Railroaders' Nostalgia > Pre 1985 RR Employees

I need to tell or remind younger readers here...we who hired out before 1985 (Pre '85) in Engine Service (Fireman), this was a totally different contract than railroaders work under nowadays. For a few years (4) my son was a CSX Engineer out of Birmingham, Alabama. I would always hear," DAD! You're were a Pre '85 man, it's totally different now." When I retired from UPRR in 2004 you could still layoff for seven days in a row. At least on the SJ, LA and Tucson Divisions. I had heard the Oregon SP guys got stuck with some UP Idaho Agreement that was really bad. We, as engineers, could even tie-up for undisturbed rest 8-10 or 12 hours. 



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/31/20 16:00 by HardYellow.

Not many Pre-85 guys left. Post-85 guys are now the old heads. And then we have Post-04 guys who have it even worse. Things just never get better. At some point the 1 person that is left will be nothing more than a Walmart greeter. The insatiable greed of Wall Street will see to it. And unless you have vacation or PL days, forget about laying of for a week now on the UP. The draconian attendance policy will have you fired twice over for such a move.

ble692 Wrote:
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> At some point the 1 person that is left will be
> nothing more than a Walmart greeter. 

Well, you might be right. They already gave you guys the "vest."  My son says, he misses running trains, but not working for the CSX.

I used to love the "tie-up" agreement on the SP when the extra board was turning fast. It provided an opportunity for some rest without having to lay off, or if you just wanted to get by an undesirable job and into a better one. Then hope someone didn't lay off or mark up in front of you to screw it up.

Did the Engineer's lose the tie-up agreement? What's the BLE doing for you guys nowadays?

As far as I know all pool and extra board engineers on the SP Western Lines Agreement can take 12 hours UDR (undisturbed rest) on tie up. Of course remember that with the Rail Saftety Improvment Act of 2008 all classes of service get 10 hours UDR now as a minimum anyway. Certain boards have options for more than 12 hours. My board can do 10, 12, 24, or 36 hours. Another board in my terminal can do 10, 12, or 48 hours. Yet others are just 10 or 12 hours.
 

HardYellow Wrote:
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> ... I had heard the Oregon SP guys got stuck with some UP
> Idaho Agreement that was really bad. ...

You heard right and it was garbage - a huge cut in pay for us. Rumors abounded Pruitt (SP WLGC) threw us under the bus because of a conflict with the local chairman in Eugene. As bad as it was I always wondered what the UP guys in Portland had originally as the UP people said the Idaho Agreement was great compared to what they had before. 

They tried to shove that Idaho Agreement up our butt  in LA. DW Hannah fought it, a labor board judge asked the up lawyers, "What does Idaho have to do with Los Angeles?" He ruled in the BLE's favor.

Ah...the "untouchables". I'm a BABY...hired on with BNSF in 2008....I know...there's no hope for me at all, I won't make it, but i've got nothing else so i'm going to hold on.

I was lucky enough to be able to spend 12 years so far around a considerable number of the old guard before they retired over the last few years....and there are still some "lifers" that will never go unless forced. I was still able to learn how to switch from NP, GN, MILW and BN switchmen, before it got stupid with the rules.

Only the old heads could get away with telling a company officer to "eat s--" after being ops tested...or to throw a list back into the yardmasters face and say "You're screwin' us"!

I just went through the rosters for my seniority district, which is the Pacific #5, covering from New Westminster, BC, the entire state of Washington down to Klamath Falls, OR, and east into Hauser, ID...checking to see how many "pre-1985" guys we have left. Here's what I got.

A grand total of.......26! (6 hogs, 9 yardmen, and 11 conductors).

1 hog with a 1969 Great Northern fireman's date, a 1972 man, two 1973 men, a 1974 man, two from 1977, seven from 1978, four from 1979, eight from 1980......and that's all she wrote.

How much longer can they last?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/20 23:30 by Texican65.

We pre-85 guys still carry many good memories though.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

Texican65 Wrote:
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> Ah...the "untouchables". I'm a BABY...hired on
> with BNSF in 2008....I know...there's no hope for
> me at all, I won't make it, but i've got nothing
> else so i'm going to hold on.

Hang in there if you can, the money is good and so is the retirement.  I don't have a crystal ball (nor does anyone else) but maybe things will actually improve given enough time.  There is always hope!

Things are not going to get better until it burns to the ground. The class one’s are a miserable place to work now. Period.

Posted from iPhone

Bob3985 Wrote:
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> We pre-85 guys still carry many good memories
> though.

Amen Bob! Not everyday was perfect but have great stories and memories.

Posted from Android

During the Anschutz SP Western Lines Engineers also had the option of 18 hrs rest as well as an extra week vacation.  SP valued education.  They created educational leaves of absence for the benefit of those who wanted to seek college education.  I knew several people who were also able to work with local officials to only work weekends, holidays and school breaks while they studied towards thier degree.   No so with UP.  An Engineer friend not only had his request for leave denied by the Supt, the letter also threatened dismissal if he did not protect his assignment.  

sphogger 

sphogger Wrote:
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> During the Anschutz SP Western Lines Engineers
> also had the option of 18 hrs rest as well as an
> extra week vacation.  SP valued education.  They
> created educational leaves of absence for the
> benefit of those who wanted to seek college
> education.  I knew several people who were also
> able to work with local officials to only work
> weekends, holidays and school breaks while they
> studied towards thier degree.   No so with UP.
>  An Engineer friend not only had his request for
> leave denied by the Supt, the letter also
> threatened dismissal if he did not protect his
> assignment.  
>
> sphogger 

Nice company

Funny thing...back in the day, I always though, as younger management took over from the old steam ear board of directors and general management guys and their thinking, we would end up with a much more empathetic, modern thinking management in the RR industry. Boy! I was totally wrong. These guys of today are much more loathing of the working rr employee any old heads of the past. Many of the old guard actually came up through the ranks. Today, it's all college boys.

HardYellow Wrote:
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> Funny thing...back in the day, I always though, as
> younger management took over from the old steam
> ear board of directors and general management guys
> and their thinking, we would end up with a much
> more empathetic, modern thinking management in the
> RR industry. Boy! I was totally wrong. These guys
> of today are much more loathing of the working rr
> employee any old heads of the past. Many of the
> old guard actually came up through the ranks.
> Today, it's all college boys.

When the CEO of the RR knows less about The Job than a kid with a train under a Xmas tree and over half the dispatchers have no RR knowledge other than the propaganda from Choo Choo U it makes for a shitty job.
I at least used to be known to the Carrier by my first 2 initials and last name. Now I’m just 7 numbers.🥴

Posted from iPhone

I wasn't but 6.

Drknow Wrote:
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> Things are not going to get better until it burns
> to the ground. The class one’s are a miserable
> place to work now. Period.
>
> Posted from iPhone

RAILROADER LIVES MATTER.  

Drknow Wrote:
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> I at least used to be known to the Carrier by
> my first 2 initials and last name. Now I’m just
> 7 numbers.🥴
>
Trainhand Wrote:
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> I wasn't but 6.

...as opposed to a trip I took in 1970 that involved PC to New York then Washington (try out the new High Speed Metroliner that never exceeded around 40 mph due to some sort of signal problem over a long stretch of line) then return on B&O No 5 (The Real Capitol Limited). I didnt have enough whiskers for a pass. I was a paying passenger.

Shortly after we blasted off from Washington US, the conductor came to my roomette for my ticket. He told me that he heard I was a train dispatcher in Chicago and wanted to personally welcome me on his train-if I needed anything, just let him know. Every crew the rest of the trip knew I was a B&OCT spatch and acted like I was an honored guest. I don't know how they found out except I probably told the guy I worked with in Terminal Control in Baltimore (the power bureau) what I was doing with my week off.

In those days we didn't get loyalty trinkets like hats and shirts, but everyone, at least where I worked, felt respected and appreciated without that stuff (which, when I started getting such things at BN, felt like it was a cheap substitute for the respect I used to see).

TAW