Railroaders' Nostalgia > Metrolink 800

Not sure how much the old girl will be around, but let’s face it, the writing’s on the wall. I just want to say that I am proud to have had the opportunity to operate an F40PH. “They just don’t make ‘em like they used to.” EMD did things (the little things) right! Not so sure now.

Posted from iPhone

Out of service and by now should have had the hole drilled in her block.  Sale for scrap.

Unable to save her for historic museums.

Which is ridiculous. Thanks CARB.

mundo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Out of service and by now should have had the hole
> drilled in her block.  Sale for scrap.
>
> Unable to save her for historic museums.

mundo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Out of service and by now should have had the hole
> drilled in her block.  Sale for scrap.
>
> Unable to save her for historic museums.

Oh, they can save her, they just can't save that 645 inside of her.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> mundo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Out of service and by now should have had the
> hole
> > drilled in her block.  Sale for scrap.
> >
> > Unable to save her for historic museums.
>
> Oh, they can save her, they just can't save that
> 645 inside of her.

Why not? Just because a hole was "drilled in the block", doesn't mean that said hole can't simply be welded up. Remember that EMD 2-Stroke Cycle crankcases are weldments, and any and all sorts of damage can be repaired by a qualified welder, who is NOT in any hurry.

I’ve often wondered the same thing. What damage can you actually do by drilling a hole in an EMD 645 engine? And is there actually a requirement to do so? Nothing there take pressure, nothing is so permanent that it can’t be replaced. About the only thing they could do that would render the engine unfavorable to use is cut the crankshaft at the flywheel. And even that can be repaired, just not really all that economically. The way that they’re built, you could probably blow a hole in the side of it with a tank and still patch it up enough to make it run.

HotWater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > mundo Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Out of service and by now should have had the
> > hole
> > > drilled in her block.  Sale for scrap.
> > >
> > > Unable to save her for historic museums.
> >
> > Oh, they can save her, they just can't save
> that
> > 645 inside of her.
>
> Why not? Just because a hole was "drilled in the
> block", doesn't mean that said hole can't simply
> be welded up. Remember that EMD 2-Stroke Cycle
> crankcases are weldments, and any and all sorts of
> damage can be repaired by a qualified welder, who
> is NOT in any hurry.

The requirements of the grant from the CARB was that the prime mover has to be "destroyed", i.e. permamently removed from service.
They could give a flip about the rest of the locomotive. They just care about the part that pollutes.
So if you took the money you have to comply with the conditions of the grant. Otherwise they will try to get their money back since the conditions of the grant were not fulfilled.
Repairing the block and operating it within California would violate the terms of the grant.
So for SCAX 800 it's either repower the unit with a Tier 4 compliant engine or convert it to a NPCU or donate it to a museum minus it's engine.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The requirements of the grant from the CARB was
> that the prime mover has to be "destroyed", i.e.
> permamently removed from service.
> They could give a flip about the rest of the
> locomotive. They just care about the part that
> pollutes.
> So if you took the money you have to comply with
> the conditions of the grant. Otherwise they will
> try to get their money back since the conditions
> of the grant were not fulfilled.
> Repairing the block and operating it within
> California would violate the terms of the grant.
> So for SCAX 800 it's either repower the unit with
> a Tier 4 compliant engine or convert it to a NPCU
> or donate it to a museum minus it's engine.

There is a story (don't know if it is true) that several of the trucks that LA County Sanitation Districts "scrapped" by drilling holes into the block (as a result of a CARB and SCAQMD program) were sold to a scrapper, sent to Mexico, the engine blocks welded and the trucks repainted, shipped to a used truck dealer in Fontana and sold to local container draymen.

jst3751 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The requirements of the grant from the CARB was
> > that the prime mover has to be "destroyed",
> i.e.
> > permamently removed from service.
> > They could give a flip about the rest of the
> > locomotive. They just care about the part that
> > pollutes.
> > So if you took the money you have to comply
> with
> > the conditions of the grant. Otherwise they
> will
> > try to get their money back since the
> conditions
> > of the grant were not fulfilled.
> > Repairing the block and operating it within
> > California would violate the terms of the
> grant.
> > So for SCAX 800 it's either repower the unit
> with
> > a Tier 4 compliant engine or convert it to a
> NPCU
> > or donate it to a museum minus it's engine.
>
> There is a story (don't know if it is true) that
> several of the trucks that LA County Sanitation
> Districts "scrapped" by drilling holes into the
> block (as a result of a CARB and SCAQMD program)
> were sold to a scrapper, sent to Mexico, the
> engine blocks welded and the trucks repainted,
> shipped to a used truck dealer in Fontana and sold
> to local container draymen.

As soon as they tried to register those vehicles the VIN would give away their past.

OK you experrts on saving her.  OERM tried several angles and turned down.

Yes, its craps, but such is live in today's age.

mundo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OK you experrts on saving her.  OERM tried
> several angles and turned down.
>
> Yes, its craps, but such is live in today's age.

Turned down as in Metrolink wanted too much money or what?

SP4360 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Which is ridiculous. Thanks CARB.

I was in the LA Basin last week, working a couple of gigs, for the first time in a couple of decades. One of them was short haul intermodal between the ports and the Inland Empire. My colleague and I were at San Berdoo on the ped bridge. He took this picture then immediately pulled up the air quality map. LA air is better than it was, but the IE still has air you can chew. I understand why CARB does what they do.

TAW

---

TAW, you were working as one of those dreaded consultants that are regularly roasted at stake on TO?   

Growing up in SoCal, I’m a supporter of everything done to clean up the air, most of the low hanging fruit is gone and Now they are dealing with the hard stuff.  

Question, how many of you went/contacted Metrolink to oppose the conversion to the new locomotives?   

JohnM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TAW, you were working as one of those dreaded
> consultants that are regularly roasted at stake on
> TO?   

Yup. Everybody Knows that the consultant stereotype applies to anyone in that business.

When I was a train dispatcher, I was regularly roasted. When I was Asst. Chief Dispatcher, I was regularly roasted, when I was developing BN service plans, I was regularly roasted, when I was cutting in the Santa Fe TSS Information System on BN lines, I was regularly roasted, .... It's part of the job.

If you are upsetting everyone equally, it's probably a sign of doing good work.

TAW
 

TAW Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SP4360 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Which is ridiculous. Thanks CARB.
>
> I was in the LA Basin last week, working a couple
> of gigs, for the first time in a couple of
> decades. One of them was short haul intermodal
> between the ports and the Inland Empire. My
> colleague and I were at San Berdoo on the ped
> bridge. He took this picture then immediately
> pulled up the air quality map. LA air is better
> than it was, but the IE still has air you can
> chew. I understand why CARB does what they do.
>
> TAW

Yeah, the air in the Riverside / San Bernardino area has gotten a bit worse lately after years of improvement.
And the direct cause is all of the trucks that are at all of the new mega warehouses that have sprung up all around the Inland Empire.
Many of these warehouses take in Marine containers on one side and send out Domestic containers on the other.
Which is one of the reasons why the BNSF San Bernardino ramp is so busy. Also why they have about a half dozen lawsuits from the neighbors pending too.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> And the direct cause is all of the trucks that are
> at all of the new mega warehouses that have sprung
> up all around the Inland Empire.
> Many of these warehouses take in Marine containers
> on one side and send out Domestic containers on
> the other.

That's what we are working on.

TAW

I don't have a problem with CARB as a whole. Instead of destroying the block, why not just say this thing can't be used in CA? 1 engine doesn't make as much polutants as the trucks and so called hybrids running in 1 day. Send it packing. BTW, I grew up in that fine 60's air that the autombile, trucks, jets and industries packed intot the basin.  Let's not forget about Chino dairy farm cow farts either.

TAW Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SP4360 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Which is ridiculous. Thanks CARB.
>
> I was in the LA Basin last week, working a couple
> of gigs, for the first time in a couple of
> decades. One of them was short haul intermodal
> between the ports and the Inland Empire. My
> colleague and I were at San Berdoo on the ped
> bridge. He took this picture then immediately
> pulled up the air quality map. LA air is better
> than it was, but the IE still has air you can
> chew. I understand why CARB does what they do.
>
> TAW

SP4360 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't have a problem with CARB as a whole.
> Instead of destroying the block, why not just say
> this thing can't be used in CA? 1 engine doesn't
> make as much polutants as the trucks and so called
> hybrids running in 1 day. Send it packing. BTW, I
> grew up in that fine 60's air that the autombile,
> trucks, jets and industries packed intot the
> basin.  Let's not forget about Chino dairy farm
> cow farts either.
>

Most of the dairies have left Chino. Been replaced by houses. In fact there's a whole new city out there, Eastvale.

I know, i was referring to air of earlier times, but you are correct. Wonder how many home owners still get that waft of bovine from unknown sources. The house stays closed up all day and when the owners get home from work, there is a distinct odor-du-bessy.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SP4360 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I don't have a problem with CARB as a whole.
> > Instead of destroying the block, why not just
> say
> > this thing can't be used in CA? 1 engine
> doesn't
> > make as much polutants as the trucks and so
> called
> > hybrids running in 1 day. Send it packing. BTW,
> I
> > grew up in that fine 60's air that the
> autombile,
> > trucks, jets and industries packed intot the
> > basin.  Let's not forget about Chino dairy
> farm
> > cow farts either.
> >
>
> Most of the dairies have left Chino. Been replaced
> by houses. In fact there's a whole new city out
> there, Eastvale.

Although air clarity has much improved (I recall the burning throat and one mile visibility of 1958),
remember that oxides of nitrogen are invisible.
DEF, anyone?
...Lorenzo