Eastern Railroad Discussion > Advice for the Greater Pittsburgh and Altoona Area

Between 6/22 and either 6/29 or even 6/30, I'm going to be on a trip to Altoona and Pittsburgh. I will be visiting family one of the days and will have lots of time to railfan. I'm going to take Amtrak Train # 43 from Newark to Altoona on Saturday 6/22/19. I'm going to spend the nights of 6/22 and 6/23 in Altoona. On 6/24, I head to Pittsburgh on Amtrak Train # 43. I'll be staying in Pittsburgh, as of right now, between the nights of 6/24 and 6/28, departing the morning of 6/29 on the Eastbound Pennsylvanian. It's also possible that I might stay the night of 6/29 and on 6/30, depart PGH on the Eastbound Pennsylvanian.

I won't have access to a car on this trip. Where are the best railfan spots? How is Beaver Falls and Rochester? In Altoona, I plan to photograph along the downtown area and maybe even the curve. In Pittsburgh, I am planning to photograph in Homestead, Leetsdale, Downtown Pittsburgh, the CSX Line opposite Downtown Pittsburgh as well as a few places along that line north of Pittsburgh. I plan to spend some time riding and photographing along the T route. One of the days, I am planning on going to the PA Trolley Museum in Washington. I would do that during the week.

Thanks.

While I highly recommend a visit to the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum (I am a member), if you will not have access to a car, you will not be able to get to the museum.  Consider renting a car to get there.  There are car rental locations within Downtown Pittsburgh, including in the Grant Street Transportation Center across Liberty Avenue from the Amtrak station.

There is a bicycle path which follows much of CSX's ex-Pittsburgh & Lake Erie RR Line from the Station Square area towards Homestead.  It provides views of the CSX line form locations which would not be possible to access by automobile.  There are several bicycle rental facilities.  You can also walk a short portion of the trail.

In the Station Square area, you can also get views of Norfolk Southern's Mon Line.

Homestead is one of the best places in the Pittsburgh area to see and photograph trains because of the volume of NS and CSX trains on lines next to each other.

One of my favorite spots is West Park in Pittsburgh North Side.  NS's Fort Wayne Line passes through the park in a cut.

Have a great time in Altoona and Pittsburgh.

I wouldn't plan on getting to the Curve if you don't have a car.

Beaver Falls, Rochester, Leetsdale, and Washington would all require a car to reach from Downtown Pgh.

Posted from iPhone

Go ride an inclined plan while in Pittsburgh. You can take light rail from near the Amtrak station over to Station square on the south side and ride a plane with relative ease.

Posted from iPhone

As for getting from Downtown Pittsburgh to the PA Trolley Museum, being that I plan to do that during the week, I’m going to take the bus, Freedom Transit, that runs from Downtown Pittsburgh to a stop that is as close as you can get to the museum. This bus doesn’t run on weekends between Pittsburgh and Washington. The closest bus stop is probably a mile or two from the museum so yes, I would have to take an Uber the rest of the way to the museum.
https://www.freedom-transit.org/Metro-Commuter-Bus-Schedule.pdf
As for Leetsdale, there are buses that run from Pittsburgh but I think one of them starts out in the North Shore section. https://www.portauthority.org/pdfs/14.pdf
For travel to Rochester and Beaver Falls, I would pretty much have to switch at Ambridge Park n Ride Lot.
I plan to ride the inclines as well as walk the trail along the waterfront.

Posted from iPhone

Passfanatic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As for getting from Downtown Pittsburgh to the PA
> Trolley Museum, being that I plan to do that
> during the week, I’m going to take the bus,
> Freedom Transit, that runs from Downtown
> Pittsburgh to a stop that is as close as you can
> get to the museum. This bus doesn’t run on
> weekends between Pittsburgh and Washington. The
> closest bus stop is probably a mile or two from
> the museum so yes, I would have to take an Uber
> the rest of the way to the museum.
>
> https://www.freedom-transit.org/Metro-Commuter-Bus
> -Schedule.pdf
> As for Leetsdale, there are buses that run
> from Pittsburgh but I think one of them starts out
> in the North Shore section.
> https://www.portauthority.org/pdfs/14.pdf
> For travel to Rochester and Beaver Falls, I would
> pretty much have to switch at Ambridge Park n Ride
> Lot.
> I plan to ride the inclines as well as walk the
> trail along the waterfront.
>
> Posted from iPhone

For Leetsdale, you will want the stop at the corner of Beaver and Broad. It is a short walk from there to the overhead bridge where you see most of the good pictures taken from. I honestly don't believe continuing to Richester or Beaver Falls would be worth your while. You will see all the same trains in Leetsdale as you would in Rochester without the extra travel time. Beaver Falls does have the benefit of both railroads, but it again is a pretty good hike from Pittsburgh and you can get the same dueling NS/CSX type of experience in a nicer setting that is easier to get to (especially by bus) in Homestead. I would also recommend West Park on the North Side. Its a nice place to spend a summer morning and as of this moment still has a 4 track working set of CPL's in the trench through the park. Traffic is fairly steady and you get the bonus of AVR's transfer run to Island Ave showing up mid-late morning and then returning in the other direction a while later. If you are really feeling adventurous, you can also take a bus (The PAT Lincoln Highway flyer, I think) to east Pittsburgh and walk a couple blocks out onto the Westinghouse bridge for a great morning view of the NS and URR coming past the Edgar Thomson Works.

Thanks again everyone. It sounds like I won’t venture too far north of Leetsdale. I will definitely photograph from that park on Pittsburgh’s North Shore. I did that once in July of 2013 and was quite impressed. Even though not good for Amtrak travelers, if I am able to catch 30 running a few hours late into Pittsburgh, then I would love to photograph it somewhere.
I also want to photograph both Pennsylvanians as well. I hope to go to some of the eastern suburbs of Pittsburgh to get it.

Posted from iPhone

Passfanatic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks again everyone. It sounds like I won’t
> venture too far north of Leetsdale. I will
> definitely photograph from that park on
> Pittsburgh’s North Shore. I did that once in
> July of 2013 and was quite impressed. Even though
> not good for Amtrak travelers, if I am able to
> catch 30 running a few hours late into Pittsburgh,
> then I would love to photograph it somewhere.
> I also want to photograph both Pennsylvanians
> as well. I hope to go to some of the eastern
> suburbs of Pittsburgh to get it.
>
> Posted from iPhone

30 would have to be quite late but obviously with Amtrak that is always a possibility. A good spot to catch 42 (and a late running 30) is Herron Ave, the first stop on the busway east of downtown. As you probably know, the busway paralells the NS Pgh line east from the city. Herron Ave is CP Bloom on NS, and is where the connecting track with the CSXT/AVR P&W sub jumps off. It's a nice place to catch a train in the morning with the city in the background.

In Altoona, the Amtrak station is directly accross from the Railroader's Memorial Museum site, and there is a pedestrian overpass there.

You didn't say how you are overnighting in Altoona; there isn't much by the station.  

Last time I checked, the curve visitation was still a lot more than the museum.   They have a combined ticket; i.e. many visitors go to both places, and you might even be able to hitch a ride with fellow railfans if you can spot one.   The pedestrian overpass bridge right by the station is not a half bad spot to watch trains, either, again, the chances of running into somebody else running back and forth between the museum and the Curve are actually pretty good.   And there's always Uber.   Just check your times and dates with what's going on at the museum, because if they are doing a music concert or event the place goes nuts.  I see there's a Doobie Brothers tribute band playing there 6/21, just sayin. 

The "official" recommendation by the museum from their website: Transportation If you arrive by AMTRAK to spend the day, the Railroaders Museum does NOT provide transportation to and from the Horseshoe Curve. One of our gift shop attendants will be happy to call one of our local cab services for you if you need transportation.

The whole community is pretty tolerant of railfans, you have to love a place that names their minor-league ballteam the "Curve".

Another place to be aware of around Altoona is the Everett Railroad - check their website for what might be running that day.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/19 12:18 by randgust.

randgust Wrote:

>

> Another place to be aware of around Altoona is the
> Everett Railroad - check their website for what
> might be running that day.

Unfortunately the Everett is not running that weekend.
The OP reminds me of J.J. Young and Bert Pennypacker, who were notorious non-driving railfans that used whatever public transport could be found, and just hitched rides with whoever. Of course this was in the 1950s-60s, when public transport was arguably more plentiful in many places.
The OP seems to be making a willful decision to avoid auto usage, while this might gain maximum MVP (Millenial Virtue Points), it seems terribly inconvenient and inefficient to me.
Bus rides to nowhere through urban areas seems a recipe for disaster, I hope the OP travels light with the camera gear. Let's also remember that most populated places in PA of any size has people with opioid problems.

In Altoona, I will be staying at the Microtel Windham & Suites. I picked this hotel since it’s within walking distance of the railroad. I thought about maybe the Monday that I’m in Altoona, going to Horseshoe Curve in the morning first thing when it opens so that way, I can be able to photograph 42 as well as the other trains on the correct side of the sun. I might even do both the curve and the museum on Sunday. I plan to spend a lot of time railfanning in Downtown Altoona.
As for the Everett RR, I don’t think that will work out. When I’m in Altoona, I don’t think the Everett RR will be running any excursion trains. I’m rather surprised about that since it’s the peak season for these types of trains to be running on weekends.
I’ll probably use Uber when I go to the curve. Maybe take a local bus part of the way then Uber the rest of the way.

Posted from iPhone

> Bus rides to nowhere through urban areas seems a
> recipe for disaster, I hope the OP travels light
> with the camera gear.

Geez, It’s not like he’s in Philly ;-)

Pittsburgh is actually one of the safest big American cities. While urban, none of the places he is planning to go would be characterized as unsafe, especially during the day.

That said, I’m assuming that the OP understands the risks that come in any urban area.

Posted from iPhone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/19 15:28 by DJ-12.

I live in the NYC area and have ridden buses, commuter rail, light rail, and subways through less than desirable areas and haven't had too many problem. The worst areas that I have ridden through are often during the daytime.

As for Pittsburgh, it is one of the most safest cities not just in general, but in the Rust Belt Region. Yes, many of the places that I plan to railfan at are safe, at least during the daytime. I know that Homestead can be rough but I guess where the old train station is is ok. I am also planning on going to the shopping mall in the old steel mill. I will look into going to Heron Avenue. I also want to ride the busway and in fact, may end up having to take a bus that uses the busway to Churchill where my relatives live.

I have ridden both inclines and really enjoyed them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/19 15:57 by Passfanatic.

There is a hotel in Downtown Altoona within walking distance of the Amtrak Station:The Wingate by Wyndham Altoona Downtown/Medical Center at 908 Chestnut Street.

Passfanatic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As for getting from Downtown Pittsburgh to the PA
> Trolley Museum, being that I plan to do that
> during the week, I’m going to take the bus,
> Freedom Transit, that runs from Downtown
> Pittsburgh to a stop that is as close as you can
> get to the museum. This bus doesn’t run on
> weekends between Pittsburgh and Washington. The
> closest bus stop is probably a mile or two from
> the museum so yes, I would have to take an Uber
> the rest of the way to the museum.

I knew about the service going near the museum.  However, upon further investigation, I found that you can ride transit all of the way to the museum on weekdays by transferring from the Pittsburgh route to the County Line Route at the Chestnut Street Transit Cente.  Here's a link to the timetable:

https://www.freedom-transit.org/County-Line-fixed-route-bus-service-in-Washington-County.htm
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/19 19:35 by RuleG.

warren1977 Wrote:

> The OP seems to be making a willful decision to
> avoid auto usage, while this might gain maximum
> MVP (Millenial Virtue Points), it seems terribly
> inconvenient and inefficient to me.
> Bus rides to nowhere through urban areas seems a
> recipe for disaster, I hope the OP travels light
> with the camera gear. Let's also remember that
> most populated places in PA of any size has people
> with opioid problems.



I've lived, worked, dated, volunteered, drove cars, rode buses and rail transit, biked and walked and railfanned all over Pittsburgh and its suburbs for thirty years.  Based on my experience, I find the other posters' comments about the relative safety of Pittsburgh and the regional public transit network are much closer to reality than your statement.

 "Bus rides to nowhere?"  Why would you say that?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/19 20:29 by RuleG.

While this isn’t a bus forum, I will say that having ridden the bus system in Pittsburgh, it serves a lot of the city, even the nicer parts like Oakland. In July of 2013, I stayed at a good hotel, pretty reasonably priced, in Oakland just so that way I can be within an easy bus ride away from Downtown Pittsburgh.
Back to the trains, I saw that the area around Heron Street bus station might be fenced off in terms of getting a good view of the Pittsburgh Line. Is that true? Would it be possible to get good morning shots of 42 departing Pittsburgh from the area where CP Pitt is? Thanks. On this trip, I might want to go to Wilderming as well.

Posted from iPhone

DJ-12 Wrote:
> For Leetsdale, you will want the stop at the
> corner of Beaver and Broad. It is a short walk
> from there to the overhead bridge where you see
> most of the good pictures taken from. I honestly
> don't believe continuing to Richester or Beaver
> Falls would be worth your while. You will see all
> the same trains in Leetsdale as you would in
> Rochester without the extra travel time. Beaver
> Falls does have the benefit of both railroads.....

 1.  That IS the name of the bus stop for the Leetsdale bridge -- but be aware that you would also first encounter a Beaver and Broad stop in Sewickley which is more well known -- see your referenced bus timetable for example.
 I think you would see about the same number of trains in Leetsdale as in Rochester -- but remember Conway Yard is between those two locations, and in my opinion you would encounter a greater chance of seeing non-NS power on that side, if that is a consideration.   Also, the Leetsdale bridge is pretty much an afternoon shot;  the gentle S curve on the Pbgh side does offer some good morning opportunities, but.....

2.  It is possible to travel by bus, at least on weekdays, beyond Ambridge without changing -- see Beaver County Transit Authority Route 1.  These buses operate in a semi-express mode between Pittsburgh [ note the East Busway Connection ] and Ambridge, but see the limitation on travel wholly within that area.

3.  Beaver Falls is one of those locations that on a map should be a good train photo location, but in actual practice isn't.  Photo angles on CSX are very limited, and the PRR/NS bridge shot is a morning only thing.  I would not recommend it for that and other reasons.
I would however recommend Rochester for its variety of photo opportunities and angles, even for someone on foot.  The relatively nearby Beaver station and freight station offer good opportunities for CSX as well;  you could walk to it, and bus back, changing at Rochester to a Pittsburgh bound bus.

4.  Depending on your interest, the bridge at Baden [ = East Conway ] is a good location as well, especially for motive power [ including the SD-slug-slug sets for the hump ] .

5.  Finally, the bridge over the Ohio at Sewickley provides an excellent late afternoon view of the NS line to Pittsburgh in which the PRR passenger station -- now a doctor's office -- can be incorporated.  The CSX line also passes underneath, but can be in shadow by that time.  The PAT bus line over this bridge provides an alternate ride back into Pittsburgh -- but I would suggest you do that non-stop.
   
The above are just some ideas.   Do you have a scanner ?

Best, SZ

PS  The PAT transit map provides an excellent reference of bus stop vs geography -- but don't believe the railway labeling.   The Wheeling and Lake Erie does not run along the Ohio, perhaps they were thinking P&LE -- but why they think the PRR / NS Economy Branch [ from East Conway ] is home to the Platte Valley Traction I have no idea.......





 

Passfanatic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> While this isn’t a bus forum, I will say that
> having ridden the bus system in Pittsburgh, it
> serves a lot of the city, even the nicer parts
> like Oakland. In July of 2013, I stayed at a good
> hotel, pretty reasonably priced, in Oakland just
> so that way I can be within an easy bus ride away
> from Downtown Pittsburgh.

Oakland can be a good place to stay.  It also positions you to get a photo of Train #30 after leaving the Amtrak Station in Pittsburgh.  Walk or take a bus to Fifth Avenue and Neville Street.  Walk down the hill to the bottom where Neville Street turns into Boundary Street and the railroad crossing.  Turn right and you will see the south portal of the Schenley Tunnel.  At the time of year of your trip, train #30 would not have to be too late for you to get a photo.  Attached is a photo I took in winter of a late running Capitol Limited exiting the tunnel.

The Allegheny Valley Railroad also operates on this line.  Attached is a photo of an AVR train taken from the same spot but looking south.  Forbes Avenue passes above.  The Carnegie Mellon University campus is to the left. 

> Back to the trains, I saw that the area around
> Heron Street bus station might be fenced off in
> terms of getting a good view of the Pittsburgh
> Line. Is that true?

There is fencing aling the bridge, but the I've been able to take photos of trains through the fencing.  Attached is a photo taken from the Herron Avenue Bridge of Train #42 on the Pittsburgh Line.

Would it be possible to get
> good morning shots of 42 departing Pittsburgh from
> the area where CP Pitt is? Thanks.

I think that will be a lot more difficult.  An automobile dealership recently opened up just to the east of CP Pitt.  I don't see how one can get photos without walking through the dealership property.

On this trip, I
> might want to go to Wilderming as well.

There was George Westinghouse museum in Wilmerding.  I don't know if the museum is still open, but if it is, a visit is a good way to learn about some of the area's industrial heritage.
>
> Posted from iPhone

 

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Nice pics! I have a feeling that getting pics of 42 departing PGH near CP Pitt would be tough. I don’t want to risk my chances of getting into trouble by the car dealership or by law enforcement for photographing from the dealership.
I will be using a Nikon d3400 to take pictures so I’m not sure if the lens would be able to fit through the fence.
The AVR might look like a nice operation to photograph.
Back to the Pittsburgh Line-how is the Penn Ave bridge and the pedestrian bridge below there for photography?

Posted from iPhone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/19 04:22 by Passfanatic.