Western Railroad Discussion > Metrolink Valley (Saugus Line) Where is southbound traffic?

In the recent months, I haven't seen any southbound traffic where its reroute or scheduled.
The only freights I know of that take this line currently are LOF-42, ZLCLT, ZLCTM.
There is a ZBRLC that would come down occasionally. But it used to be kind of common like around 30% chance it would take saugus.
I know Metrolink does not like freight on their precious passenger line, but I have a theory so back in April 28th 2024 the Brooklyn stalled and before this the Brooklyn was constantly under powered delaying Metrolinks causing the dispatcher to be a bit mad on the radio. Also some time before this UP routed the Brooklyn or maybe Seattle (Because they were chaning ISELC for IBRLC at the time), I forget on to the valley sub and Metrolink had no clue and got very mad but accepted him anyways afterward.  But I think this stalling was the beginning of the "end". So mid morning I check the Tehachapi Cams and low and behold the daily Brooklyn made a daylight appearance going with rush hour traffic so it had a decent chance of coming down other than the single engine which easily violated Metrolink's HP/t policy at the time (Which required ZLCLT and ZLCTM to have 5 engines no matter what size and 3 for the Brooklyn). But anyways we heard the Brooklyn trying to get permission to get on the valley sub, so we race out the house slam all the gear into the car and blast it to Vincent to meet him there. And as we are getting off Soledad on to Sierra Highway we hear him call out that he is stalled and is asking for further instructions. In the first picture you can see the Brooklyn just a few hundred feet from making the summit before it stalled on the notorious Vincent grade. (Lousy C45ACCTE I bet if it were a SD70ACe it could of made it). And during this whole ordeal which took around a hour and 15 for dispatcher to grant and him to get off and roll back on to Palmdale cutoff there was no Metrolinks for at least 40 track miles I believe the closest was Newhall and caused no problems afterward. In the 2nd picture he meets a Manifest in Palmdale Siding.
Also Metrolink's fault for even allowing such little HP/t to go on their valley sub. Also there were a few times where the Metrolink dispatcher would just for get about the Brooklyn after meeting a Metrolink in a siding causing him to drain his crew time and having to crew change on the Valley sub because they run out of crew time (Which they hate anything tieing down on their tracks). Or the dispatcher would get mad that he would have to give priority to make it to atleast Burbank siding or more preferably on to the River Sub because he was going to run out of crew time. Also I noticed a trend there is 2 Metrolinks dispatchers I forget their names but there is a man and a woman. The woman would almost never accept any southbound and when she did she would never push the Brooklyn down causing more delays sometimes or a way longer time for the Brooklyn to get down the Sub. If it was the guy it was the most likely the Brooklyn would come down and he would push him so hard sometimes and constantly ask for estimates for when he would make to a certain control point. He would make Metrolinks wait for the Brooklyn it was great, but really no longer than 5 minutes though.
Go a few days to May 4th 2024 we getting back home from a Barstow trip and we hear ELTLT symbol on the radio and we both were so confused and heard he was going to do some sort of move at Roxford. Then we see the ZLCLT (It was around 5:30pm very late ZLCLT) waiting at CP Balboa with the crew on the ground. We go over to Roxford St and we see the single sad engine going in the 3rd picture. Apparently what happened was the lead engine lost power and they needed another for Metrolinks engine policy and for some reason they were using only 4 in the lead so to follow Metrolinks policy and to have enough HP they got another. And this caused many Metrolinks to be late so strike 3 at this point. 
Fast forward to June 9th 2024 the first southbound train since April 28th comes down. I got word that there was a Brooklyn actually trying to come down so we got him and after this I was hopeful that Metrolink was happy again (They've done this in the past but more like a week or 2 max before they send a wave of southbounds back to back everyday to make up for it. Not months also its weird because its almost like "punishment" for the southbounds making a Metrolink Late) but they weren't happy.
And now more recently the last time anything came down south was September 2nd and it was ZBRLC30 which I wasn't in town to see sadly. And then ZBRLC01 broke on fire on the Fresno Sub and didn't come down. I was on the radio every time I saw the Brooklyn through the Tehachapi cams.
And then on Sep 8th 2024 I heard on the radio that the Brooklyn was contacting UP (Dispatcher 250) that whether he was going to take Metrolink (He didn't ask everyday prior). Because at the morning brief the said Metrolink is a possibility. After calling Metrolink no response happened per usual as would happen in the past more so than they "couldn't fit them in the schedule" if not that they would say you took to long to enter to sub so just take Palmdale cutoff and crew change at Colton. And ever since then I've given up hope to listen on the radio for bare-tables, ZBRLCs, and ILTLBs requesting to take the valley sub. And no southbound has been spotted since then. And I think it's because Metrolink does not want to deal with it anymore
I know the relationship between Metrolink and UP is sour compared to what it used to be (at least what I picked up from radio, judgment, and past trainorder discussions about the Valley sub). But I really don't know why the ZBRLC of lately has been running 4 engines in the front almost constantly and the ZLCLT and ZLCTM has been running 3 engines in the front when x<~90 or 4 engines in a 2x?x2 when x>~90. So power isn't a problem anymore because Metrolink finally woke up to the fact that huge HP/t won't do anything in terms of timing and costs UP extra money. Now since the Brooklyn is using 4 engines its a better time than ever.
Also I remember a document from 1992 which was the SP-Metrolink Saugus line and Coast line agreements revised many times and last in 2015(at least the version I could find). Points out that Metrolink can't refuse SP/UP usage of their trackage no matter what. UP pays metrolink huge sum of money annually for their trains to run on the valley sub in the tens of millions and they pay for maintenance, late commuters, and other fees. So I really don't know why they don't send more stuff down. And in more recent times the Gemco haulers have been CHRONICALLY LATE same with the ZLCLT and ZLCTM with stuff like ZLCTM and LOQ35 and LOF74 showing up in the day time sere val days of the week and seeing a back to back LOQ35 because one was 2 days late and problems because of that but that's another thing else I'll probably make a post on.
Other than the "final straw" it honestly could be because they have changed the Metrolink schedule so much now that there is "too many" which is sad to see this line just wither away with freight even more. I'm really in a search for a definite answer or more clues because for all I know is that the ZBRLC works like City of industry now and now the Saugus Line is actually wasteful in time. Or I also know that crews actually hate taking the Vally sub because instead of crew changing in Colton and letting some poor yard crew take it to the Shops and break it down. If they took the valley they would have to do it.

Thanks for reading my adventure/rant. I may of forgotten some stuff that I will add later if I remember and maybe some more photos of these moments that happened. I have more to come hopefully about the whole late trains weird stuff going on in the SFV and questions and hopefully answers to why. This is also my first post :)

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The issue is not always the HPT ratio, UP units now seem to have very frequent "events" linked to maintenance.
One evening the ZLCLT stopped to do a full reset 3 times between Palmdale Jct and Mojave and amazingly the
thing went up the hill near track speed without a problem. Another we're seeing more often is a link drop back
to the remotes which will instantly stop virtually anything on the Valley or Mojave, bringing even more ctrl+alt+del.

Out 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/24 13:36 by callum_out.

Having lived near Saugus for over 25 years, I've seen freight traffic drop off precipitously, down to the 2 westbounds mentioned.
I might see a single eastbound, usually on Saturday mornings.
Gone are the good old days of oil cans and rock trains.
I need to move.
TAH
 

Thank you for your interesting post and welcome!

Oliver Barrett

Great coverage of the Saugus line. I worked the line for years. Actually worked the work train that rehabilitate d the line.
One comment a yard crew does not take the train from West Colton to the Shops. A west end crew will take the train.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/24 20:43 by SanJoaquinEngr.

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The issue is not always the HPT ratio, UP units
> now seem to have very frequent "events" linked to
> maintenance.
> One evening the ZLCLT stopped to do a full reset 3
> times between Palmdale Jct and Mojave and
> amazingly the
> thing went up the hill near track speed without a
> problem. A, mnnother we're seeing more often is a
> link drop back
> to the remotes which will instantly stop virtually
> anything on the Valley or Mojave, bringing even
> more ctrl+alt+del.
>
> Out 
What does "a link drop back to the remotes" mean? Like DPU errors in communication?
But yeah I have noticed a lots of defects happening too mostly Hi-Wides because the containers are left open because of thieves and a couple hotboxes.
But that also brings me back to the Brooklyn every time they would ask for permission they would ask whether they had open containers or if they saw any open before going on. And if they did they wouldn't go down because it would "hit tunnels" even though they would not. On March 23th 2024 they asked if they had any open containers and they said they didn't but we were chasing him down from Mojave so we saw loads of them open. He got accepted and we were just waiting for the detector to go off and it did which is what the video plays. They slow rolled him to Vincent and he stayed the night there because the crew was almost out of time and they also called for the car department to get out there and close the containers which would take hours to get out there and finish the job. This also follows one of the big "incidents" to my theory of why the Brooklyn does not come down anymore.

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"link drop" is when the comm between the head end and the remotes is interrrupted, the remotes will continue
for a length of time but TPC notes the issue and requires action. As to the doors, anything around Mojave and
up the hill gets done by the responders.

Out 

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "link drop" is when the comm between the head end
> and the remotes is interrrupted, the remotes will
> continue
> for a length of time but TPC notes the issue and
> requires action. As to the doors, anything around
> Mojave and
> up the hill gets done by the responders.
>
> Out 
Yeah its weird sometimes though like the defect detectors just don't work sometimes. I see Hi-Wides all the time and only a handful actually get detected.

Thx for this writeup, love Soledad Cyn have shot a few SP trains in the 90s and some current Z Lathrop recently. Got lucky with an EB a while back climbing the grade towards Vincent. This is the time of the year to shoot the Canyon.

Very informative read, thanks.