Eastern Railroad Discussion > NTSB Brief - CSX derailment Alexandria Va. May 19, 2018

Railroad Accident Brief
https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/RAB2001.pdf

Preliminary report (has a couple different pictures than in the brief)
https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/RRD18MR007-prelim.pdf
 

Look like another case of:  Dispatcher offices continue to miss the rule $213.239 SPECIAL INSPECTION,: In the event of fire, flood, severe storm, or other occurrence which might have damaged track structure, a special inspection must be made of the track involved as soon as possible after the occurrence. 
Was the engineer trained to see the track washout damage and stop before pulling his train further over where the shoulder was washed out?

This rule mean you run a extra special inspection before you run a train. Regular scheduled inspection such as two per week don't count in regards to Severe Storms.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/20 15:52 by PlyWoody.

PlyWoody Wrote:
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> This rule mean you run a extra special inspection
> before you run a train.

No, it does not.

Typhoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PlyWoody Wrote:
> > This rule mean you run a extra special
> inspection
> > before you run a train.
>
> No, it does not.

So what is the reason for the rule to say "a special inspection must be made of the track involved which is to prevent a derailments and damage by wrecking a bridge as in this case. GMs and Supers I worked for complied with this rule and called extra track patrol.

PlyWoody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Typhoon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > PlyWoody Wrote:
> > > This rule mean you run a extra special
> > inspection
> > > before you run a train.
> >
> > No, it does not.
>
> So what is the reason for the rule to say "a
> special inspection must be made of the track
> involved which is to prevent a derailments and
> damage by wrecking a bridge as in this case. GMs
> and Supers I worked for complied with this rule
> and called extra track patrol.

The track must be inspected, not before trains are run. 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/20 18:31 by Typhoon.

There are two things going here.  First, this is a NTSB report. One of their guys once told me that they "enforce with a raised eyebrow."  They can't fine you, they can't charge you. They can only recommend - very publicly, I may add.  However, as somebody said  just because that isn't a  a CSX rule it shouldn't apply. If it is part of the Code of Federal Regulations, the FRA thought it important enough to promulgate the regulation, in the first place. In my experience, if it's in the CFR, then the FRA can fine you.  I know the regulation says "if possible", and that clouds it, a bit.  I should think if the FRA got a burr under it's saddle, then CSX would have to convince then FRA why it wasn't possible.  Also, elsewhere in the regulation, 49 CFR 213.15 talks about the sliding scale of penalties, both civil and criminal.  They can fine individuals and corporations up into 6 figures  My thoughts, anyway.

GFP

 

Was there a flash flood or heavy rain report issued for this section of track prior to the train arriving there because it sound like the Dispatchers sent the track inspector to an area where heavy rain was to inspect track due to flash flood warnings, this sound like a fill which was water soaked and was in an area where they had not had issues before based on the previous track inspection reports.  Most railroads use private weather information services to track where FRA required special track inspections are needed. That and reports from trains and employees in the field.

Y"all stay safe out there 

What all of this means is, CSX may have put out a n incliment weather train message, they want you--the train crew to operate at line speed where you can tke the blame for the derailment. Instead if the train crew runs about 10mph, the rr will get somebody out to ride the rr and tell you if anything is missing. I know I did it to them one day.

Trainhand Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What all of this means is, CSX may have put out a
> n incliment weather train message, they want
> you--the train crew to operate at line speed where
> you can tke the blame for the derailment. Instead
> if the train crew runs about 10mph, the rr will
> get somebody out to ride the rr and tell you if
> anything is missing. I know I did it to them one
> day.

In freight service we only reduce our speed if we know that flooding is occuring and then we only look for water over the ball of the rail for that's when it can get in the traction motors. 

That'swhat I mean. If flooding is occuring. I knew a crew that ran in a washout at Fairfax, SC about 30 years ago. They were coming Augusta to Savannah it had rained earlier that day,but had stopped. There was a pond about 2 miles from the rr whose dam broke from the rain and released a small tidal wave. The flow of water washed out about 500 feet of railroad and the same amount of highway which is adjacent to the rr. The I don't think had a flood alert at the time because none of them served days. The rr say they should have known that place would flood and that there was a pond they couldn't see or know of its existence. I took that to mean the rr expected you to be in addition to other things clairvoyant. So since I'm not good at predicting things, I just operated at a very slow speed and did my best to tie up the rr. Remember this, no one has ever been run off for stopping or running at true restricted speed. The day I tied up the rr the dispatcher told me to operate at line speed, except where the rr might flood. I told him that would make me clairvoyant, if I were I would win every lottery and not have to work for the rr. He got a track inspector out at Savannah coming toward me.