Steam & Excursion > FDR Funeral Train - Southern Railway Steam Engines

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The FDR Funeral Train came up and I had asked what locomotives were used. After a little digging I found out, and thought I'd post what I found.

11:13 am Friday April 13, 1945 - depart Warm Springs, GA - Warm Springs to Atlanta, GA; 1262 and 1337

Atlanta to Greenville, SC; 1409 and 1394 

Greenville to Salisbury, NC; 1401 and 1385 

Salisbury to Monroe, VA; 1400 and 1367 

Monroe, VA to Washington, D.C.; 1366 and 1406

 PRR handled the train to New York with a GG1 (PRR 4800?)

New Haven .... Penn Station to New Rochelle?  EP-4's ?

and NYC Hudson 5283 from Harmon or Mott Haven to Hyde Park

Image shows the train arriving in Atlanta from Warm Springs.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/25 06:40 by train1275.

---

Thank you for the information and photograph.  The 25th anniversary issue of Trains Magazine from November 1965 includes another photo of the train arriving at Hyde Park behind NYC 5283.

I wonder how PRR, New Haven, and NYC routed the train through New York City, including the electric transition, involving both catenary and third rail.  Presumably the 5283 took over at Croton-Harmon. 

inrdjlg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I wonder how PRR, New Haven, and NYC routed the
> train through New York City, including the
> electric transition, involving both catenary and
> third rail.  Presumably the 5283 took over at
> Croton-Harmon. 

Guessing via Mott Haven, but I don't know details.
Yes, 5283 out of Harmon I presume, but not sure of that either.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/25 06:33 by train1275.

Great historical photo and information.
Bob

The operation from New York City to Hyde Park for the funeral there was via Mott Haven.

Bob Withers' fine book, The President Travels by Train (TLC Publishing, 1996), records all of the details of the FDR funeral train, with photos, in a long section, pp. 346 - 363.

Per that account (starting on p. 358), there were three trains on PRR from Washington Union Station after the funeral service in Washington in the East Room of the White House. The first train carried the president's casket with the Roosevelt and Truman families, Cabinet members, heads of major government agencies, and Secret Service officers. The second was for members of Congress, the Supreme Court, diplomats and other high-ranking officials. The third was for an escort of 454 Marine officers and men.

Southern had of course previously brought the president's remains to Washington from Warm Springs, Ga. and via Atlanta, as depicted in the wonderful photo above in this thread (and which is not in the Withers book).

Leaving from Washington on PRR on Saturday evening, April 14, 1945, the first section funeral train was so heavy at 17 heavyweight cars behind two specially prepared GG1s (the train included two heavily armored cars used in POTUS service, the Roald Amundsen and the Ferdinand Magellan) that the train stalled three times getting started, one time breaking a coupler. The second and third trains departed without problems, although late, with the second section departing 27 minutes late at 10:47 PM. It had a late addition of two baggage cars with 15 truck loads of flowers that had shown up at Union Station to go to the burial site in Hyde Park, despite requests from the Roosevelt family for no flowers. The first section with the president's remains, scheduled to depart at 10:20 PM, finally left Washington at 11:03, 39 minutes late.

The funeral train arrived Pennsylvania Station in New York at 4:36 AM Sunday morning, April 15, 1945, using tracks 11 and 12, which had direct access to the Hudson River Tunnels without change of track, a standard procedure for POTUS movements. The locomotives were changed under heavy guard, and the train was then pulled backwards through the East River Tunnel, across Hell Gate Bridge, and then on to Mott Haven Yard, using the New Haven Branch from New Rochelle.

At Mott Haven, Secret Service men, local police and military police kept a guard cordon around the train, even to having soldiers with sub-machine guns in position on a viaduct above 156th Street. MPs patrolled local streets around the yard to maintain security and to keep people away from the train and out of the yard.

The funeral train was to leave Mott Haven first on Sunday morning April 15, with the congressional train just behind, but those plans were changed, and the congressional train left for Hyde Park first.  Not mentioned was the departure time of the third train with the Marines. From Mott Haven of course the route was via NYC down the along the Harlem River to Spuyten Duyvil, then north up the Hudson Valley to Hyde Park, arriving at the siding there below the Roosevelt estate at 8:40 AM. At Harmon, NYC Hudson 5283 coupled on for the trip up the valley to Hyde Park, along with  an additional NYC buffet coach, making for a final and very heavy 18-car train. That Hudson had its work cut out for it, even on the Water Level Route.

While the funeral service proceeded, the train was pulled backwards to Poughkeepsie for cleaning and restocking, then returning to Hyde Park for a scheduled 11:30 AM departure, which was 20 minutes late at 11:50 AM. The congressional train left at 12:18 PM, with both operating reverse route back to Mott Haven, where the funeral train paused from 1:50 to 2:50 PM. Then on to Penn Station and back to Washington on PRR via the reverse route. The funeral train arrived back in Washington 40 minutes late at 8:35 PM, Sunday, April 15, 1945.

The consist of the funeral train out of Washington DC, which had some of the more deluxe heavyweight Pullmans in the company's fleet in the consist, is recorded as follows on pp. 394-395 of Withers' book: Pullman 12-section 1-drawing room sleeper Crusader Rose;  B&O combine 1401 (communications car); Pullman 6-compartment, 3-drawing room sleeper Glen Willow; Pullman 7-compartment 2-drawing room sleepers Glengyle and Treonta; Pullman 6-compartment 3-drawing room sleeper Glen Gordon; diner 4478 (PRR?), Pullman 6-compartment 3-drawing room sleepers Glen Dell, Glen Lodge, Glen Canyon, Wordsworth, Glen Brook and Howe; diner 4497 (PRR?); Pullman private car Roald Amundsen (Pres. Truman's party); Pullman private car Ferdinand Magellan (Mrs. Roosevelt); and Pullman 7-compartment buffet / lounge Conneaut (Pres. Roosevelt's remains).

MC



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/25 09:12 by ironmtn.

Very interesting, thanks.

Thanks ironmtn for those details !



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/25 09:03 by train1275.

Please include me as appreciative of all those details, MC.  Very illuminating.

-John

Purely from memory, Cooksey and Surratt were the North Charlotte district engineers out of Greenville SC. Engineer O B. Surratt on the second Ps-4 was the great uncle of the late Steve Surratt. Some NC railfans and modelers may remember Steve for his wonderful train store located across the street from Spencer Shops - The Little Choo-Choo Shop. Box Childers was one of the firemen on the train. Bill Sams was the Greenville hostler who assembled the two Ps-4's and secured the roundhouse flag across the front of the 1401. The 1401 was said to be the only decorated engine on the SOU Warm Springs-Washington leg of the trip. The SOU had one of our last new heavyweight baggage cars on the train to Washington. I think it was built 1941 by Bethlehem and maybe the 543. These baggs remained in service through the mid-70's sometimes hauling sealed bulk mail that late.

In the 70's when president Graham Claytor and Master Mechanic Bill Purdue pursued getting the 1401 out of the Smithsonian, Mr. Claytor offered to replace the 1401 with the GG1 that pulled the FDR train.

SOU had the first and last Ps-4's among the engines pulling the train (1366 and 1409). I remember the 1409 as the PS4 originally having an extended smokebox with a Coffin feedwater heater inside. It was built by Baldwin in 1928. Working out of Atlanta to Greenville was the 1394, one of the green 1926 ALCO-Richmond Ps-4's originally lettered for the Crescent Limited.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/25 10:01 by Notch7.

Notch7 Wrote:
 Working
> out of Atlanta to Greenville was the 1394, one of
> the green 1926 ALCO-Richmond Ps-4's originally
> lettered for the Crescent Limited.

Southern tried to donate 1394 to the City of Atlanta, but mayor Hartsfield turned it down. After he retired from mayor he ran Lakewood Park and would've scrapped A&WP 290, displayed there at the time, had the Southern not stepped in and moved it to Inman Yard.

Roald Amundsen survives nicely restored and on display at the McCormick-Stillman Railroad Park in Scottsdale, AZ.

ironmtn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bob Withers' fine book, The President Travels by
> Train (TLC Publishing, 1996), records all of the
> details of the FDR funeral train, with photos, in
> a long section, pp. 346 - 363.

That is indeed a great book. 

Very appreciative of the information, including the reference to Mr. Withers' book.  I remember the two-part article that he authored for Trains Magazine, I believe during the 1980s, regarding President Eisenhower's trains.  The first part covered Ike's campaign train in 1952; the follow up covered the funeral train in 1969.  (Talk about special trains:  Ike's funeral train from Washington, D.C. to Abilene, Kansas, ran less than a year after Robert Kennedy's funeral train from New York to Washington.  Though definitely not a funeral train, the Golden Spike Centennial Limited ran only a few weeks after Ike's train.)

A few years ago I caught part of a TV interview with Mr. Withers on CSPAN, just after his book had come out.  

A good read.

---

ironmtn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The operation from New York City to Hyde Park for
> the funeral there was via Mott Haven.
>
> Bob Withers' fine book, The President Travels by
> Train (TLC Publishing, 1996), records all of the
> details of the FDR funeral train, with photos, in
> a long section, pp. 346 - 363.
>
> Per that account (starting on p. 358), there were
> three trains on PRR from Washington Union Station
> after the funeral service in Washington in the
> East Room of the White House. The first train
> carried the president's casket with the Roosevelt
> and Truman families, Cabinet members, heads of
> major government agencies, and Secret Service
> officers. The second was for members of Congress,
> the Supreme Court, diplomats and other
> high-ranking officials. The third was for an
> escort of 454 Marine officers and men.
>
> Southern had of course previously brought the
> president's remains to Washington from Warm
> Springs, Ga. and via Atlanta, as depicted in the
> wonderful photo above in this thread (and which is
> not in the Withers book).
>
> Leaving from Washington on PRR on Saturday
> evening, April 14, 1945, the first section funeral
> train was so heavy at 17 heavyweight cars behind
> two specially prepared GG1s (the train included
> two heavily armored cars used in POTUS service,
> the Roald Amundsen and the Ferdinand Magellan)
> that the train stalled three times getting
> started, one time breaking a coupler. The second
> and third trains departed without problems,
> although late, with the second section departing
> 27 minutes late at 10:47 PM. It had a late
> addition of two baggage cars with 15 truck loads
> of flowers that had shown up at Union Station to
> go to the burial site in Hyde Park, despite
> requests from the Roosevelt family for no flowers.
> The first section with the president's remains,
> scheduled to depart at 10:20 PM, finally left
> Washington at 11:03, 39 minutes late.
>
> The funeral train arrived Pennsylvania Station in
> New York at 4:36 AM Sunday morning, April 15,
> 1945, using tracks 11 and 12, which had direct
> access to the Hudson River Tunnels without change
> of track, a standard procedure for POTUS
> movements. The locomotives were changed under
> heavy guard, and the train was then pulled
> backwards through the East River Tunnel, across
> Hell Gate Bridge, and then on to Mott Haven Yard,
> using the New Haven Branch from New Rochelle.
>
> At Mott Haven, Secret Service men, local police
> and military police kept a guard cordon around the
> train, even to having soldiers with sub-machine
> guns in position on a viaduct above 156th Street.
> MPs patrolled local streets around the yard to
> maintain security and to keep people away from the
> train and out of the yard.
>
> The funeral train was to leave Mott Haven first on
> Sunday morning April 15, with the congressional
> train just behind, but those plans were changed,
> and the congressional train left for Hyde Park
> first.  Not mentioned was the departure time of
> the third train with the Marines. From Mott Haven
> of course the route was via NYC down the along the
> Harlem River to Spuyten Duyvil, then north up the
> Hudson Valley to Hyde Park, arriving at the siding
> there below the Roosevelt estate at 8:40 AM. At
> Harmon, NYC Hudson 5283 coupled on for the trip up
> the valley to Hyde Park, along with  an
> additional NYC buffet coach, making for a final
> and very heavy 18-car train. That Hudson had its
> work cut out for it, even on the Water Level
> Route.
>
> While the funeral service proceeded, the train was
> pulled backwards to Poughkeepsie for cleaning and
> restocking, then returning to Hyde Park for a
> scheduled 11:30 AM departure, which was 20 minutes
> late at 11:50 AM. The congressional train left at
> 12:18 PM, with both operating reverse route back
> to Mott Haven, where the funeral train paused from
> 1:50 to 2:50 PM. Then on to Penn Station and back
> to Washington on PRR via the reverse route. The
> funeral train arrived back in Washington 40
> minutes late at 8:35 PM, Sunday, April 15, 1945.
>
> The consist of the funeral train out of Washington
> DC, which had some of the more deluxe heavyweight
> Pullmans in the company's fleet in the consist, is
> recorded as follows on pp. 394-395 of Withers'
> book: Pullman 12-section 1-drawing room
> sleeper Crusader Rose;  B&O combine 1401
> (communications car); Pullman 6-compartment,
> 3-drawing room sleeper Glen Willow; Pullman
> 7-compartment 2-drawing room sleepers Glengyle and
> Treonta; Pullman 6-compartment 3-drawing room
> sleeper Glen Gordon; diner 4478 (PRR?), Pullman
> 6-compartment 3-drawing room sleepers Glen Dell,
> Glen Lodge, Glen Canyon, Wordsworth, Glen Brook
> and Howe; diner 4497 (PRR?); Pullman private car
> Roald Amundsen (Pres. Truman's party); Pullman
> private car Ferdinand Magellan (Mrs. Roosevelt);
> and Pullman 7-compartment buffet / lounge
> Conneaut (Pres. Roosevelt's remains).
>
> MC

The train was facing north, all the way from Warm Springs. so it would not have been pulled backwards through the East River tunnels. 
There was no physical connection at New Rochelle to turn south from the Hell Gate line to Mott Haven. The train pulled north, clear of 
the junction. The lead NH EP-4 cut of while a second NH EP-4 coupled on the rear and pulled the train backwards to Mott Haven where a New York Central Hudson
wa prepositioned to take the train north to Hyde Park. There was a pilot train ahead of the train on the Hudson Division, and I presume on the other railroads as well,
as that is SOP for POTUS moves.

It's interesting the grades on the Hudson Line are so gentle that one Hudson 4-6-2 could do the work of two GG-1 locomotives on the Pennsy. 

yankingeorgia Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> The train was facing north, all the way from Warm
> Springs. so it would not have been pulled
> backwards through the East River tunnels. 
> There was no physical connection at New Rochelle
> to turn south from the Hell Gate line to Mott
> Haven. The train pulled north, clear of 
> the junction. The lead NH EP-4 cut of while a
> second NH EP-4 coupled on the rear and pulled the
> train backwards to Mott Haven where a New York
> Central Hudson
> was prepositioned to take the train north to Hyde
> Park. There was a pilot train ahead of the train
> on the Hudson Division, and I presume on the other
> railroads as well, as that is SOP for POTUS moves.

Thanks for that information.

It seemed to me as well that changing directions would be unnecessary at Penn Station. It turns out that I reported that part of his account incorrectly. It makes no statement about proceeding backwards through the East River Tunnel. It does however state: "It was pulled backward into Mott Haven yard in the Bronx, via the New Haven Branch from New Rochelle, and paused there from 6:20 to 6:40 a.m." My apologies for the error.

There is a physical connection from the Hell Gate Line to the NH line to Mott Haven and Grand Central at Shell Interlocking / NH Interlocking Tower 22 at New Rochelle. As you suggest, the train could have pulled from Penn Station to Shell and past the junction with an NH motor on the head end as it had operated from Georgia. Then another NH motor could have coupled onto the rear to pull it back south down to Mott Haven.

Such a move would bring the train into Mott Haven rear-end first (as Withers' book states), since there is no wye at Shell / 22. My guess is that the train was therefore wyed near Mott Haven on the wye at E. 149th St. that connects the NH Harlem Line with the NYC line up to the Hudson valley so that it could proceed to Hyde Park with the Ferdinand Magellan and Conneaut on the rear, as the train had operated from Georgia.  

Photos in Bob Withers' book show the train moving toward Hyde Park behind Hudson 5283 at Cold Spring, NY (p. 353) with the added NYC coach, and the sleeper for train staff and the B&O combine that were originally in the consist, all on the head-end behind the engine. Another photo at Cold Spring shows the Ferdinand Magellan and Conneaut bringing up the rear of the train (p.356), the same as the train had left Georgia. And a photo on p. 351  shows the coffin in place on a horse-drawn caisson next to the Conneaut on which it had ridden, with well-shined brass marker lamps in place on Conneaut, further indicating it had indeed been on the rear of the train.

Regrettably, Withers' book does not clearly indicate in the end notes the source(s) for his discussion of the movement in the New York area. That said, all such views as noted above would logically indicate that the train had been turned somewhere after Penn Station. The only locations I know of would be the wye at Mott Haven, or the balloon track at Sunnyside. Of those two, using the wye at Mott Haven seems the more logical to me. 

Withers' book does not explicitly mention pilot trains for the Roosevelt funeral train, nor did I. Elsewhere in his book he discusses those many times and in various contexts as a standard part of POTUS movements. So my guess is that by the time the reader has reached the discussion of the Roosevelt funeral train at the end of the book, the author would assume that the reader had a thorough understanding of their role, with no further need to mention them again. Certainly I understood that a pilot train would have always preceded any POTUS movement like this. Thanks for reminding us of that part of the operation.

One final note. I incorrectly stated above that the photo of the funeral train passing by the military honor guard at Atlanta was not in Bob Withers' book. It is in fact in the book, on p. 348. Sorry again for the error.

MC



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/10/25 22:20 by ironmtn.

The NY Times had several articles from the press pool on the following train. No useful details.

I will take a look at the New Yorker archive later.

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