Steam & Excursion > When you buy a steam locomotive does it come with a "Title"

Tos,    Like a car does a steam locomotive come with a title, i have never seen on would like to maybe frame one, just asking. tia   robert

robert162 Wrote:
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> Tos,    Like a car does a steam locomotive come
> with a title, i have never seen on would like to
> maybe frame one, just asking. tia   robert

No. Neither does a diesel electric unit. Only the ICC/FRA Form 4 certification for the steam locomotive boiler, or the ICC/FRA "Blue Card" for diesel electrics.

"Title" has to do with ownership, specifically when a conventional
bank loan is at stake.   Clear title is proof to any future buyer.
that there is no existing lien on the property.

Locos, cars and such are typically owned by investment firms and
insurance companies ( bringing high annual returns to the owners) .
RRs pay what amount-to a lease to the owners,

Typically the assets are depreciated over time, and the tax advantages
of depreciation cease when that period is up.  With freight cars, at the end
of the depreciation period, typically whole fleets of similar cars are offered for sale.

If cars are unused, but not yet depreciated, the owner ( banks, etc are still 
entitled to daily-accrued  payments, even if the cars are wrecked or parked for extended period).

If they are 'fully depreciated' cars can be sold at whatever the 'market' will support,
many are worth only scrap.

Locos are similar, but retain their value longer. 
Current technology Locos are very valuable, even if paid-off;  however,
Locos in excellent condition, & well proven Locos  ( like EMD 'Dash-2' models) are 
very reliable and bring top-dollar on the used loco market -- because they
are easily maintained and SOOO reliable, and new parts are easily obtained.

Few competitors to the used EMD Dash-2 products, , can being the same prices ---
reliability being the major issue.   

IMHO.

​W.
 



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/20 14:59 by wcamp1472.

When I/we bought Canadian Pacific Royal Hudson No. 2839 from the Canadian Center of Science and Industry, we got a letter from the director saying, thank you for the check, and when are you coming for it...       the rest is history.         P.S, the cheapest freight rate was under, a locomotive on its own wheels, going for scrap.

Pretty much everything on the SP had a "trust plate" indicating ownership.

Out 

callum_out Wrote:
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> Pretty much everything on the SP had a "trust
> plate" indicating ownership.
>
> Out 

Not in the early days of diesels, i.e. GP30s, GP35s, and DD35s. Back in the early to mid 1960s, the UP paid cash for their units, and thus each and every unit shipped from EMD had a stainless steel plate stating "OWNER Electro-Motive Division, General Motors Corporation". When the acceptance papers for whatever units, were signed each week in Omaha, those "EMD ownership" plates were removed, crated, and shipped back to EMD, for reuse on future units going to those few railroads that paid cash, i.e. did NOT finance their units.

There's no Title - but be sure to hang onto your Bill of Sale!  More than one museum has been involved in ownership disputes.

-LD

As depreciation allowances grew, through congressional acts & the IRS,
the wisdom of committing cash lost its favoritism.  

Wiser minds prevailed, as cash outlays became too costly, and
bookkeeping maneuvers kept the cash invested, for greater returns.
Inflation also augurs well for extending the pay off periods, when 
calculating expenditures in millions of dollars.

Low interest rates also make borrowing cheaper, and frees up more cash 
for stock and bond investment strategies.

Cash payments for hardware llike locos doesn't have much to recommend it,
considering other more rewarding, places to park the money, across the
investing 'world'.

You want to be good at having ALL your money work harder for you,
rather than pouring it down a rat hole.  
Have both locomotives AND your cash both earning money for you.

W.

And here I was going to assume it was "yes" and "your honor..."

Mary McPherson
Dongola, IL
Diverging Clear Productions

There's simple 'yes',  'no', & 'it depends.'
Many readers want to know the ''why' ...


Hope this helps as to how "big ticket" outlays 
are handled.

​W.
 

LarryDoyle Wrote:
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> There's no Title - but be sure to hang onto your
> Bill of Sale!  More than one museum has been
> involved in ownership disputes.

When Robert Claytor decided to restore N&W 1218 to operating status, NS gave quite a bit of consideration to Steamtown for a "clear title".

ts1457 Wrote:
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> LarryDoyle Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > There's no Title - but be sure to hang onto
> your
> > Bill of Sale!  More than one museum has been
> > involved in ownership disputes.
>
> When Robert Claytor decided to restore N&W 1218 to
> operating status, NS gave quite a bit of
> consideration to Steamtown for a "clear title".

More like "clear ownership" of 1218, as there was/is no "title".

Like a gift of a fully operational N&W GP9, to Steamtown, while at
Bellows Falls, Vt.

W.

Posted from iPhone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/16/20 06:09 by wcamp1472.

Thanks for the info