Steam & Excursion > Rebuild of UP 3985 Time Frame?

How long did it take for the 3985? Am I correct that it was a private group that did the restoration?

It's not as big an engine but when I was helping restore the 765 in the late 70s, IIRC, it took us five years. (I was not involved from the very beginning, however.) We did it all outside and the biggest piece of equipment was a front-end-loader. I remember the first time we had the 765 moving under its own power. I don't recall who was at the throttle but it could have been Gary Bensman or Larry Randolph. Do you Remember Jack Wheelahan or Dick Yager?) The drivers slipped with a little cloud of dust under the wheels. Landing on the moon is great achievement, but I wouldn't trade that for that day and moment in time with the 765.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/13/14 22:01 by wabash2800.

I'm sure those with firsthand experience will weigh in, but the book "Union Pacific 3985" book by William Botkin, Ronald Hill, & Dick Kindig states that #3985 was removed from display near the Cheyenne depot for restoration on September 24, 1979, and steamed up for the first time on January 17, 1981 with a first test run the following March. It was restored by a committee of UP employees who "donated their spare time", according to the book, and done using the UP shop facilities.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/13/14 23:35 by davew833.

What ever happened to Dick Yager?

Keystone1 Wrote:
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> What ever happened to Dick Yager?

Nothing, but what does Dick have to due with ANYTHING on the UP?

Davew833 was correct in the information on the move and listed work. We did however begin some work on it in the parking lot earlier in 1979 until the mechanical forces were asked to allow us some room indoors to do our work. All of our work was done in a stall in the roundhouse with the tender removed to fit the locomotive inside and close the door. The fire up in January of 1981 was viewed by representatives from Omaha who were traveling through and included a guest of theirs, Henry Kissinger. In March they made a break in run to LaSalle, Colorado and upon return, after being worked pretty hard, they broke a small support spring which was quickly replaced. The 3985 was then ready to be used and was assigned to double head with the 8444 to the opening of the California State Railroad Museum that May. A group of us restoration volunteers were invited to travel with the mechanical operating crew that trip, assisting with the maintenance of the locomotives. Upon return to Cheyenne that trip we were presented papers to sign granting the running and operating rights of 3985 to the railroad. They did until 1989, when Steve Lee, who had been placed in charge of the engines operation, selected Lynn and I to be his firemen when the mechanical officers could no longer travel and fire the locomotives. In 1991 when we were to return to Railfair in Sacramento, Steve had me operate the 3985 on the double header and I had Rick Steele for a fireman. It was from that time on that I became the "second shift" engineer. and would have guest firemen like Hotwater and Frisco1522 and others from other locomotive crews.

In memory of Don Ringstadt and Lynn Nystrom, along with John Boehner, Tim Grotheer, Craig Ringgenberg and myself.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

So the mechanical department employees fired the engine, and operating department engineers ran it? Why was it set up like that, and how did that work out?

The "Iron Duke" posts here. I just thought that Jack or Dick would know who was at the throttle of the 765 that first day of operation. Regarding the 3985 restoration, that's a much shorter time frame than I expected even if they had the UP facilities--job well done. Based on that, one would think the 4014 might not take as long as projected. Perhaps the projected time frame is little CYA padded. Fine.

Keystone1 Wrote:
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> What ever happened to Dick Yager?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/14/14 08:09 by wabash2800.

wabash2800 Wrote:
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> I remember the first time we had the 765 moving
> under its own power. I don't recall who was at the
> throttle


I'm pretty sure that it was Dick Yager who actually made her move the very first time. I was sort of "teaching" each guy how to use the throttle and independent brake in order to stop short of that tight curve. For hours, each member of the board, as well as the "restoration crew" took turns at the throttle. Finally Dick Yager told me to run her, but he wanted to be on the ground first. I knew what Dick wanted me to do, so I waited until Dick was in position, and he gave me a high ball signal. He barely got her moving, then went to full throttle and stormed past the photo line. As I passed them, I saw the look on Dick's pace and he simply fell over backwards on the ground. I got her stopped just as she enter the curve, but it was a bit too far as the emergency tripped from the emergency protection valve on the lead truck. A great time was had by all.

IIRC, the "5 year estimate" probably has to do with the desire to have 4014 up & running for the 150 year anniversary of UP incorporation in 1869.

Bob

FRA regs have changed a lot since the initial restoration of #3985 and some of the other restorations performed in the '70s and early '80s that seemed to take a very short time and were accomplished on a shoestring budget. Not only that, but the locomotives involved had been out of service for a much shorter period of time. #3985 was retired for approximately 20 years and stored inside for maybe 1/3 to 1/2 of that time before its initial restoration. Comparatively, #4014 had been on display outside in the California sunshine for 52 years. I'm sure there's plenty of padding in the restoration estimate, but it's a whole different ballgame now than it was in the '70s and '80s.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/14/14 09:28 by davew833.

ddg Wrote:
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> So the mechanical department employees fired the
> engine, and operating department engineers ran it?
> Why was it set up like that, and how did that work
> out?


Originally the Chief mechanical officer, Frank Acord, ran the locomotive but not necessarily being qualified on the operating rules and his age creeping up on him, I believer the operating department felt better having an operating officer in charge of running the locomotive. Steve Lee was assigned that position since he was already in Cheyenne and had run with them a trip or two. Then Steve was assigned the program altogether and was over the steam crew mechanical guys in Cheyenne and would get the Omaha mechanical firemen for a while until Omaha decided in 1989 to not release them for this extra work. That was when Steve went to Jerry Davis, VPO, and got permission to try us on a run to see if we would be qualified to fire the locomotives. "And that's the rest of the story".

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

You guys were the best at it too Bob!

Back in July of 1977, I was crossing the country on the Greyhound system (couldn't afford Amtrak that year). On the 3rd, at about 2 AM we stopped in Cheyenne to clean and refuel the bus. I stepped outside the "Dog Kennel" to stretch my legs and get some fresh air. I vaguely recall seeing a steam locomotive just barely visible in the wee-small-hours darkness. Would this have been 3985?

I am thinking you likely saw the UP 3985 which was
displayed in fenced enclosure the west parking lot at the Cheyenne WY depot (north of the depot mainlines).
I saw the UP 3985 at that same display location in August 1978.
I believe the UP 3985 was moved to the UP Steam shop by summer 1979.
The year 1977 would give you the 3985 in that west lot location at the CY WY depot.
These memories of yours and mine would make logical and historic sense.
---- Daniel


DNRY122 Wrote:
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> Back in July of 1977, I was crossing the country
> on the Greyhound system (couldn't afford Amtrak
> that year). On the 3rd, at about 2 AM we stopped
> in Cheyenne to clean and refuel the bus. I
> stepped outside the "Dog Kennel" to stretch my
> legs and get some fresh air. I vaguely recall
> seeing a steam locomotive just barely visible in
> the wee-small-hours darkness. Would this have
> been 3985?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/14 11:00 by daniel3197.

The repairs to get the 3985 up and running will be affected by the work that will going with the 4014. I think the 3985 is going to suffer because of the recent arrival of the 4014. The 3985 has sat for 2 years now when there was only two locomotives to keep up with, and now there is three one of which needs a restoration done. The UP844 from recent posts needs alot of boiler work now, so its not looking good for the 3985.

CS

Im glad the guys took the time and effort to bring the UP3985 back to life again. It was a great locomotive with a great crew, I hope it runs again in the near future.

CS

Switching gears back to the 765 overhaul, Dick Yager sat in the engineers seat on Sept. 1, 1979 but all of the Board Members had a hand on the throttle (yes, a lot of hands- about 8)when she moved for the first time. That was a thrilling moment for us all. It proved that this was possible. It's difficult to compare overhauls. The 765 only sat in the Fort Wayne's Lawton Park from 1963 to 1974 so it hadn't suffered from 50 years outdoors like lots of locomotives today. It was a recent overhaul and she had about 65,000 miles on the "odometer" after the 1955 overhaul; had operated until 1958; and sat inside the enginehouse until 1960.

Looking back, the work done in 1975-79 was nowhere near the work done around 2005. The 765's return to service for her Second Career was done outdoors without benefit of a real shop building and no paid people other than Joe Karal the retired NKP boilermaker. It was a true shoestring project and was definitely a hard way to do it.