Eastern Railroad Discussion > Fort Wayne Line woes...NS files to remove some track

Just found out that NS has filed a petition wtih the FRA, on March 20,  to remove thirty three miles of double track from PC to 84.8 to 188.3. I had heard rumblings this past fall about NS wanting to single track Mansfield, Ohio west to Bucyrus and Canton, Ohio east to Alliance, Ohio. Also all ethanol and oil to go mainline now and no more use of the CF&E to Mansfield, Ohio. I remember twenty five to thirty years ago the Fort Wayne Line saw quite a bit of traffic when Conrail had it. My how times have changed...apologize if this was covered berfore and I happened to miss it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/20 15:23 by Forever-Railfan-45.

Watch In about a decade they gonna need to put it back in.

Posted from Android

The-late-EMD Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Watch In about a decade they gonna need to put it
> back in.
>
> Posted from Android

Normally I would agree with that comment when it comes to single tracking a line... but not this time.

Nothing really goes that way, and hasn't for about 2 decades. It caught a second wind with the oil trains till PSR happened, and NS realized they could run those trains somewhere else. 

Realistically, its been on life support since it's death as a through route to Chicago under Conrail. 

The FRA filling that's been floating around the web. 

https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=FRA-2020-0029-0001&fbclid=IwAR3QKtoI5y1PtGbEw-lVWaCHM7MVTbt85EImKml7xAGOOm99KYUgx3jtcgQ

The following are all of the trains on the Ft. Wayne Line through Crestline, OH for the past week.

•4/6
12V-06
15V-05
170-04
171-05

•4/5
12V-05
15V-04
170-03
171-04
66Z-04

•4/4 
688-01
66X-04
12V-04
15V-03
66X-03
66T-03
171-03

•4/3
170-02
66R-01
12V-03
6K4-02
170-01
15V-02
66X-01
171-02

•4/2
578-01
12V-02
15V-01
6K4-01
171-01
170-31
66T-31

•4/1
578-31
903-31
12V-01
15V-31
170-30
66R-30
171-31

•3/31
66T-29
12V-31
15V-30
6K4-29
170-29
171-30

Andrew

Foamductor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The FRA filling that's been floating around the web. 

Thanks for the link ...

"Retire one main track at mile posts PC 84.8-96.7, 157.3-160.1, 161.9-169.4, 178.0-188.3.
Change method of operation at mile post limits of 160.1-161.9, 175.1-178.0 to Non Controlled Track."

 

Very sad and disgusting decision on the part of NS.  The mainline (NYC) is so clogged with trains, that they cannot keep Amtrak on time.  And then when they have to have maintenance windows on one track, the second main track becomes overburdened and everyone is stopped and waiting.  If anything, the STB should force NS to buy the CFW&E and rebuild it back into a real railroad with CTC.

In any case, NS operates east of Bucyrus a sufficient number of trains to keep the current track in place.  When Bellevue Yard wants to ease congestion, the Ft. Wayne line gets the overflow trains to PGH.  

It is poor planning of NS and CSX to cut everything to the bare minimum needed, and then when trouble comes in the form of derailments, detours, maintenance windows, etc., they simply do not have the capacity.  The railroad then descends into a parking lot.  

Sad to see another piece of the former PRR downgraded once again.

Even if NS would want to run more trains via the Fort Wayne Line, they can't. NS is limited to 8 trains a day between Crestline and Bucyrus, and 6 trains a day between though Fort Wayne. This came from the decision to give the line to CSX when Conrail was split. It has existed this way since then. If NS wanted to run more trains, they would have to break the paper barrier somehow. CSX and the CF&E wouldn't be willing, and I don't think the STB would rule in favor of NS either.

Actually it loos like NS is leaving a lot of excess capacity.  They could run 20+ trains a day on what will be left.  Going west from Alliance it looks like (a 3 mile industry siding alongside) 13 miles of single main, 14 miles of double main, 13 miles of single, 14 miles of double main, 22 miles of single (all 50-60 mph), a 1.6 mile uncontrolled siding, 7.5 miles of single, 5.7 miles double main, (a 2.9 miles unsignalled track alongside) 14 miles of single to the siding west of the Crestline diamonds.

But some dogs bark at every passing car.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/20 22:12 by darkcloud.

Related to this there have been reports that NS is removing trains from the CF&E. Bellevue will keep some cab signal equipped locos on hand for any foreign powered trains.

For folks unaware NS has trackage rights on the former PRR (See 6 train limit above) from Chicago. It was being used to bypass the cab signaled segments between Cleveland and Conway with foreign powered trains.

Posted from iPhone

The downturn in oil is also not helping the situation...until that changes...

CG

howeld Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Related to this there have been reports that NS is
> removing trains from the CF&E. Bellevue will keep
> some cab signal equipped locos on hand for any
> foreign powered trains.
>
> For folks unaware NS has trackage rights on the
> former PRR (See 6 train limit above) from Chicago.
> It was being used to bypass the cab signaled
> segments between Cleveland and Conway with foreign
> powered trains.
>
> Posted from iPhone

MEKoch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Very sad and disgusting decision on the part of
> NS.  The mainline (NYC) is so clogged with
> trains, that they cannot keep Amtrak on time. 
> And then when they have to have maintenance
> windows on one track, the second main track
> becomes overburdened and everyone is stopped and
> waiting.  If anything, the STB should force NS to
> buy the CFW&E and rebuild it back into a real
> railroad with CTC.

Why would/should the STB force NS to buy, and CSX to sell the CF&E? What would that benefit them? A good place to start with Amtrak would be enforcing current rules on them getting prioirty, but no one seems to want to go after this one.

MEKoch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The mainline (NYC) is so clogged with trains, that they cannot keep Amtrak on time. 

The places where NS has troubles is not near where the track is removed.

The NS portion of the Water Route is not anywhere near capacity (assuming you have people that actually know how to dispatch trains and they are left alone to do it) and if all else fails, the NKP isn't anywhere near capacity either.   If there are ANY issues on NS West of Cleveland, they only need to look in the mirror.  I'll bet the old NKP guys are rolling over in their graves watching all of these idiots and their fancy computer systems fail to do what they did with a telephone and a pencil.

It would be nice if NS would simply put the second track Out of Service for the current time being. Conrail did that on the Number 2 track from Yellow Creek to Shale on the Bayard Branch or Cleveland Line, depending on what year you look at. When traffic went back up the Number 2 track was put back in service at 10 mph. Hopefully the NS will leave enough sidings to keep things fluid if traffic patterns change.

Jim