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Date: 04/02/21 14:06
Metro North balloon track question
Author: Sp1110

Is the Metro North balloon track underneath Park Ave. at 46th St. a jointed rail track?



Date: 04/02/21 17:23
Re: Metro North balloon track question
Author: HotWater

Sp1110 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Is the Metro North balloon track underneath Park
> Ave. at 46th St. a jointed rail track?

What difference would it make? Why waste CWR on a 10 MPH "balloon track"?



Date: 04/02/21 17:29
Re: Metro North balloon track question
Author: Sp1110

I’m just wondering if the track still has the original rail installed in 1871.



Date: 04/02/21 17:39
Re: Metro North balloon track question
Author: HotWater

Sp1110 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I’m just wondering if the track still has the
> original rail installed in 1871.

You ARE kidding, right?



Date: 04/02/21 19:22
Re: Metro North balloon track question
Author: Sp1110

I thought the balloon track was rarely used since Metro North started using cab cars.



Date: 04/02/21 19:24
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: timz

The inner loop is long gone, I assume?
Did 85-foot cars ever go around it?



Date: 04/02/21 21:09
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Sp1110

I think lower level loop is now a spur.

I have never heard of a inner loop.
Some diagrams show the lower level loop as incomplete.



Date: 04/03/21 07:06
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: nm2320

Upper level loop is in service at Grand Central Terminal, New York City, NY. Took a train through it once during a disruption with M7 equipment. Do not know if it is welded. Lower level loop not in service. 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/21 07:07 by nm2320.



Date: 04/03/21 07:35
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: joemvcnj

I don't think the lower loop could handle 85' cars. I think they once tried, and people got in a lot of trouble.
Part of the footprint of that loop is reserved for future pedestrian access from the LIRR concourse to the subway. 



Date: 04/03/21 08:04
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Lackawanna484

Fascinating thread

Posted from Android



Date: 04/03/21 08:29
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Ray_Murphy

You realize that this is 3rd-rail territory and the GCT track layout is seriously confining in many ways. How would a CWR train ever get to this location?

Ray



Date: 04/03/21 08:53
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: joemvcnj

It also brings to mind if the current GCT terminal tracks are on the exact same footprint as the 1871 ones ? I don't think there were 2 levels in 1871 either. 



Date: 04/03/21 09:30
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: choodude

Ray_Murphy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You realize that this is 3rd-rail territory and the GCT track layout is seriously confining in many ways. How would a CWR train ever get to this location?

Nowadays one could get a Holland Welder high rail truck in there and ~ do it in place:

  https://www.hollandco.com/mow/fbweld

Brian



Date: 04/03/21 17:48
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Sp1110

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It also brings to mind if the current GCT terminal
> tracks are on the exact same footprint as the 1871
> ones ? I don't think there were 2 levels in 1871
> either. 

The upper level tracks were built in 1871. The balloon track was necessary because they didn’t have cab cars back then.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/21 17:51 by Sp1110.



Date: 04/04/21 09:34
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: tonymarchiando

I don't know which loop it was, but in 2013, to celebrate Grand Central's centennial, a train of private cars was brought in from Albany and Croton.
That train was turned on the loop and most of the cars were 85 feet--regular passenger cars, not commuter cars.  The cars were open for public display for the weekend May 11-12.

Tony
 



Date: 04/04/21 10:47
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Lackawanna484

Didn't New York Central pull many trains --backward-- to Mott Haven for service?

Posted from Android



Date: 04/04/21 11:37
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Sp1110

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Didn't New York Central pull many trains
> --backward-- to Mott Haven for service?
>
> Posted from Android

I thought it was illegal to run a train backwards without a caboose or a cab car.

At some point the lower loop was cut back.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/04/21 12:49 by Sp1110.



Date: 04/04/21 12:50
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: joemvcnj

They hitched an electric loco on the rear and hauled them back to the Bronx. 
I don't think the lower level loop tracks could ever handle 81 or 85 foot passenger cars. The NY Central's 60' long MU's vanished by 1972. 



Date: 04/04/21 15:10
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: Lackawanna484

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They hitched an electric loco on the rear and
> hauled them back to the Bronx. 
SNIP

Thanks. That was my recollection.

Posted from Android



Date: 04/04/21 15:28
Re: Metro North balloon
Author: choodude

Sp1110 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought it was illegal to run a train backwards without a caboose or a cab car.

I don't think that applies to passenger trains with a sheltered end..  A backup (brake) hose and working communication with the engineer (usually by radio these days)   Sure speed is reduced, but for example Today's post:

Photo 5 - Less then 60 seconds seconds later, the City of New Orleans backs in after a reverse move at 21st street since the Air Line bridge is still out of service.

From:

  https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,5229370,5229370#msg-5229370

Brian
 



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