Model Railroading > A whole lotta noses going on... SW1200

Hi all,

We've got our first test shots of the SW1200. They were actually sent directly from China to Trainfest so I haven't even seen them in person yet!

Have a look at the photos below. I think these are looking pretty snazzy. I actually like how the undecorated photos show off all of the separate details.

We are going to be adding the "hump" to the Rio Grande units. We asked them to leave room on the mold for it, but we hadn't designed it yet before we started cutting the steel. 

The order deadline is December 2nd. Here's the link to the SW1200 Web Site

Thanks and regards,

Jason
 

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Pretty darn fancy!

Those radiators look terrible.  They are WAY too proud of the carbody.   

Lift ring bases look very thick.  

Upper grab is missing on top of the hood.

Will the tread plate be correct?  

 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/19 12:14 by sixaxlecentury.

I agree the radiator grill doesn’t look quite right.

Perhaps the Canadian version of the radiator was
different than stock EMD radiator.  It would make sense
that Texas radiators would be different than those in
less heated climates.  The MKT would have not bought
anything other than the standard EMD supplied radiator.

WrongWayMurphy Wrote:
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> I agree the radiator grill doesn’t look quite
> right.
>
> Perhaps the Canadian version of the radiator was
> different than stock EMD radiator.  It would
> make sense
> that Texas radiators would be different than those
> in
> less heated climates.  The MKT would have not
> bought
> anything other than the standard EMD supplied
> radiator.

OK - I will bring this to Dan's attention and we will check our measurements. That is an easy fix. There is still plenty of time to make corrections. These are just the first test shots and are far from finished. Constructive criticism like this is really helpful. 

Thanks a lot!

-Jason
 

What is this "hump" of the D&RGW units you speak of.  I'm looking at a photo at rr-fallenflags and not sure what it is, unless my eye's are cheated by a spell.

Cheesr, Jim

Here's a side profile shot of DRGW 137 that shows it reasonably well.  Look at the slant just in front of the cab.  Normally the 1200 is an even slope back, whereas the Grande units had this weird protrusion.  I can't remember why.


 

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SPDRGWfan Wrote:
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> So here is a SW1200 with no "hump" which is how I
> thought they were supposed to be:
>
> http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/drgw/drgw131jpa.jpg
>
> Maybe the hump was something added later but not
> as delivered.  And if so, how much later.

Late enough that it was after the modified uncoupling levers, spark arrestors and roller bearings had been added.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/19 15:21 by PHall.

PHall Wrote:
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> Late enough that it was after the modified
> uncoupling levers, spark arrestors and roller
> bearings had been added.

Looks like the spark arrestors were added before the hump:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/drgw/drgw0135jpc.jpg

It doesn't appear roller bearing came possibly until the 80's.

Anyway, the hump is a feature I never really noticed and isn't easy to see on some photo's.  Maybe Rapido will offer the as-delivered and the later modified version.
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/19 15:31 by SPDRGWfan.

BN's SW1000's had a raised panel in this location too. It was to make access to the main generator easier.

A friend of mine captured the hump detail on an existing Rio Grande Sw1200 in Fort Worth,
and I believe this info was used by Rapido for the model.  I suggest this detail on the model is accurate.

WrongWayMurphy Wrote:
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> A friend of mine captured the hump detail on an
> existing Rio Grande Sw1200 in Fort Worth,
> and I believe this info was used by Rapido for the
> model.  I suggest this detail on the model is
> accurate.

Based on the photographic evidence, it appears it depends on the time period. The detail would be accurate for maybe late 70s and later. Prior to that, no hump.

Posted from Android

SPDRGWfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WrongWayMurphy Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > A friend of mine captured the hump detail on an
> > existing Rio Grande Sw1200 in Fort Worth,
> > and I believe this info was used by Rapido for
> the
> > model.  I suggest this detail on the model is
> > accurate.
>
> Based on the photographic evidence, it appears it
> depends on the time period. The detail would be
> accurate for maybe late 70s and later. Prior to
> that, no hump.
>
> Posted from Android

That's correct. Dan tells me we're putting it in the polybag. Our D&RGW models will have the closed journals on the trucks, so we imagine it would only have been a short time that they ran with the hump and the closed journals together.

However, it's a really cool detail and we've allowed for it on the molds so we do plan to include it. Wrong Way Murphy's friend, Blair, actually got a drone up over the hump and took photos, so we have everything we need. That was a HUGE HELP! If only we could have that kind of help with every model, it would make our jobs a lot easier! :-D Unfortunately, we would often need a time machine to get shots like that.

-Jason
 

Very cool Jason!

I've had Joseph Strapac's book Rio Grande Diesels: Vol 2 since the mid-1980's but was never aware of the hump.  But most of the photo's in there may have been earlier or at an angle it is difficult to see the hump.    Thats the thing about the hobby, there are always new things to become aware of for some of us.

Cheers, Jim

July 1980 - HUMP! (although hard to see).

TJY

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I sometimes feel mfgrs are over emphasizing some details either from limits of tooling capability vs cost (ie finer detail) or just missing it as here with the grills (hopefully fixed!). Comparing a large blown up model photo against a prototype side by side can really show detail differences or compromises.

That last photo is a good one - that WP uboat in the background almost fooled me as a Rio Grande unit!

-Benjamin

tunnel88 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I sometimes feel mfgrs are over emphasizing some
> details either from limits of tooling capability
> vs cost (ie finer detail) or just missing it as
> here with the grills (hopefully fixed!). Comparing
> a large blown up model photo against a prototype
> side by side can really show detail differences or
> compromises.

As you point out, compromises are necessary.

There are limitations as to what we can do in HO scale. The light housing on our SP SW1200 has to be oversize, otherwise it won't work. There is not enough physical space in there to add the circuit board, wires and SMDs and have it prototypical thickness. It's just not possible.

For the grilles on the radiator, we are limited by the laws of physics. If we want to be able to see through perfectly, we have to make the holes bigger. You can't replicate 1" screen openings made of 1/8" wire in HO scale. It's not physically possible without making the screen so thin it will buckle when you blow on it and it can't be installed without damaging it. Have a look at the photo below (courtesy Stan Sienicki) and scale it down to HO on your screen. You will see just how thin the "solid" part of the grille needs to be.

So we have four options:

1. We can mold on the grille texture and lose the see-through effect completely. But the "dimples" will be closer to the scale size holes. 
2. We can make the etched holes bigger but it will look like fat chain-link fence on the radiator. We would have to reduce the number of holes by at least 25%, maybe more.
3. We can leave the grille off and just have air in front of the shutters. You get the "see" of "see-through" but you lose the "through."
4. Do the best compromise we can with an etched grille, which is what we've done.

Let me know what you guys think. How would you do it? Is there a practical fifth option that we have not considered? The emphasis must be on practical. This is a mass-produced model, not something Dan is making on his workbench. ;-) 

We're always open to suggestions.

-Jason



 

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The problem I see with the radiator grills on the models is that they're slightly too tall and too wide. They need to fit into the frame not on it.
About 3 or 4 passes with a mill file on each side would probably do the trick.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The problem I see with the radiator grills on the
> models is that they're slightly too tall and too
> wide. They need to fit into the frame not on it.
> About 3 or 4 passes with a mill file on each side
> would probably do the trick.

Thanks! That is easy to fix. I will suggest that to Dan. I suspect that they are sitting slightly proud because these are hand-made samples, but we will double check that.

-Jason

Hi Jason, Rapido team,

The models look great. A few comments and suggestions:

-For the front radiator grills, I would leave them the way they are in the samples, I think they look good
-For the top radiator grills (which may be more concerning to the earlier comments above), I would suggest to incorporate the frame around the grill as part of the etching to thin it up - see Detail Associates #2727
-I bought an undec Rapido SW1200RS and my only disappointment was that the pilot details were already glued on the model. I rather see all parts to be applied by the modeler for undec models that may vary by prototype
-The metal handrails are fantastic and I just wish the pilot handrails could be metal as well
-Please consider offering the light packages and numberboards as separate detail parts or included in a spare parts bag for undec models
-Etched steps get two thumbs up

I would like to point out that the AAR trucks look excellent and the leaf spring detail behind the equalizer is fantastic. I've never seen one quite this good in HO scale plastic.

Looking forward to purchasing several undecorated models to paint in my favorite shortline road.

Best,
Jonathan