire.  We were told they stopped the train somewhere in NY state and waited for the local fire department arrive to put it out.  They opened the doors, too, and sprayed water in there, too.  I suspect CSX Intermodal had a hefty payout for a total loss of a load.

Usually, like truck trailers, containers are filled as full as possible and are usually 100% full based on volume.  Some loads max out based on weight leaving the container less than 100% full.  Those are the ones that definitely need proper blocking and bracing inside to prevent the load from shifting.  There are slotted metal tracks along the inside walls of some containers that facilitate the shipper hooking straps to them to prevent movement.  Other times, they will nail 2x4s to the floor to keep stuff from sliding to the rear.  I've seen entire 'walls' of plywood against the load with 2x4s at the base, then diagonally placed 2x4s nailed to the floor 4-5 feet back to prevent the top of the plywood wall from leaning back.  Tee 2x4s were for heavy stuff.  Most often I saw giant inflatable bags to hold cases of whatever along the side walls and the bags created an aisle when deflated.  I've even seen fishnet type restraints in trailers of frozen foods.  How did I happen to see what's inside a lot of loads?  We'd get anywhere from 5 to 30 or more loads per month coming off the train that the seals had been broken.  The driver would bring them to the gate, we'd take pictures, fill out a form, put on a new seal, and call it in to HQ.

Usually, at the gate, we'd have no idea of what's a container coming in the gate.  But we were instructed to open up and inspect all incoming hazmat loads (we had maybe 3-5 come in per week) as well as all paper loads (giant rolls 7' high about 4' in diameter) to ensure everything was blocked and braced accordingly.  Interestingly, since I retired almost 6 years ago, they installed a 'drive through' gate scanner system that the ISRs like myself no longer need to go out and inspect everything, including loads, empties, tires, lights, and write up any defects.  Flat tires, burned out lights, even dog-tracking chassis don't get 'detected' until an outbound driver gets that chassis under a load he/she is taking out.  Saves CSX money at the cost of drivers losing an hour or more to get something fixed before they go out the gate.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/21/20 21:28 by BRAtkinson.

For whatever reason, it usually was the 'C' well. We used to tag northbounds with the high/wide detector at Sun Valley quite a bit. Of course the trains would stop between CP Roxford and CP Balboa and the car would not be leaning because it was in the curve which would straighten it up. This one scraped the inside of tunnel 25 in a few places. Photos were passed along to the UP because they wouldn't believe us maintainers--their crews were always right.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/21/20 22:50 by SP4360.

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Photo of that green container is hardly a leaner in general. Maybe if there are tunnels, but I see those on a daily basis and 9/10 times, you'll be told no, its not a leaner. I've seen a Carman go upto a trailer, use his little "L" shaped hand Guage, squint and say no. I mean, how good is that thing if not used on a tripod or held absolutely level.

Run of thumb: if your train is struck by a container or trailer leaning, then its a true leaner.

Posted from Android



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/21/20 23:09 by Hookdragkick.

skinem Wrote:
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> Usually they're loaded with pizza, hence the
> occasional leaning container of pizza. Thank you,
> I'll see myself out.  
Are you here till Thursday? Did you try the veal?

Heavy dense product all shifts to one side due to no blocking and bracing.  Rolled paper loads and bagged minerals seemed to be some of the worst offenders.  I do a lot of 15 pallet salt loads in 40' containers.  As the load is stretched out the lenght of the container, you end up with several pallets in the middle that can slide to the edge.  I've have loads shift due the pounding from a flat wheel spot while traveling accross the county.  I've had the container above my container get a load shift forcing mine to be set out and be inspected.  I've had shifted loads arrive in LA that are required to be fixed prior to being allowed out the gate for delivery.  Stuff happens.....

From my experience as a shipper, costs associated with a shifted load will be charged back against the shipper 99.99% of the time. Unless you’ve planted an impact recorder inside the can or trailer and can prove otherwise, the railroad will always claim the load shift resulted from improper blocking and bracing.

Posted from iPhone

OK, here's something I've always wanted to know.

On the dispatcher side - the only operating rules I've seen for 'blowover risk' are empty vs. loaded containers, i.e. either it's loaded or not and that flags the consist as subject to restrictions on movement on detected or forecast cross wind speed.  One well on a doublestack full of empties can flag a whole train, but...

I'm surprised its not more sophisticated.    I'd think if you had a 'light' load that cubed out vs. a fully grossed-out load, the heavy load would always go in the bottom, but does the loading crew ever actually now that?  Is that part of the loading routine? 

It's an exagerration but I'd think that you'd flag a container of styrofoam pellets a little different that a container full of car batteries.   

And considering the number of blowovers in the west in storm events that still happen, it would still appear to me that the science behind it is still needing more sophistication beyond just 'empty' or 'load'.   I've seen the modeling software and the science behind it, but I've also seen the mess when it doesn't appear to work.

Here's another common reason for leaning containers in a double stack well car:  the bottom container is improperly positioned in the well and is not situated on the pins like it should be.  This will cause both containers in the well to be leaning in one direction.  This situation should be caught at origin, but, in my many years of APL and Pacer Stacktrain experience, it occurred 3-4 times a year and caused set outs and subsequent delay of customer's freight.

Pete
Clio, California

Of course on containers that had crossed an ocean on a ship, depending on where the container was positioned on the ship it could have gone through a lot of rock and roll, especially if it was a rough crossing.
An improperly blocked and secured load could be shifting all over the place!

Load shifting at sea? Naw...that never happens.

https://youtu.be/j50ye8ADXok

Rich Melvin
Columbus, OH
My Web Site



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/20 13:37 by Rich_Melvin.

The High Wide  Detector says otherwise. It was set up to UP parameters, they came out  a few times to re-shoot the angles claiming we wern't maintaining it correctly. After checking all the angles, they shrugged their shoulders and left. So, that green container did set it off afterall. And yes, it isn't much,  there were containers that set off the detectors that were leaning more than this one, but when the equipment says it's leaning, then it's leaning.

Hookdragkick Wrote:
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> Photo of that green container is hardly a leaner
> in general. Maybe if there are tunnels, but I see
> those on a daily basis and 9/10 times, you'll be
> told no, its not a leaner. I've seen a Carman go
> upto a trailer, use his little "L" shaped hand
> Guage, squint and say no. I mean, how good is that
> thing if not used on a tripod or held absolutely
> level.
>
> Run of thumb: if your train is struck by a
> container or trailer leaning, then its a true
> leaner.
>
> Posted from Android

Years ago when departing the fuel pad westbound at KC, a steel coil fell through the floor of the last container in the last well, of the last car in the train. We drug it over a mile until somebody saw it coming through the fuel pad, tearing out track pans, switch heaters, and derailing the last truck, swinging that rear car over into the train on main 3. A shifted load that went straight down.

Posted from Android