Eastern Railroad Discussion > UAW Strike-Four days In

Of course, not all plants are affected yet, but how long before we see railroad traffic affected? Some makes and models can work off inventory, others are short. And suppliers will be affected (perhaps more so).

Though now retired, I know that many folks directly and indirectly are in the automotive economy.

Those of us old enough to remember long strikes, recall furloughed railroaders and railroads scrounging for places where auto-racks and auto parts boxcars could be stored.

Victor Baird

Posted from Android



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 09/18/23 19:23 by wabash2800.

Haven’t seen anything around my neck of the planet yet. Nobody wants a strike, but after 40 years of corporate America pissing down workers necks and telling them to enjoy the warm rain people have had enough.

Solidarity and regards.

Posted from iPhone

Drknow Wrote:
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>  after 40
> years of corporate America pissing down workers
> necks and telling them to enjoy the warm rain
> people have had enough.

GM CEO Mary Barra got rather speachless in an interview when the interviewer noted her base pay had gone up 34% & why couldn't the worker bee's pay go up in a similar fashion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/19/23 07:25 by nsrlink.

nsrlink Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Drknow Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >  after 40
> > years of corporate America pissing down workers
> > necks and telling them to enjoy the warm rain
> > people have had enough.
>
> Crysler CEO Christine Feuell got rather speachless
> in an interview when the interviewer noted her
> base pay had gone up 34% & why couldn't the worker
> bee's pay go up in a similar fashion.

WHAAAAATTTTT?

Don’t you understand that the aristocracy DESERVES more than the Plebes?

Just by virtue of going to the right colleges and knowing the right people they are truly better people that take the risks and contribute to all the profits. Just ask them.

Regards

Posted from iPhone

That poor lady.  $30 million a year just doesn't go as far as it used to.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/19/23 07:25 by nsrlink.

One upside may be that replacement parts may become more available in the supply chain.  Many parts have been in short supply as so many are used in the manufacture of new cars and light trucks.

One downside will likely be that worker expectations are very high right now. They want a 40% increase over several years. They want an end to the two tier wage and pension that they agreed to in 2009. Anything less than that will be seen (incorrectly, in my opinion) as a loss.  Which will make organizing non-union plants owned by Nissan, Volkswagen, Mercedes, Honda, etc even more difficult.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/13/business/stellantis-auto-union-jobs-plant/index.html

66

Steelworkers starting to be affected, as US Steel announced yesterday the temporary idling of its Granite City works near St. Louis...

JG

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One upside may be that replacement parts may
> become more available in the supply chain.  Many
> parts have been in short supply as so many are
> used in the manufacture of new cars and light
> trucks.
>
> One downside will likely be that worker
> expectations are very high right now. They want a
> 40% increase over several years. They want an end
> to the two tier wage and pension that they agreed
> to in 2009. Anything less than that will be seen
> (incorrectly, in my opinion) as a loss.  Which
> will make organizing non-union plants owned by
> Nissan, Volkswagen, Mercedes, Honda, etc even more
> difficult.

You left out the most polarizing demand, they want a 32-hour work week along with all the pay and benefit increases.

It could be a negotiating tactic to be jettisoned for the final agreement, otherwise that may be where they lose me and a lot of the public.  I'm glad they are making the comparison to corporate compensation increases and I support much of what they are asking, but all that and working just 4 days a week?  Looks greedy, that 40% increase would really be 50% per hour.    



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/19/23 12:09 by baretables.

I suspect they are asking for more than what they hope to get. Even with a 32 hour week, autoworkers would still work a lot of overtime.

Victor Baird

Posted from Android

Just remember that a 46% raise, a 32 hour work week, fully paid Platimum health care and renewed pension programs can't help
ANYONE but those employees. It sure won't drive down the price of a car.

Out 

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just remember that a 46% raise, a 32 hour work
> week, fully paid Platimum health care and renewed
> pension programs can't help
> ANYONE but those employees. It sure won't drive
> down the price of a car.
>
> Out 

You mean if those people had more income and buying power they wouldn’t buy more products and stimulate the economy?

Next you’re gonna tell me “Trickle Down Theory Economics” is a lie!!

Hmmm….

Tongue firmly planted in cheek.

Regards

Posted from iPhone

The "renewed pension plans" mentioned above are a result of the two tier pay system the unions, companies, and government hatched in 2009 with the bailouts.  Employees hired in 2009 and later have a 401k type plan in which the company contributes funds each year toward the employee's retirement. If the employee quits, etc, they can take the company contributions and interest with them to their new job. The generic name is Cash Balance Plan or Defined Contribution Plan.

Employees hired before 2009 have a Defined Benefit plan in which the company sets aside an accounting item for credited service each year. You have to work an insanely long period of time (like 30-35 years) to qualify for a good pension. That, in turn is a function of your final few years of paid compensation. Companies hate that because it puts them on the hook for a benefit that might not be paid for decades. Railroad Retirement is partly a DB plan, with long service and age requirements. Leave early and you get bupkis.

------------------------------------

Underlying all of this is that the union and the companies know that it takes far few labor hours to construct an electric car. So you don't need as many people to do the work as you might with a comparable internal combustion vehicle. Some estimates say the Big 3 might need just 35%-40% of current labor to build the same number of electric cars as their total build of ICV and electric cars today.  You don't want to lock yourself into a pension promise to a lot of people who probably won't be needed in 20 years.

 

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just remember that a 46% raise, a 32 hour work
> week, fully paid Platimum health care and renewed
> pension programs can't help
> ANYONE but those employees. It sure won't drive
> down the price of a car.

Yeah but all those execs making a billion times what the average worker makes really helps with car pricing!

JG

>
> "Just by virtue of going to the right colleges and
> knowing the right people they are truly better
> people that take the risks and contribute to all
> the profits. Just ask them."

That nonsense ended more than a few years ago.  Nowadays the college folk with psychology and sociology degrees can be seen flipping burgers at MacDonalds along with all the other useless degrees.  American business fnally leaned that results speak louder than education.  Hooray!  

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

DELETED

> Underlying all of this is that the union and the
> companies know that it takes far few labor hours
> to construct an electric car. So you don't need as
> many people to do the work as you might with a
> comparable internal combustion vehicle. Some
> estimates say the Big 3 might need just 35%-40% of
> current labor to build the same number of electric
> cars as their total build of ICV and electric cars
> today.  You don't want to lock yourself into a
> pension promise to a lot of people who probably
> won't be needed in 20 years.

^^^ this ^^^

66 

 

My comment on the benefits of the agreement to the few references the number of auto workers vs the number of retired and
others who don't have the advantage of striking for a raise. And please don't bring up SSI, it seems for every bit of COLA there
is an accompanying rise in insurance and everything else deducted from the top.

Out 

goneon66 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> DELETED
>
> > Underlying all of this is that the union and
> the
> > companies know that it takes far few labor
> hours
> > to construct an electric car. So you don't need
> as
> > many people to do the work as you might with a
> > comparable internal combustion vehicle. Some
> > estimates say the Big 3 might need just 35%-40%
> of
> > current labor to build the same number of
> electric
> > cars as their total build of ICV and electric
> cars
> > today.  You don't want to lock yourself into a
> > pension promise to a lot of people who probably
> > won't be needed in 20 years.
>
> ^^^ this ^^^
>
> 66 
>
>  

Ah yes, WHO is buying them and more importantly WHERE is the power coming from to charge all of them?!?!?

As I shake my head.....

Posted from Android

ns1000 Wrote:


> Ah yes, WHO is buying them and more importantly
> WHERE is the power coming from to charge all of
> them?!?!?
>
> As I shake my head.....
>
> Posted from Android

The headline is almost always wrong, or intended as click bait. Even with E-cars as 5% or so of new cars sold, it will probably be decades before there's even a majority of pure E-cars on the road.  Look at how many decades it's taken for hybrids to reach a meaningful share of market.

Florida Power & Light is offering rock bottom overnight charging rates for electric car owners, along with financing on Powerwall type storage batteries. Again, the base load versus marginal production curves aren't anything like what many extremists on both sides proclaim.

The Wall Street Journal Thursday night update on the strike says the "32 hour work week" proposal has been put on the back burner. The parties are focused on the pay and medical right now,