Western Railroad Discussion > New CTC for the ex-SP Coast Line??

Unconfirmed info circulating around suggesting UP is the early stages of adding CTC from Ellwood (Goleta) to Guadalupe (minus the CTC island at Gaviota). If true I'm guessing this is being funded by the state of California. Supposedly the next phase is Guadalupe to East San Luis Obispo.

If anybody has better info I'd certainly like to hear it.

Allen

Posted from Android

Why spend that money for a few trains a day

Tie and rail replacement (and new ballast) somewhere between Ellwood and Guadalupe is in progress.   Also in progress (accpording to unconfirmed reports) is CTC to Guadalupe and bridge replacement somewhere between surf and Devon.

And talk about cutting tunnels to fit domestic double stacks.   Why?  Who knows.    My guess is the state is paying for it.   Would  explain everything except the tunnel thing, which, honestly, Im just repeating what I read.  Could be just more wishful thinking.

pdt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...And talk about cutting tunnels to fit domestic
> double stacks.   Why?  Who knows.    My
> guess is the state is paying for it.   Would 
> explain everything except the tunnel thing, which,
> honestly, Im just repeating what I read.  Could
> be just more wishful thinking.

That does sound like wishful thnking, since there's only four UP intermodal trains per day that would use it if detoured from Tehachapi.  Notching the tunnels would provide a back up route should there be a disaster over Tehachapi like the 1955 earthquake, but UP is too focused on OR to spend money on that.  They'd probably single stack up the Coast until the tracks were repaired.

mapboy

Just thinking, not out loud of course:

How much non-intermodal traffic is there ?  If ALL traffic were diverted to the Coast Line, then everything  between, say Bakersfield and Burbank could be sold to 'The State'.  Yermo - Las Vegas and the Colton - hill portion of the Palmdale cutoff go to Brightline.  Easier way to make money than, heaven forbid, trying to get and retain new freight business.  If there were such a plan, UP needs some good confidential MOU's......

SZ

Ties are on the ground Gudalupe main and siding headed east/south.  Unknown how far south they will continue.

Bridge over San Antonio Creek between Narlon and Devon on VAFB has been worked on and supposed to see major work at some point & time in the future.

Agree, CTC sounds overboard unless State is paying for it.

Josiah
MP 363



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/20 16:34 by Josiah.

I came down on #11 last week and, yes, there were new ties scattered from Guadalupe (RR) East well into VAFB (it got dark, so I'm not sure how far East).  There was staging going on for what looked like substantial work on the trestle at San Antonio Creek near Tangair.  I'm thinking I might go out to the trestle in the next week or so to see what's going on and get some photos.
It's great to see this investment-
Long Live The Coast!
SR

BoilingMan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I came down on #11 last week and, yes, there were
> new ties scattered from Guadalupe (RR) East well
> into VAFB (it got dark, so I'm not sure how far
> East).  There was staging going on for what
> looked like substantial work on the trestle at San
> Antonio Creek near Tangair.  I'm thinking I might
> go out to the trestle in the next week or so to
> see what's going on and get some photos.
> It's great to see this investment-
> Long Live The Coast!
> SR


BTW:  An outside contractor replaced a colvert on the UPRR near my place in Dutch Flat (Donner Pass) a year or so ago.  (I did a photo series on it)   The crew was out of the Salt Lake City area.  I asked where they were going next and the foreman said the UP had a trestle job for them on the Coast Line, but it was being delayed by red tape of some sort-  I have a feeling this might be that same crew and project.

I see no reason for UP to be doing this except maybe at the paid behest of the State, be interesting to see what's behind this.

Out 

BoilingMan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BoilingMan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I came down on #11 last week and, yes, there
> were
> > new ties scattered from Guadalupe (RR) East
> well
> > into VAFB (it got dark, so I'm not sure how far
> > East).  There was staging going on for what
> > looked like substantial work on the trestle at
> San
> > Antonio Creek near Tangair.  I'm thinking I
> might
> > go out to the trestle in the next week or so to
> > see what's going on and get some photos.
> > It's great to see this investment-
> > Long Live The Coast!
> > SR
>
>
> BTW:  An outside contractor replaced a colvert on
> the UPRR near my place in Dutch Flat (Donner Pass)
> a year or so ago.  (I did a photo series on it) 
>  The crew was out of the Salt Lake City area.  I
> asked where they were going next and the foreman
> said the UP had a trestle job for them on the
> Coast Line, but it was being delayed by red tape
> of some sort-  I have a feeling this might be
> that same crew and project.


Red tape with the Air Force and also the California Coastal Commission. The reason is the bridge is within 1500 feet of the mean high tide line. Plus that particular area is a refuge for a coastal bird.

Posted from Android

I kinda figured it was something like that. No Big- it’s always something’
SR

What is the status of Metrolink’s Santa Susana Pass tunnels with regard to double-stack clearances?

Posted from iPhone

Boiling Guy,
when you go shoot that bridge work maybe you could get that trestle crew to add some more rocks to that rock garden they built behind your place in Dutch Flats?
I really enjoyed that series!
Go

Top 10 things that will happen right after stack trains start running on the coast...

1. Two SFO-LA round trip pax trains
2. Passenger service to Santa Cruz and Davenport
3. Dunbarton Bridge restored to service
4. Scranton-New York service
5. MOM commuter trains in NJ
6. Track restored to Sydney, NS
7. Freight service returns to the Nevada Northern
8. NWP restored to Willits and then Eureka
9. Tennessee Pass
10. UPRR starts giving a rats ass about carload freight.

 

As the Coast is part of the National System, as defined on 1 May 1971, UP is required to maintain the level of service that was present on that date. This could well be what is occurring. There's no reason for the state to put up any money, unless they were getting something in return - such as additional psgr trains on the Coast. That has been batted around now for at least 15 years, and what UP wants for that to happen isn't something the state will pay for.

There is no regular thru frt service on the Coast. And there is no reason for regular thru frt service on the Coast, when there is a CTC-equipped route in the SJ valley.

The level of service in 1971 was totally different than the level of service provided today. The line is open and used/useable for thru trains and no one
is going to enforce anything beyond that. UP doesn't invest the apparent amount of money out of the goodness of their heart. It very well could be a 
prelude to selling the line to the state who everyone says its broke. 

Out 

By "Level of service", I mean maximum authorized speeds, number of slow orders, and signal systems. There are probably other criteria. 

There is certainly more CTC on the Coast than there was in 1971, because of state-supported investments to allow additional trains between LA, Golata, and SLO.  If there have been any MAS reductions, they have been few, and may be being remediated by the tie work.

There is no reason the believe that UP is interested in selling the Coast. Unlike SP when its LA Basin sales were occurring, UP does not need the cash.

When it comes to track, I believe that the lawyers who run most transportation companies these days, are the answer.

Spending a few million on maintenance  is nothing compared to what a wreck of a passenger train can cost, if the railroad is found guilty of perceived lack of maintenance.   It has nothing to do with the actual shape of the track at all, just what a lawyer can convince someone who knows nothing about railroads, that the track conditiuons are.   So one of the metrics in this game is...when was the ROW last rebuilt?     The railroad doesnt want to end up in court some day saying thet the track was last rehabbed 40 years ago.   So im guessing ...I'm just guessing...that there is a minimum time between track overhauls, that the UP maintains for legal purposes.    

Doesnt explain the tunnel rumor, but until there is actually a crew working on a tunnel...thats just a rumor...

JGFuller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> By "Level of service", I mean maximum authorized
> speeds, number of slow orders, and signal systems.
> There are probably other criteria. 
>
> There is certainly more CTC on the Coast than
> there was in 1971, because of state-supported
> investments to allow additional trains between LA,
> Golata, and SLO.  If there have been any MAS
> reductions, they have been few, and may be being
> remediated by the tie work.
>
> There is no reason the believe that UP is
> interested in selling the Coast. Unlike SP when
> its LA Basin sales were occurring, UP does not
> need the cash.

If UP really has a ton of cash on hand, why dont they just buy back stock to keep the stock price up and investors happy, rather than  squeezing their operations to the point where they know its hurting the company in th long run.   Personally, I think they are afraid of competition, no matter how far fetched it looks in our eyes.
 

It's more likely UP would add CTC islands. It would make more sense. As it is now the Amtrak conductor or assit conductor has to line the switches. If it were a CTC island its power switches.

Posted from Android



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/20 21:05 by bradleymckay.