Passenger Trains > article: san diego wants to tax people out of cars to pub/transit

https://www.sandiegonewsdesk.com/2023/01/san-diego-wants-to-tax-people-out-of-their-cars-and-into-public-transportation/

66

Quite the inflammatory article. Oh the horror!
Public transit usage is pretty low in San Diego



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/25/23 16:03 by Oregonpaul.

A particular party wants to tax everything, so this is no suprirse.

I support rail 1000%, but not if it is forced on folks.  Make the trains worth traveling, and things will take care of themselves.  It is that simple.

Never happen in this century. Americans are too in love with cars and the independence is gives them.

Posted from Android

The California freeway system is free and I have a new found respect for them after navigating through Kansas and Oklahoma last summer trying to avoid the costly turnpikes.  I was really ignorant until this summer that much of the country pays to travel on multi-lane highways. If this was a political party issue then I would expect Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas to have free turnpikes.  Instead they continue to expand them.  In California expanding our freeway system is costly and perhaps building new toll lanes instead of freeway expansion will speed up driving and transit for everyone.

 

Todd Clark
Canyon Country, CA
Trainorders.com

i would be curious about the percentage of the san diego area population (including n/san diego county) that actually live near public rail transit (coaster, sprinter, and trolley) where they could use it without driving their vehicles to the stations...........

66
 

webmaster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The California freeway system is free and I have a
> new found respect for it after navigating through
> Kansas and Oklahoma last summer trying to avoid
> the costly turnpikes.  I was really ignorant
> until this summer that much of the country pays to
> travel on multi-lane highways. If this was a
> political party issue then I would expect
> Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas to have free
> turnpikes.  Instead they continue to expand
> them.  In California expanding our freeway system
> is costly and perhaps building new toll lanes
> instead of freeway expansion will speed up driving
> and transit for everyone.
>

i would think those who can't afford to pay tolls, don't live near public transit, or public transit does not meet their current needs, will still drive and just make the surface streets or freeways more crowded........

66

Here in Pennsylvania, as well as in other states, and even nationally, a mileage tax has been discussed as a successor to gasoline taxes because increased vehicle fuel efficiency and increased usage of electric vehicles is reducing revenues from liquid fuel taxes.

Freeways are not "free" in cities.  Their construction has resulted in enormous negative impacts on communities through which freeways with significant financial, environmental, social, and health costs.

webmaster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The California freeway system is free and I have a
> new found respect for them after navigating
> through Kansas and Oklahoma last summer trying to
> avoid the costly turnpikes.  I was really
> ignorant until this summer that much of the
> country pays to travel on multi-lane highways. If
> this was a political party issue then I would
> expect Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas to have free
> turnpikes.  Instead they continue to expand
> them.  In California expanding our freeway system
> is costly and perhaps building new toll lanes
> instead of freeway expansion will speed up driving
> and transit for everyone.
>

Not all that free, it's not what you think.  CA state gas tax is $.54/gallon, Tx $.20, OK$.19

So y'all pay 2-1/2 x more in gas tax than we Texans pay.  The theory in flyover country
is that those that use the roads pay for them via tolls, those that don't use them don't pay
for them..  CA drivers all pay towards the "free"  highways whether they use them or not.  Fuel
at my local station is 2.79/gal gas, $3.89 diesel.  Bet CA is a lot more than that and a lot of
that is due to gas tax.  I filled up with diesel this morning and drove to Dallas and had a choice
to take Interstate highways in Dallas or use a toll route.  I could have taken transit too but the last mile
would have been costly and the complete trip would have taken 3x as long in my time.
 

webmaster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The California freeway system is free and I have a
> new found respect for them after navigating
> through Kansas and Oklahoma last summer trying to
> avoid the costly turnpikes.  I was really
> ignorant until this summer that much of the
> country pays to travel on multi-lane highways. If
> this was a political party issue then I would
> expect Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas to have free
> turnpikes.  Instead they continue to expand
> them.  In California expanding our freeway system
> is costly and perhaps building new toll lanes
> instead of freeway expansion will speed up driving
> and transit for everyone.
>
>  
You probably should also avoid the Orlando, Florida, area as well. We went there last summer and found nearly all the expressways were toll roads. We were prepared for it, so not a huge deal.

Kim Heusekl

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Desmond 

Here's a little info on the author for those of us who don't live in San Diego. 

WrongWayMurphy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> webmaster Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The California freeway system is free and I have
> a
> > new found respect for them after navigating
> > through Kansas and Oklahoma last summer trying
> to
> > avoid the costly turnpikes.  I was really
> > ignorant until this summer that much of the
> > country pays to travel on multi-lane highways.
> If
> > this was a political party issue then I would
> > expect Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas to have free
> > turnpikes.  Instead they continue to expand
> > them.  In California expanding our freeway
> system
> > is costly and perhaps building new toll lanes
> > instead of freeway expansion will speed up
> driving
> > and transit for everyone.
> >
>
> Not all that free, it's not what you think.  CA
> state gas tax is $.54/gallon, Tx $.20, OK$.19
>
> So y'all pay 2-1/2 x more in gas tax than we
> Texans pay.  The theory in flyover country
> is that those that use the roads pay for them via
> tolls, those that don't use them don't pay
> for them..  CA drivers all pay towards the
> "free"  highways whether they use them or not.
>  Fuel
> at my local station is 2.79/gal gas, $3.89 diesel.
>  Bet CA is a lot more than that and a lot of
> that is due to gas tax.  I filled up with diesel
> this morning and drove to Dallas and had a choice
> to take Interstate highways in Dallas or use a
> toll route.  I could have taken transit too but
> the last mile
> would have been costly and the complete trip would
> have taken 3x as long in my time.
>  

I paid $5.70 for diesel yesterday. We also pay through the nose for California Freeways. It cost $300 dollars a year for a 20 year old pickup registration.
Im not sure how San Diego thinks they can charge for the freeway use when they belong to the state and are paid for with registration and fuel taxes. Sacramento makrs that call.

Paid 4.69 a gallon yesterday for diesel in Redding Ca. yesterday and I don't have to live in flyover country. It's worth it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/26/23 00:04 by nedzarp.

The proponent of this "idea" is the San Diego County Regional Transportation Agency, which has no legal powers to tax anybody. They will need to get the County Board of Supervisors to sign off on it and vote for the taxes.
Voting for increased taxes usually doesn't get you reelected, something always on the mind of politicians...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/25/23 23:54 by PHall.

nedzarp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Paid 4.69 a gallon yesterday for diesel in Redding
> Ca. yesterday and I don't have to live in flyover
> country. It's worth it.


It was $4.65 in St Johns Florida yesterday, and I am not in Peoples Republic of Califorina.  A win on both counts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/26/23 06:50 by Typhoon.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The proponent of this "idea" is the San Diego
> County Regional Transportation Agency, which has
> no legal powers to tax anybody. They will need to
> get the County Board of Supervisors to sign off on
> it and vote for the taxes.
> Voting for increased taxes usually doesn't get you
> reelected, something always on the mind of
> politicians...

Doesn't seem to matter here in California. The state has been wanting to do this for years. Will hurt low income drivers, who commute long distances to affordable housing, the most. Mileage taxes should only be for electric vehicles since they don't pay at the pump. Another option might be charging the tax at the charger ?

In many places in Europe (boo! Hiss!!) you'll pay $8 per gallon for gasoline. Plus a tax on your engine size / horsepower. Plus a toll to use most major highways. 

They see it as helping to pay for the cost of building and maintaining highways, and providing local rail and bus service to most of the population

Here in Chile,  based on today's exchange rate,  95-octane gas is US$6.25 a gallon.   And the autoways are all toll roads.  Which are maintained to an extremely high standard,  unlike when I visit my home state of  California these days.  And nobody seems to be bothered by any of this.  It's incredible how many Ford F-150 and other mega-pickups are on the roads,  not to mention a preponderance of SUVs.  But both Santiago and Concepcion has a well-developed electric commuter train network.  Santiago also has an ever-expanding subway system.

SanDiegan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The proponent of this "idea" is the San Diego
> > County Regional Transportation Agency, which
> has
> > no legal powers to tax anybody. They will need
> to
> > get the County Board of Supervisors to sign off
> on
> > it and vote for the taxes.
> > Voting for increased taxes usually doesn't get
> you
> > reelected, something always on the mind of
> > politicians...
>
> Doesn't seem to matter here in California. The
> state has been wanting to do this for years. Will
> hurt low income drivers, who commute long
> distances to affordable housing, the most. Mileage
> taxes should only be for electric vehicles since
> they don't pay at the pump. Another option might
> be charging the tax at the charger ?

Actually taxing everybody by the mile would be the most fair. The ones putting the most wear and tear on the roads would pay for it.

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In many places in Europe (boo! Hiss!!) you'll pay
> $8 per gallon for gasoline. Plus a tax on your
> engine size / horsepower. Plus a toll to use most
> major highways. 

Similar situation in Japan EXCEPT that gas costs about $4.50 per gallon. Ignoring the exchange rate (150-160 Yen per liter), "global" events in recent months didn't change the gas price that much, maybe 10% fluctuation AT MOST. Fortunately, Japanese residents can ignore the 20%+ fluctuation in the Dollar vs. Yen exchange rate.

The toll highway system in Japan is well-maintained (I drove on it last year). Highway system revenues have little (probably NOTHING) to do with supporting public transporation over there. 

> They see it as helping to pay for the cost of
> building and maintaining highways, and providing
> local rail and bus service to most of the
> population