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Date: 07/05/26 06:47
How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: march_hare

OK, a simple minded engineering question regarding the closure of movable bridges due to heat expansion:

Why not spray water on the bridges?  All of the NJ ones cross navigable water, which is to say water that's deep enough to float a boat. Why not get a bunch of "trash pumps" at Home Depot and spray water on these bridges?  I realize that salinity issues would play in there somewhere, but you'd only be spraying for a few days. 

Criticism welcome. 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/26 07:29 by march_hare.



Date: 07/05/26 07:19
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: Englewood

Good idea but in today's world it would be about as simple as building a working car washer in Chicago.



Date: 07/05/26 07:54
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: MNR225

:
Fireboat Cools Down Stuck Buffalo BridgeJuly 2, 2026BUFFALO, NY – People and pets aren’t the only ones feeling the impact of this hot weather this week. Even bridges are struggling. A video posted Wednesday by Fire Buff New York showed the Edward M. Cotter fire boat along the Niagara River. It was called in to help cool off the Michigan Street Bridge. It was so hot that the metal was expanding, making it unable to lift properly“Due to the extreme heat, there was an issue with the metal expanding which caused the bridge to stick. The Edward Cotter was spraying water on the bridge to cool it down,” a City of Buffalo spokesperson said.https://www.boatnerd.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Edward-M.-Cotter-cooling-off-Bufalo-bridge.-Fire-Buff-400x216.pngEdward M. Cotter cooling off Buffalo bridge. [Fire Buff]   Edward M. Cotter is a fireboat in use by the Buffalo Fire Department at Buffalo, New York, United States. Originally named William S. Grattan, it was built in 1900 by the Crescent Shipyard of Elizabeth Port, New Jersey. Due to age, it was rebuilt in 1953 and renamed Firefighter upon its return to service. The following year it was renamed Edward M. Cotter.[3] Its namesake, Edward Cotter, was a Buffalo firefighter and leader of the local firefighters union who had recently died.[4]Edward M. Cotter is considered to be the oldest active fireboat in the world and was designated a National Historic Landmark in 1996.[2][5][6] Along with its firefighting duties, during the winter Edward M. Cotter is used as an icebreaker on Buffalo's rivers. Edward M. Cotter mounts five fire monitors that are capable of pumping 15,000 US gallons per minute (0.95 m3/s; 12,000 imp gal/min).[7][8] It can often be seen sailing out of its berth and south-west to Lake Erie, returning north through the breakwall and firing its fire monitors.



Date: 07/05/26 08:50
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: march_hare

So it's not such a goofy idea after all. I wonder how much water it takes to be effective. 

Next, for my nerdy amusement, does the problem originate mostly from expansion of the rails, or does it involve expansion of the b\ridge itself?



Date: 07/05/26 09:24
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: kevink

Englewood Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Good idea but in today's world it would be about
> as simple as building a working car washer in
> Chicago.

Amtrak installed water sprinklers on the South Branch Bridge in Chicago several years ago. Seems to have reduced the number of heat-related closures.

Posted from iPhone



Date: 07/05/26 10:00
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: Lackawanna484

Built in sprayers sound like something NJ Transit rail should be considering for its North Jersey Coast Line bridges.

Ten million dollars worth of consultants later...

Posted from Android



Date: 07/05/26 10:06
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: jp1822

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Built in sprayers sound like something NJ Transit
> rail should be considering for its North Jersey
> Coast Line bridges.
>
> Ten million dollars worth of consultants later...
>
> Posted from Android

It honestly should not be that hard. And it does come up in NJ more than one thinks for both NJT rail lines and the NEC. Even highway draw bridges were subject to gettting dowsed by fire companies to get the bridges back in the "down position" so they could align properly in closing. 



Date: 07/05/26 10:22
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: PHall

Of course if you put in a Bridge Cooling System then you have to maintain it too. Just another item on the underfunded maintenance budget.



Date: 07/05/26 11:36
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: jp1822

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Of course if you put in a Bridge Cooling System
> then you have to maintain it too. Just another
> item on the underfunded maintenance budget.

You betcha - put a pump in the waterway near the bridge and have some old fashioned sprinklers with simple piping running across the bridge. Problem is - this does have a chance of being realized because it doesn't just affect rail passenger riders like a train car wash does. The bridges being in the "closed position" during the latest heat wave have garnered the attention of wealthy Jersey Shore community boaters with ties to government leadership. People often don't forget things in a day in NJ.......



Date: 07/05/26 12:15
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: radar

Spraying a steel bridge with salt water seems like it could fuel rust and deterioration something terrible, no matter how brief.



Date: 07/05/26 14:06
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: SCAX3401

kevink Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Amtrak installed water sprinklers on the South
> Branch Bridge in Chicago several years ago. Seems
> to have reduced the number of heat-related
> closures.

And they were working back in June 2022 when I went over this bridge twice (Capitol Limited east, Lake Shore Limited west) on what were fairly hot Chicago days..



Date: 07/05/26 15:16
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: PHall

jp1822 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Of course if you put in a Bridge Cooling System
> > then you have to maintain it too. Just another
> > item on the underfunded maintenance budget.
>
> You betcha - put a pump in the waterway near the
> bridge and have some old fashioned sprinklers with
> simple piping running across the bridge. Problem
> is - this does have a chance of being realized
> because it doesn't just affect rail passenger
> riders like a train car wash does. The bridges
> being in the "closed position" during the latest
> heat wave have garnered the attention of wealthy
> Jersey Shore community boaters with ties to
> government leadership. People often don't forget
> things in a day in NJ.......

And you have to make sure it's drained before the first freeze of the season too.



Date: 07/06/26 04:24
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: jp1822

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jp1822 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > PHall Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Of course if you put in a Bridge Cooling
> System
> > > then you have to maintain it too. Just
> another
> > > item on the underfunded maintenance budget.
> >
> > You betcha - put a pump in the waterway near
> the
> > bridge and have some old fashioned sprinklers
> with
> > simple piping running across the bridge.
> Problem
> > is - this does have a chance of being realized
> > because it doesn't just affect rail passenger
> > riders like a train car wash does. The bridges
> > being in the "closed position" during the
> latest
> > heat wave have garnered the attention of
> wealthy
> > Jersey Shore community boaters with ties to
> > government leadership. People often don't
> forget
> > things in a day in NJ.......
>
> And you have to make sure it's drained before the
> first freeze of the season too.

You must work for Amtrak - making a simple solution complicated with lots of excuses.......



Date: 07/06/26 13:22
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: mapboy

Speaking of water on bridges, the US Forest Service in Yosemite has wooden bridges on trails in fire-prone areas with sprinklers fed by water lines from upstream.  When there's a fire in the area, someone opens the valve (it could be a remote control solar-powered valve) and gravity does its work.  A relatively low maintenance system.

mapboy



Date: 07/06/26 17:03
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: phthithu

A lot of interesting stuff in this thread. I know the NWP has a glitchy swing bridge at Black Point that has problem with uneven heating as it runs sort of northeast to southwest and in the afternoon that can cause problems with the sun on the northwest facing side.  



Date: 07/07/26 07:33
Re: How to keep movable bridges movable
Author: longliveSP

jp1822 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > jp1822 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > PHall Wrote:
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > -----
> > > > Of course if you put in a Bridge Cooling
> > System
> > > > then you have to maintain it too. Just
> > another
> > > > item on the underfunded maintenance budget.
> > >
> > > You betcha - put a pump in the waterway near
> > the
> > > bridge and have some old fashioned sprinklers
> > with
> > > simple piping running across the bridge.
> > Problem
> > > is - this does have a chance of being
> realized
> > > because it doesn't just affect rail passenger
> > > riders like a train car wash does. The
> bridges
> > > being in the "closed position" during the
> > latest
> > > heat wave have garnered the attention of
> > wealthy
> > > Jersey Shore community boaters with ties to
> > > government leadership. People often don't
> > forget
> > > things in a day in NJ.......
> >
> > And you have to make sure it's drained before
> the
> > first freeze of the season too.
>
> You must work for Amtrak - making a simple
> solution complicated with lots of excuses.......

Nothing the government is involved with is simple...



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