Passenger Trains > Pennsylvanians cancelled on Tuesday, Feb. 23, account NS wreck

Due to a freight train derailment west of Harrisburg (HAR), trains traveling in the area should expect delays.  

Pennsylvanian Trains 42(23)  and 43 (23) are cancelled with no alternate transportation.

Eastern board thread about the derailment...not much information there right now.
https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?2,5202587



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/22/21 23:51 by GenePoon.

No alternate transportation - goes to show the lack of commitment Amtrak and Penn DOT have to running this service. They could run a Harrisburgh - Altoona bus bridge, but this is regarded as an amusement park ride. 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/21 06:11 by joemvcnj.

This "No alternate transportation" trend is disturbing.

 In the 90s and 2000s early, Amtrak Running a Bus from Pittsburgh to Harrisburg, then got on the train in Harrisburg to Philly. I got on the Bus 3 time from Latrobe, Pa, Amtrak is Joke of  Company in 2021.

This sort of shenaigans doesn't come up on CNBC milk toast interviews, does it. 

How does the Pennsylvania DOT view the cancel without alternatives strategy?  They're paying for the rail service, have they asked / demanded Amtrak provide a plan B for these occasional service issues?

we know that Amtrak really does not want to be in the passenger train business west of Harrisburg, PA.   So cancelling trains for really ANY reason is an easy call for them.  

Back in the day Harrisburg up the Buffalo Line to Lock Haven down the Bald Eagle Br to Tyrone then on to Altoona. All still in place today and usuable . ---  Ken 

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No alternate transportation - goes to show the
> lack of commitment Amtrak and Penn DOT have to
> running this service. They could run a Harrisburgh
> - Altoona bus bridge, but this is regarded as an
> amusement park ride. 

It may have nothing to do with Amtrak or PennDOT.  The pandemic severely impacted motorcoach companies.  Two years ago, buses and drivers could have been found to provide the substitute service.  It's very possible that now there are no drivers available on short notice.

Kemacprr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Back in the day Harrisburg up the Buffalo Line to
> Lock Haven down the Bald Eagle Br to Tyrone then
> on to Altoona. All still in place today and
> usuable . ---  Ken 

Tracks are in place, but are there qualified train crew available on short notice to operate a detour train on Norfolk Southern's Buffalo Line and the Nittany & Bald Eagle line?

RuleG Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kemacprr Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Back in the day Harrisburg up the Buffalo Line
> to
> > Lock Haven down the Bald Eagle Br to Tyrone
> then
> > on to Altoona. All still in place today and
> > usuable . ---  Ken 
>
> Tracks are in place, but are there qualified train
> crew available on short notice to operate a detour
> train on Norfolk Southern's Buffalo Line and the
> Nittany & Bald Eagle line?

And is the extra 3 to 4 hours going to be worth it? No. Could there have been a bus bridge of some sort? YES!

jp1822 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
 Could there have been a bus bridge of some
> sort? YES!

I addressed this in a previous post.  What am I misunderstanding about bus companies' ability to accommodate a request to provide bus bridges between Pittsburgh and Harrisburg?

RuleG Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kemacprr Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Back in the day Harrisburg up the Buffalo Line
> to
> > Lock Haven down the Bald Eagle Br to Tyrone
> then
> > on to Altoona. All still in place today and
> > usuable . ---  Ken 
>
> Tracks are in place, but are there qualified train
> crew available on short notice to operate a detour
> train on Norfolk Southern's Buffalo Line and the
> Nittany & Bald Eagle line?

I believe that was that case even in the Amtrak era in the 70's when the Bald Eagle was still a busy stretch of railroad.

jp1822 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And is the extra 3 to 4 hours going to be worth
> it? No. Could there have been a bus bridge of some
> sort? YES!

NO!

Charter bus companies are for the most part shut down temporarily.

Charter bus operators here in Southern California are currently requiring 4-7 day advance notice, even though the bus yards are full of buses. 

• Finding, contacting, activating and preparing a driver
• Updating insurance (They are not going to be paying for commercial passenger transport insurance for buses parked in a yard)'
• Contacting, activating and preparing bus mechanic or contractor
• Complete bus inspection and maintenance
• Local, state and federal inspections as required
• Preparing dispatch, routing, driver accommodations, fueling accommodations.

Compare that to pre-global pandemic of emergency charter bus with driver being available in 4-8 hours depending upon time of day.
 

jst3751 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jp1822 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > And is the extra 3 to 4 hours going to be worth
> > it? No. Could there have been a bus bridge of
> some
> > sort? YES!
>
> NO!
>
> Charter bus companies are for the most part shut
> down temporarily.
>
> Charter bus operators here in Southern California
> are currently requiring 4-7 day advance notice,
> even though the bus yards are full of buses. 
>
>

• Finding, contacting, activating and preparing a
  > driver
  >
• Updating insurance (They are not going to be
  > paying for commercial passenger transport
  > insurance for buses parked in a yard)'
  >
• Contacting, activating and preparing bus
  > mechanic or contractor
  >
• Complete bus inspection and maintenance
  >
• Local, state and federal inspections as
  > required
  >
• Preparing dispatch, routing, driver
  > accommodations, fueling accommodations.
  >
  > Compare that to pre-global pandemic of emergency
  > charter bus with driver being available in 4-8
  > hours depending upon time of day.
  >  

Charter bus companies? And lets talk about the route in question - not "what if" we were in California.......

Here's an alternative - Amtrak THRUWAY Bus 8690; departs Pittsburgh at 9:20 AM; Arrives 4:05 PM Harrisburg Transp Ctr 

Greyhound and Trailways already serve and operate bus service to cities that the Pennsylvanian train serves. The bus stations - at least in Pittsburgh and Harrisburg are practically in the train station or across the street. In matter of fact, if one were to look up Greyhound bus schedules from Harrisburg to Pittsburgh and vice versa, you will see that Amtrak already has a relationship with Greyhound (through its Thruway Bus network) to serve not only these two cities but intermediate stops as well. Moreover, when the eastbound Capitol Limited is late in making a connection at Pittsburgh, Amtrak provides alternative transportation. So there is a "pre-existing relationship."



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/21 16:05 by jp1822.

jp1822 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jst3751 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > jp1822 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > And is the extra 3 to 4 hours going to be
> worth
> > > it? No. Could there have been a bus bridge of
> > some
> > > sort? YES!
> >
> > NO!
> >
> > Charter bus companies are for the most part
> shut
> > down temporarily.
> >
> > Charter bus operators here in Southern
> California
> > are currently requiring 4-7 day advance notice,
> > even though the bus yards are full of buses. 
> >
> >
>
> [*]Finding, contacting, activating and preparing
> a
> > driver
> >
> [*]Updating insurance (They are not going to be
> > paying for commercial passenger transport
> > insurance for buses parked in a yard)'
> >
> [*]Contacting, activating and preparing bus
> > mechanic or contractor
> >
> [*]Complete bus inspection and maintenance
> >
> [*]Local, state and federal inspections as
> > required
> >
> [*]Preparing dispatch, routing, driver
> > accommodations, fueling accommodations.
> >
> > Compare that to pre-global pandemic of
> emergency
> > charter bus with driver being available in 4-8
> > hours depending upon time of day.
> >  
>
> Charter bus companies? And lets talk about the
> route in question - not "what if" we were in
> California.......
>
> Here's an alternative - Amtrak THRUWAY Bus 8690;
> departs Pittsburgh at 9:20 AM; Arrives 4:05 PM
> Harrisburg Transp Ctr 
>
> Greyhound and Trailways already serve and operate
> bus service to cities that the Pennsylvanian train
> serves. The bus stations - at least in Pittsburgh
> and Harrisburg are practically in the train
> station or across the street. In matter of fact,
> if one were to look up Greyhound bus schedules
> from Harrisburg to Pittsburgh and vice versa, you
> will see that Amtrak already has a relationship
> with Greyhound (through its Thruway Bus network)
> to serve not only these two cities but
> intermediate stops as well. Moreover, when the
> eastbound Capitol Limited is late in making a
> connection at Pittsburgh, Amtrak provides
> alternative transportation. So there is a
> "pre-existing relationship."

Posted from iPhone

“Here's an alternative - Amtrak THRUWAY Bus 8690;
> departs Pittsburgh at 9:20 AM; Arrives 4:05 PM
> Harrisburg Transp Ctr”

I don’t think that bus currently operates. It is listed in the timetable dated 3/16/20. That’s when the lockdown just got started. It does NOT show currently in the Amtrak app. The train itself is all that can be booked PGH to HAR and at intermediate stations.

Posted from iPhone

41bridge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> “Here's an alternative - Amtrak THRUWAY Bus
> 8690;
> > departs Pittsburgh at 9:20 AM; Arrives 4:05 PM
> > Harrisburg Transp Ctr”
>
> I don’t think that bus currently operates. It is
> listed in the timetable dated 3/16/20. That’s
> when the lockdown just got started. It does NOT
> show currently in the Amtrak app. The train itself
> is all that can be booked PGH to HAR and at
> intermediate stations.
>
> Posted from iPhone


No, When I rode the Bus from Latrobe or Greensburg in 90s and 2000. Amtrak called bus lines in Pittburgh, Pa area for Bus. Amtrak did not have Reg bus too Harrisburg every day back then.

41bridge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> “Here's an alternative - Amtrak THRUWAY Bus
> 8690;
> > departs Pittsburgh at 9:20 AM; Arrives 4:05 PM
> > Harrisburg Transp Ctr”
>
> I don’t think that bus currently operates. It is
> listed in the timetable dated 3/16/20. That’s
> when the lockdown just got started. It does NOT
> show currently in the Amtrak app. The train itself
> is all that can be booked PGH to HAR and at
> intermediate stations.
>
> Posted from iPhone

I'll concede that it is a little sketchy, as earlier it was coming up on Amtrak's website, but now it's only coming up on Greyhound's site, but still coming up. I copied the above from the Amtrak website - schedule for Amtrak Thruway 8690. So a bit weird, but they are definitely willing to charge my credit card $53 per person through Greyhound for a Pittsburgh to Harrisburg trip tomorrow, 2/25/2021......I would still think that with the Capitol Limited mis-connects, Amtrak's gotta have something in place that it can call upon.

Regardless, a larger point, evenbefore COVID, Amtrak was often saying - no alternative transportation. Common line. As compared to Amtrak's younger years, they would try to find alternative transportation...........

EDIT - Amtrak Thruway 8690 does exist. You have to put in station code PGB (B standing for Bus Station) and HAR. Then it will come up on Amtrak.com. There's actually two buses. 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/21 17:00 by jp1822.

You are right-the bus shows with the other station code. I stand corrected.

Posted from iPhone