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Model Railroading > Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?


Date: 01/27/25 12:22
Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: RRBMail

I just received my two pre-ordered Bowser's F-3s in New York, Ontario & Western paint--road numbers 501 & 502. However, they are painted VERY dark grey, but both Bowser's pre-ordered artwork and and in every photo I could find of these units they are painted a pale light grey. So, I called Bowser about the difference in colors and their man assured me (bluntly?) that the prototypes were really painted in dark grey. However, I can't find Bowser's dark grey used anywhere in various NYO&W photos of 501 & 502. Do any TOs know if those units were ever painted dark grey? Do any TOs have photos of units 501 & 502 in dark grey? Thanks in advance! 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/25 13:13 by RRBMail.



Date: 01/27/25 13:04
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: ALCO630

I never saw a picture with dark gray paint. But people still see nothing wrong with this pre-ordering site unseen business.

Posted from iPhone

Doug Wetherhold
Macungie, PA



Date: 01/27/25 13:17
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: train1275

I am not a modeler, but what I can tell you about NYO&W gray is that it was a Dupont Dulux Enamel from the Dupont Toledo lab.

Color #259-51001 batched April 4, 1945

As freshly painted they did resemble a dark gray, maybe with a slight tinge of green. There was a Railroad Model Craftsman magazine on O&W F3's August 1970 - attached as Image #2-  that might have had some paint info and detail for modelers and the photos of the painted models were a darker gray than most any seen in color photos. 

EMD put out an O&W colorized drawing - attached as Image #1 -  which gives what I have been told was a good approximate rendition. I don't know as that was before I was born !

As time went by they tended to fade to what one fan who saw them said was more of a gun metal gray and in their last years seemed to be more of a blue gray. So it probably depends on what time frame of their lives you want to represent them. You can probably find various photos on the internet and go from there. My Aunt and Grandfather used to see them regularly in Upstate NY and had a running argument of whether they were blue or gray ..... so I would say there might be a lot of "gray area" in your choice of gray.

Image #3 is NYO&W 821AB at Cadosia NY - date unknown.
 



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/25 13:53 by train1275.








Date: 01/27/25 13:37
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: train1275

Image #4 - Maybrook, NY 1948

Image#5 - North of Sidney, NY crossing the Unadilla River March 23, 1957, David Connor photo - more bluish here 

Image#6 - September 1955 Hamilton, NY 

 








Date: 01/27/25 13:39
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: train1275

Image#7 - 803 at Middletown shortly after operations ceased in 1957.

I think too it depends on what lighting the units were viewed under.

Image#8 - Another example of later day faded paint. - mid to late 1950's at Cadosia.

There are far more photos of the units in later days than in the late 1940's when they were delivered



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/25 13:47 by train1275.






Date: 01/27/25 14:26
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: ChrisCampi

Those are some great reference photos! Color all over the place. Photos 4,7 and
 8 seem to show heavy oxidation. Grey's back then didn't hold up to well.



Date: 01/27/25 16:16
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: WrongWayMurphy

I don't know qbout the grey paint issue, but the overall scheme is not very pleasing to the eye.

Or,  in other words, that's an ugly F unit scheme.



Date: 01/27/25 17:01
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: wabash2800

I always thought the logo was lame, but it's endearing to O&W fans. EMD's art department probably came up with the paint scheme. The logo dates long before dieselization.

Victor Baird


WrongWayMurphy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't know qbout the grey paint issue, but the
> overall scheme is not very pleasing to the eye.
>
> Or,  in other words, that's an ugly F unit
> scheme.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/25 17:04 by wabash2800.



Date: 01/28/25 07:15
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: ntharalson

I'm wondering if the original grey was dark and faded over time.  Seems like a logical explanation.  

Nick Tharalson,
Marion, IA



Date: 01/28/25 07:35
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: nydepot

I believe very much so.

ntharalson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm wondering if the original grey was dark and
> faded over time.  Seems like a logical
> explanation.  
>
> Nick Tharalson,
> Marion, IA



Date: 01/28/25 07:50
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: ts1457

I wonder how the units would look in bright sunlight instead of under interior lighting?



Date: 01/29/25 02:00
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: steeplecab

> I'm wondering if the original grey was dark and faded over time.

With older paints it was more the outer layer of paint chalking and coming off rather than pigment fading. The effect is very similar unless something like a crew member's arm brushes the painted surface and brings out the original color again.
Dano
 



Date: 01/29/25 14:56
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: RRBMail

Hi Dan, I'm not in a place where I can send you a photo of the Bowser NYO&W F-3s. However, they are a somewhat darker as shown in the EMD artwork as posted above. I have collected various EMD art work posters and I can say that at times the artwork did not properly exhibit the color schemes as what was actually painted. I find it hard to believe, as others have written, that all the O&W photos out there are of "faded" units. If it is a matter of fading, I can't imagine that all units faded the same way on all sides of the locomotives. I wonder what the O&W Historical Society makes of Bowser's paint choice? 



Date: 01/29/25 19:50
Re: Beware? Bowser's New NYO&W F-3's Grey Paint?
Author: wabash2800

It's possible they consulted wirh the Ontario & Western Historical Society but maybe not. See if the society has a public discussion group. If not, see if there is a discussion group at i.o. groups that saved many of the yahoo groups when yahoo dumped them. If there is more than one NYO&W group at groups i.o., pick the one with the most activity.

Victor Baird


RRBMail Wrote:

I wonder what the O&W Historical
> Society makes of Bowser's paint choice? 

Posted from Android



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