Passenger Trains > NY MTA NYC subway chaos

http://nypost.com/2017/06/25/it-took-50-years-for-the-mta-to-totally-screw-up-the-subway/

Posted from Android

Some people made some very poor judgments!

IMHO......This is the opinion of political hacks who always think newer is better. They think automation is better, because its automation. In a system this large and this busy, Manned towers and wayside signals is WAY better. Yes, lets control the entire subway system out of 1 room on Jay St...that way when there is a problem, the entire system can come to a halt. More efficient=less employess, that's all, not a better overall system. Keeping it simple is the way to go. Not "modern" and complex. And we havent even talked about hacking, and what happens if u computerize everything, and it gets hacked.

I predict this news article is coming. "NYC subway's operation proves to be "Too Old to Hack". Nop, u cant hack a signal system thats built with wires and relays. 70 years old in some places, and still working. What more proof do u need.

I was in NY for a week, and all the trains were running just fine.

pdt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> (snip)
>
> I predict this news article is coming. "NYC
> subway's operation proves to be "Too Old to Hack".
> Nop, u cant hack a signal system thats built with
> wires and relays. 70 years old in some places, and
> still working. What more proof do u need.
>
> I was in NY for a week, and all the trains were
> running just fine.

Gothamist runs a piece every year rating the lines. Some lines, like the 7, have newer cars, understandable messages, and fewer breakdowns or shut downs. Other lines have older cars which break down often (like the C), or are filthy (like the 5), or jackpot with multiple problems. Other lines have frequent problems with copper signal lines shorting out.

http://gothamist.com/2016/12/29/worst_subways_best.php

There is not much correlation between age of cars and MDBF with OTP.

The #5 has New Technology Trains, and is at the bottom of the list.
The #1 has Canadian R62's from the mid-1980's, and is at the top of the list.
The C and J train have the same equipment assignments: 50% R160 and 50% R32, Yet the C is ranked 17 (out of 20); the J is ranked 6th best.

pdt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> IMHO......This is the opinion of political hacks
> who always think newer is better. They think
> automation is better, because its automation. In
> a system this large and this busy, Manned towers
> and wayside signals is WAY better. Yes, lets
> control the entire subway system out of 1 room on
> Jay St...that way when there is a problem, the
> entire system can come to a halt. More
> efficient=less employess, that's all, not a better
> overall system. Keeping it simple is the way to
> go. Not "modern" and complex. And we havent even
> talked about hacking, and what happens if u
> computerize everything, and it gets hacked.
>
> I predict this news article is coming. "NYC
> subway's operation proves to be "Too Old to Hack".
> Nop, u cant hack a signal system thats built with
> wires and relays. 70 years old in some places, and
> still working. What more proof do u need.
>
> I was in NY for a week, and all the trains were
> running just fine.

I'm not sure I understand this rant in relation to the article. The article seemed to be making the point that the system suffers from deferred maintenance.

One thing I will point out about automation. Automation can increase the capacity of a rail line by allowing the trains to run at a smaller headway. There are ways to make your operation hack proof (no internet connect, no ability to install own software, etc) that are usually done with operations like this.

pdt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nop, u cant hack a signal system thats built with
> wires and relays.

Sure you can, it is called line taping. Been around for decades.

> 70 years old in some places, and
> still working. What more proof do u need.

Copper (and other) low voltage wiring was never ment or designed to last 70 years. Proof, just ask the phone company.

> I was in NY for a week, and all the trains were
> running just fine.

So you have first hand knowledge that every train of what several hundred ran perfectly fine that entire week? Please, lets keep this believable.