Passenger Trains > Mineta to Stay in Bush Cabinet: Speaks on Amtrak

Federal assistance for Amtrak ought to be on the same basis as federal assistance for highways and metropolitan transit systems, with the federal government paying a smaller share of the costs, Mineta said.

"There ought to be a local-share component in the financial support of those railroad services," Mineta said.

Mineta said Bush backs the hard-nosed plan requiring states to pay up -- or lose service.

"If a train goes through a state and that state is not willing to pony up the state's share, then we would run the train through that state, not stopping and keeping the doors closed," Mineta said.

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Comments: "Keeping the doors closed" sounds good on bureaucratic paper, but is rather silly as a practical matter. Suppose Nevada declines to pay for the CZ, but (somehow) the other states do. The train no longer serves stations in Nevada, like Reno. But Californians and others want to go to Reno; it's a fairly big market. So you punish them, in addition to punishing Nevada. And the service the Californians and others are paying for is worth less because it doesn't serve a critical destination!

There's a possbility that the tour group sponsoring the Reno fun train could extend operations through the summer. Perhaps a few of the casinos would want to lend some money to see that the train keeps going? Problem solved and Nevada doesn't have to pay for the CZ.

I used to respect Mineta, but he lost credibilty in publicly stating that the 6-cent gas tax was adequate for now and the future. In fact inflation and construction cost factors have eroded it to a level that can barely maintain roads, yet alone build new ones.
It stuck me that he was too close to the "starve the beast" band of Republicans that see no taxes as the best end point of our economic plan, never mind that a civilized society builds infrastructure as a matter of course.
As for California funding transportation, just count that couple of hundred dollars of refund for vehicle registration next time you want "them" to "do something" about traffic. Seriously, the nation is grossly underfunding transportation infrastructure.

I think that any words such as "privatization' and "State participation" are simply Bushspeak for "kill 'em'.

The Administration wants the LD's gone, the raiilroads want 'em gone, and probably even the mass transit oriented "Gunnmen' want them gone as well.

So who is left, the Congresscritters, who have constituents that either like to hear the whistle blow or 'of course will ride 'em; uh, not now but ..someday", and the diehards of which nowadays there are enough to keep "one a day (if that, maybe six a week)" adequately filled.

But let's be straight up with one another; the equipment, save locomotives, is at the end of its economic life. There is no new equipment on the horizon, and somehow I think that the primarily Red State 'critters' will see sufficient non rail rewards "coming home' for their continued support of the only thing Amtrak has that counts - the Northeast Corridor.

samreeves Wrote:
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> There's a possbility that the tour group
> sponsoring the Reno fun train could extend
> operations through the summer. Perhaps a few of
> the casinos would want to lend some money to see
> that the train keeps going? Problem solved and
> Nevada doesn't have to pay for the CZ.


Wow ! It's that simple. Thanks!Maybe we could hold a couple bake sales and get back the Desert Wind!
But then there is the pesky problem of liability.... The Reno Fun Train exists only because Amtrak is self insured and covers it. Never mind I Just Don't Believe that sort of thing is a problem , hey No Problemo, if we just have faith it's all so simple!

Interesting point, Mr. Karpo--

Apparently since the Reno Fun Train pre-existed Amtrak, Amtrak indemnifies anything arising from its operation.

At least that is how I read your posting.

Enquiring mind wants to know.

Federal gas tax is actually 18 cents or even more, not 6 cents.

Hi!


>Seriously, the nation is grossly underfunding transportation
> infrastructure.


Not one single mile of pavement would ever need to be replaced if it were not for trucks, ergo send the bill for repairs to the trucking industry! I figure a half million bucks per truck should about do it... :-)


No, it's spending exactly what the public wants to spend, and not one penny more. Both sides want to kill the Amtrak black hole and get on with road building and airports, which is what people really demand!


Want outsourcing to end? Spend a whopping amount in deficit and keep spending until the dollar tanks. Then, you get all your jobs back. Ta-daaaaaa!!! At least maybe SOME of the west bound containers will be full! :-) :-)


Tony Burzio
San Diego, CA

Hi!


> I think that any words such as "privatization' and
> "State participation" are simply Bushspeak for
> "kill 'em'.


Our President at least has the nerve to say what everyone thinks, kill Amtrak!


I think you will find that private companies could do a much better job, or at least they couldn't do any worse! :-) Amtrak is the Trans Siberian Express (Stalinist Era) mode of transport, and is dehumanizing at best, and insulting at worst...


Amtrak is the best example of why Doctors should be allowed to pull the plug when brain death occurs...


> rewards "coming home' for their continued support
> of the only thing Amtrak has that counts - the
> Northeast Corridor.


Then let New York and Massachusetts pay for it. The cost of replacing all the infrastructure will make the "Big Dig" look like a weekend project!


Tony Burzio
San Diego, CA

tburzio Wrote:
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> > rewards "coming home' for their continued
> > support of the only thing Amtrak has that
> > counts - the Northeast Corridor.
>
> Then let New York and Massachusetts pay for it.
> The cost of replacing all the infrastructure will
> make the "Big Dig" look like a weekend project!

They already do. These figures are from 2002, but the numbers for following years are similar.

http://www.nemw.org/fundsrank.htm

The chart is for federal tax dollars, not local or state tax dollars. The state that gets screwed the most is New Jersey. Its taxpayers get back 66 cents for every $1 in federal taxes they pay. Residents of New Mexico, on the other hand, get back $2.34 for every $1 in federal taxes they pay.

Wow. Look how many of the states up at the top, the ones that receive the most while paying the least, are red states.

> Amtrak is the best example of why Doctors
> should be allowed to pull the plug when
> brain death occurs...

That would cost you your life.

tburzio Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I think you will find that private companies could
> do a much better job, or at least they couldn't do
> any worse! :-) Amtrak is the Trans Siberian
> Express (Stalinist Era) mode of transport, and is
> dehumanizing at best, and insulting at worst...

You do know that the Trans-Siberian Express still exists, riiight?? And with newer cars, and 15 of them per train, riiight??

So apparently not that dehumanizing..........

Learn before you speak, my man.

QUOTE
I think you will find that private companies could do a much better job, or at least they couldn't do any worse! :-) Amtrak is the Trans Siberian Express (Stalinist Era) mode of transport, and is dehumanizing at best, and insulting at worst...
UNQUOTE

How about being explicit here: Just how is Amtrak dehumanizing at best, insulting at worst? As for TransSiberian, at least Russia runs real passenger trains. That sure as hell isn't the case here, unless you can afford to ride AOE and I can't.
And as for that 'private companies' garbage, get some new material. That's the same old idiotic line the Bush bastards have been spouting off since time immemorial.
Every other country in the civilized, industrialized (but not for long if Dumbo has his way) realizes that passenger trains are a part of their national infrastructure. Guess who is the one country that demands profits?
And Mineta? He used to one of the Democrats' leading attack dogs. He lost his teeth and cajones when he took the Usurper's shilling. Same old crap from one of the 'diversified' tokens.

reindeerflame Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> "If a train goes through a state and that state is
> not willing to pony up the state's share, then we
> would run the train through that state, not
> stopping and keeping the doors closed," Mineta
> said.

I think a few trains do this now. The Pere Marquette is mostly funded by the
state of Michigan, and I'm pretty sure Indiana doesn't chip in any money, and
lost their Hammond/Whiting stop (even though the train goes right past it)

Actually, Mineta's real agenda, as was pointed out, is to unload the LDTs. He figures states will be unlikely to fund any of them, but might fund certain regional corridors like CHI-DET and NIA-NYP. So the LDTs would not operate on a closed door basis through nonpaying states, but rather would likely "not operate regardless of door status through no states".

Mineta is nothing more than a political hack. He has been on the government payroll since the 60's in local San Jose government. He was an inept mayor and later congressman. When was the last time old Norm rode a train? Probably on the way to Manzanar or Tule Lake. How can any government official understand transportation needs? The ride in limosenes we pay for, fly first class or on government aircraft. A police escort to move them thru traffic. It doesn't matter whether it is Bush, Gore, Kerry or whoever---as long as we allow government officials to be treated as royalty, the needs of the rest us use can just go to hell.

drew1946 Wrote:
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> Mineta is nothing more than a political hack. He
> has been on the government payroll since the 60's
> in local San Jose government. He was an inept
> mayor and later congressman.

I am a native San Josean, a registered Republican, and have been a friend of Norman Mineta for nearly 40 years. Norm was an excellent mayor of San Jose and went on to a distinguished career in Congress where he was head of the transportation committee for many years. Norm worked closely with the local powers to get the light rail built in San Jose and established a Transportation Institute at San Jose State to study such problems. I last saw Norm a year ago when the University of California honored him as Alumnus of the Year, an honor rarely if ever bestowed on a "politician". Norm is one of the few people/politicians I know whose name can be put in the same sentence with the words Honest and ethical.





When was the last
> time old Norm rode a train? Probably on the way to
> Manzanar or Tule Lake.

This is a truly inappropriate, uncalled- for and insulting remark.

There are some "realities" of political life at the cabinet level in DC that I think we have all been seeing lately. If you don't agree with the boss, you're outta here. Anne Veneman, who just stepped down as Sec. of Agriculture, had a very difficult 4 years. Her plans didn't mesh with the boss'es plans and weren't supported. I would say that Norm has probably found ways to be effective and carry out the boss'es plans, and BTW, we didn't vote for "the boss". Actually, the Amtrak problems have continued for 34 years in spite of the leadership or lack thereof because Downs and Warringtons and Gunns will come and go but the bureaucrats running the show remain within Amtrak, just like the bureaucrats remain in the DOT no matter who the Secretary is. And they are the ones that push the papers, or don't push them, pull the levers or don't pull them, and they know it.
C.

obviously Carol, you I disagree on some things, and yes that was an insulting remark---it was meant to be.

I'm with drew, honest, honest? Ain't "The states have to pay their share to keep LD Trains Running" the same mumbo jumbo we've been hearing since 2001 for crying out loud? Come on, if Mineta is honest like you say Carol, how come he doesn't even see what's needed to have a good balanced transportation system like local cities, certain states, and other countries on the rest of this planet already sees, and it works!

The simple solution is that there must be some sort of passenger train policy in the USA period. Right now there is none.

Be it private companies or Amtrak nothing is going to work unless the Feds support it. The supposed greatest country in the world has a 3rd world passenger rail system.

There should not be any reason why every major city in the USA should not have decent rail service.

More toilet paper from the Monica Express fans. The public doesn't want Amtrak. The public doesn't want to pay for Amtrak. The politicians who want to be elected, over and over, know there is no public, voter, taxpayer interest in Amtrak.

In fact, they probably get an earful from the freight interests complaining that Amtrak is in the way.

The public wants highways, airports and airplanes. They even want barges and waterways.

There are some short hop/corridor type operations that can be popular enough that the public sees them as an alternative to driving or flying. Even if you take Reno - the market is from the west. Folks aren't clamoring to run from Chicago to Reno.