Steam & Excursion > Sanding the flues at Disneyland/Knott's Berry Farm?

A recent thread about UP 4439, the last steam locomotive used in Class-1 revenue service in the Los Angeles, CA area, caused me to wonder about the steam locomotives that operate in the basin to this day.  The engines at Disneyland and Knott's Berry Farm reportedly burn diesel fuel, and I assume that accumulated soot their flues has to be cleaned out periodically.  Historically, railroads did this by "sanding" the flues, working the engine to create a draft while pouring sand through a small hole in the firebox door to scour out the soot.  The black clouds of smoke this process generates is what got the 4439 in trouble with the air pollution folks in LA back in 1956, a year after Disneyland opened and four years after Knott's "Ghost Town & Calico RR" made its debut.  How do the theme parks deal with soot problem?

I will say this, the speed of the locomotives in both parks will not allow sanding the flues. At DL, they take such good care of the locomotives, that I am sure they have a process that cleans out the flues in the shop area. As for Knotts, the same I am sure.

I vaguely remember when I was on a tender ride in the early 2000s they sanded the flues after leaving critter country while passing the Rivers of America.  That was almost 20 years ago so maybe things have changed.  Since then they stopped using the water tower at New Orleans Square so who knows.  It may have been designated as dangerous for all I know that a passenger will get a grain a sand in their eye.

Todd Clark
Canyon Country, CA
Trainorders.com

When I ran at the Henry Doorley Zoo in the ninetys we would sand the flues when climbing the back hill that was something like 4%. We did this on the test run at the beginging of opperation each day. Only did it again if the Fireman was using to much #2 Diesel and it wouldn't steam.
We did blow down every trip.
Steve

Before running the first revenue train of the day pulled by #1 (the Oregon) on the Washington Park & Zoo Railway at the Oregon Zoo we head out the east zoo perimeter gate and go several hundred feet down the out-of-service 1½-mile Washington Park Line to a point just below Siding 1.  First the boiler is blown down then we back up the 3½% grade to sand out the tubes.  When the Washington Park line was still in service we would occasionally make the same move with a revenue train en route to the Washington Park station if the tubes were getting pretty sooted up toward the end of a long service day.

The train in the video has a wheel chair-accommodating car added to the rear of the four coaches built to run with the steamer.  As built for the 1959 Oregon Centennial Exposition, the train had five coaches but one coach, along with a caboose, was sold many decades ago to the Omaha Zoo Railroad at the Henry Doorly Zoo.  I believe it is the second coach behind engine #119 seen on the Omaha Zoo Railroad's web page at http://www.omahazoo.com/train.  Originally the Oregon operated on a zoo loop and the Aerotrain operated to Washington Park.  However traffic to the Rose Garden at Washington Park increased so rapidly that before long the steamer with its five coaches started running to the park also.  As originally built, the primarily 3½% grade had one short section of well over 4% which was just too much for the steamer when pulling a full train.  That steep section was eventually regraded which allowed the Oregon to pull a wheelchair car behind the normal 4-car train but with a full five-car train it's right down on its knees over much of the route.

Sorry, no time to edit the video right now; it's just as shot.

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And there is quite a fight on now to save the remaining train. Was  promised to redo the track once some items were completed at the Zoo now they want to make it into another bike and walking trail figures as its Portland OR way of doing things.

I would venture to guess that they punch the flues out with a flue brush on a regular basis.  Probably in the morning before they light the engine off.  I wouldn't be suprised if they also have some sort of deal where a shop-vac sucks all the flue soot up, othersize it will go out the stack with the first decent exhaust.

When I worked at the Roaring Camp & Big Trees in CA back in 1979, there was a strict "no sanding" rule.  It stemmed from a geat paranoia of visible smoke.    We were forced to climb into the firebox every morning with a flue brush on a wire rope and punch out the flues.  It was a nasty, hot, job. A great way to start an already hot day.  We also had to wire brush the firebox.  On top of that, we were burgning un-treated waste oil.  Roaring Camp had its own tank truck which made the rounds to all the auto repair shops collecting waste oil. As it was unfiltered it included lots of other fun stuff, including lead that was still in gasoline.  The entire firebox was covered with gray deposits (probably lead....) that we had to brush off daily.

Once we had the engine punched out and brushed off we lit the fire and went about our business.  But all the dust was still in the firebox and in the smokebox that had to be disposed of.  We would back down to the depot with air set on train blowing all the dust out the stack.

Being a brilliant 20-year-old.  I determined that it looked like we were sanding the engne out.  The next day, instead of punching the flues out, before I started back to the depot, I dumped about 6 scoops of sand into the firebox, started back, set some air, opened her up,  Look!  We're blowing all the soot out!  

No one ever knew the difference, and I got away with not getting my daily dose of lead poisoning.  

Engine in the video sounds good.  What is it?  The idea of doing it in reverse is a good one.   All the crap doesn't fall on the engine and train.
I was told by an expert that you didn't have to be working the engine hard to sand the flues.  I guess if you wanted all that sand in the firebox being turned to glass you don't.  Gotta have a really good draft to get it all out.  You'll still have some sand in the smokebox, but not that much.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/22/19 20:36 by Frisco1522.

It's just like the Reynolds number connection in hydraulics flushing, you need turbulence and low
speed and turbulence only occurs in NASCAR.

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