Passenger Trains > Track Design...turnout guard rails

...May be a factor in DC METRO's loose wheels.. New revelations may place blame for loosening wheels on7000 series cars....on the GUARD Rails in turnouts (crossovers). Can a "real" railroader please explain this. How can a guard rail, inside the (running) guage rail, grab and force a wheel on the 6000 and .7000 series cars,  OUTWARD on an axle?
All the experts apparently have missed this phenomenon.

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Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/21/22 14:37 by mp208.

https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,5544894,5544894#msg-5544894

Those guard rails hold the wheel against the outer rail at the frog.

            By pushing on the inside of the wheel which transmits a lot of that force to the car. The car weight has to be moved over in the process too.

Maybe some should be inspecting the "Check Gauge" along with the actual "Track Gauge". The "Check Gauge" is the measurement from the inside of the guard rail to the opposite side running rail. If the "Check Gauge" is too tight, the guard rail will force the wheel to move on the axle. Had that happen on Amtrak SDP40F units assigned to trains going to San Diego, CA where the Santa Fe crosses the SP at grade. The "Check Gauge" was seriously off on that crossing, and when one of our EMD District Engineers rode the cab through that area, it almost knocked him to the floor! The crew stated that it does that every trip. He then drove his car out to that crossing, and there just happened to be an SP MoW track inspector there. Upon talking to the inspector, who stated that they have been receiving LOTS of complaints about a "rough ride" through that crossing. Our man, who was an active model railroader, asked the inspector about the track gauge, and the inspector got the "gauge" out of his truck, and measured everything, saying, "See,,,,,,,,everything is OK.". Our man then asked about the "Check Gauge", and the inspector didn't know what that was. So,,,,,,,,,our man went to the back of the inspector's truck and pulled out the measuring "stick" for the "Check Gauge", and showed the inspector how to use it. Naturally they discovered that the "Check Gauge" was way off, and close inspection revealed that the guard rail had been slamming the back of locomotive wheels, and thus changing the wheel spacing.

Naturally a big war resulted over THAT, between Amtrak, EMD, and the SP! 

THANK YOU Hot Water.....THAT is what we were looking for !!!

It would be logical that there would be little "side slap" when entering the guard rails as both wheels on the axle would enter the "slots" simultaneously AND be forced OUTWARD by the too WIDE guard rails. To solve the lingering pressures, merely narrow the distance between the opposing guard rails by a nominal one inch.

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