European Railroad Discussion > Bizarre Italian Steam

I have posted before pics from the weekly steam trains run every Spring and Autumn on a circular route south of Siena. casco17 recently posted pics showing the rolling stock parked during the week at Siena.

This clip shows one run, in May this year, powered by a 2-8-0 freight loco, but (like many others) rebuilt after the war with a Franco-Crosti boiler that exhausts towards the rear of the boiler.


This modification was tested in the UK in the mid-1950s on ten new build 2-10-0s, but seems to have been a failure. Were these designs ever tried anywhere else?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/25/17 16:07 by spflow.

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I could *cough cough* perhaps see why *cough* that these might *cough cough* have been deemed a total success *cough*

What was the theory behind the exhaust stack placed there ?? Good grief, the poor engine crew enduring that. Doug

hoggerdoug Wrote:
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> What was the theory behind the exhaust stack
> placed there ?? Good grief, the poor engine crew
> enduring that. Doug

Good question! I believe the idea was that thermal efficiency was raised by the boiler effectively having to double back on itself and used to preheat the water. In the UK the few examples could also operate conventionally when starting out, and also had a regular stack in the usual position at the front. By the time I ever saw any at Cricklewood depot (1D) in north London in the late 1950s, they were being operated conventionally, and simply looked very dirty!

Whether this change actually helped I really don't know - several hundred locos were similarly treated, and lasted in service until the early 1970s although having been first built in the period 1910 - 1925. Presumably the change wasn't a total disaster. but this is Italy!

(subsequent edit) Mea culpa! I got it wrong! These engines were new builds in the 1950s, but lasted at least 20 years.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/28/17 01:17 by spflow.

That's one beautifully restored and well-maintained matched set of vintage passenger cars behind the locomotive!
- Doug Debs

DWDebs/2472 Wrote:
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> That's one beautifully restored and
> well-maintained matched set of vintage passenger
> cars behind the locomotive!

I agree. They date from the 1930s, and until the early 1980s these carriages were pretty well commonplace all over Italy, but they were repaced almost completely by the end of the decade. Because of this there were large numbers available for preservation.

They have steel panelled bodies, wooden seats which were surprisingly comfortable, and are known as "centoporte" (a hundred doors, for obvious reasons).

I believe that quite a few have been saved. Does anyone else know precisely how many?

Wow what a strange exhaust arrangement. I ran the video a couple of times and the third time I paused it to zoom in on the fireman standing in the gangway and he looks like he just crawled out of a coal mine for sure. I am glad I ran and fired front end exhaust locomotives.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

That's different, but I am sticking with my belief that even the ugliest steam locomotive looks pretty damn good!

ts1457 Wrote:
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> That's different, but I am sticking with my belief
> that even the ugliest steam locomotive looks
> pretty damn good!

And sound good too!

I suspect that the Franco Crosti boiler is an example of a development which came too late to save the steam locomotive. When BR and DB were building FC versions of their heavy freight locomotives the die was already cast and the fate of steam had been sealed.

The Franco-Crosti boiler was just another form of feedwater heater. Instead of using just the energy left in the exhaust steam to pre-heat boiler feedwater, it used energy left in the flue gasses by routeing them through a secondary heat exchanger that was much like the regular boiler with fire tubes and exhausting back near the cab. It was used on some European railways, particularly in Italy.

The German troop train pursuing Frank Sinatra and Trevor Howard in Von Ryan's Express is hauled by a Franco Crosti boilered locomotive, complete with SS insignia.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/16/17 16:01 by 86235.

86235 Wrote:
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> The German troop train pursuing Frank Sinatra and
> Trevor Howard in Von Ryan's Express is hauled bus
> Franco Crosti boilered locomotive, complete with
> SS insignia.

Nick you should get out more!

86235 Wrote:
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> The German troop train pursuing Frank Sinatra and
> Trevor Howard in Von Ryan's Express is hauled bus
> Franco Crosti boilered locomotive, complete with
> SS insignia.

Nick, you should get out more!