Steam & Excursion > Santa Fe steam passenger locomotives in freight service

Did the Santa Fe ever use 2900's, 3400's or 3751's in freight service? Mail and express doesn't count.

Years ago a retired AT&SF locomotive engineer used to regale me with stories about the performance of 2900's on reefer blocks between Amarillo and Clovis.

Gordon

All the 4-8-4's were used in freight service at one time or another. The 3400's with 79 inch drivers would not have been the first choice, but they may have been used on a short, very hot perishable run. I know the 4-6-4's were mostly broken in on local freights, but I've never heard of one in freight service other than that. The 1309 Class absolutely was used in local service from time to time. I've heard stories from guys who fired and ran 2900's and they were doing 70 with 100 cars across parts of Kansas and out of Pueblo, Colorado. Diesels couldn't catch'em across the flats..it was the mountains that got'em.

mt19a Wrote:

> Did the Santa Fe ever use 2900's, 3400's or 3751's
> in freight service?

This old thread includes photos of 4-6-2's 3449 and 3522 hauling trains of reefers in California's San Joaquin Valley in 1948 (and a bit further down, a few pictures of 4-4-2's on short local freights in the same general area):

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?10,3421248

The 4-8-4's saw more use as freight engines as dieselization advanced, and the very last 2900's in service were used as helpers on eastbound freights between Belen and Mountainair, NM in 1956-57.  Here's an Otto Perry photo of a fairly youthful 2901 moving perishables in 1946:

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15330coll22/id/58747

ATSF 2906 and 2910 on freights in 1950:

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15330coll22/id/58782
http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15330coll22/id/58775

Frank Ellington got a sound recording of a Santa Fe 4-6-2 in local service at Baring, MO in the last days of steam on the east end of the ATSF.
Then Allen Bradley took this photo of the El Capitan rolling easy by the derrick train powered by the Santa Fe 3420, 4-6-2, reportably the last steam to operate on the Illinois Division. This was taken by Mr. Bradley in Monica, IL.

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El Capitan looks like its derailed in that photo. 

Up in the San Joaquin Valley of California, its so flat that a Pacific would do very well.  Atlantic's could handle the passenger trains when necessary.

​I have photos of a SP Atlantic handling nine passenger cars very well in the Valley.  Crew liked them more then a 4300   4-8-2. or larger.

 

The 2912, now in Pueblo, hauled more freight than passenger during its brief career.

railscenes Wrote:

> Then Allen Bradley took this photo of the El
> Capitan rolling easy by the derrick train powered
> by the Santa Fe 3420, 4-6-2, reportably the last
> steam to operate on the Illinois Division. This
> was taken by Mr. Bradley in Monica, IL.

There was a bad wreck involving the eastbound El Capitan and Kansas City Chief at Monica, IL on July 6, 1950 - is that what we're looking at here?

http://www3.gendisasters.com/illinois/23582/monica-il-passenger-trains-collide-jul-1950

Evan_Werkema Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> railscenes Wrote:
>
> > Then Allen Bradley took this photo of the El
> > Capitan rolling easy by the derrick train
> powered
> > by the Santa Fe 3420, 4-6-2, reportably the
> last
> > steam to operate on the Illinois Division. This
> > was taken by Mr. Bradley in Monica, IL.
>
> There was a bad wreck involving the eastbound El
> Capitan and Kansas City Chief at Monica, IL on
> July 6, 1950 - is that what we're looking at
> here?
>
> http://www3.gendisasters.com/illinois/23582/monica
> -il-passenger-trains-collide-jul-1950

This would certainly seem possible to me due to the number of people gathered at trackside.

-Fred-

Yes, The El Cap was derailed by side swiping the other train. My mistake. I thought it had been cleaned up when Allen took this photo, but enlarged from the 35mm slide it is obviously tilted. Allen Bradley gave me this slide since I was more interested in the 3420 lettering on the rear end of the tank. The two trains were eastbound when the El Cap was overtaking the Kansas City Chief on the straight 90 MPH double track main. Don't recall the full story of the cause but believe the KC train derailed first.
Thanks much, Steve Rippeteau



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/16 01:27 by railscenes.

The 2900  and 3700 class engines were used in both passenger and freight service and, as someone else mentioned, toward the end of steam it was all freight and eventually just helper service in New Mexico.  I recall making a trip from Kansas to California in 1946 on the Grand Canyon, with a 2900 all the way.  A few years later I saw 2900's on freights (moving very fast) on the southern route through Kansas and the panhandles.  Where I lived in Kansas, the last steam I saw was 3463, a Hudson with 84-inch drivers.  It came through on No. 5, the Ranger  as a pinch-hitter for a wounded E unit in about 1953.  Those Hudsons were never used for freight, as far as I know, and they were reputed to be the fastest steam engines alive........comparable to the Hudsons on the Milwaukee and C&NW........but probably too slippery to haul too many tons.

I t seems to me the Santa Fe got the War Production Board to allow the construction of 2900's because they were to be used primarilly as fast freight locomotives.

Potato Rush.
TAH

90mac Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Potato Rush.
> TAH

I wasn't aware that the Santa Fe operated in eastern Oregon or Idaho.

HotWater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 90mac Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Potato Rush.
> > TAH
>
> I wasn't aware that the Santa Fe operated in
> eastern Oregon or Idaho.

The used to grow a lot of spuds in the Salt River Valley...in Arizona.....

According to E. D. Worley author of Iron Horses of the Santa Fe Trail the 2900 Class 4-8-4 Baldwins "were the last passenger steam locomotives purchased by the Santa Fe". However I have read other sources that say in order to satisfy the War Production Board (US government) during WWII the ATSF designated the 2900 Class as "Dual Service"  engines. It did not matter even with the 80 inch drivers, according the engineers who ran them, the 2900's did just fine rolling a fast freight or providing excellent helper service to the new diesel electric power. Worley did say in his section on the 2900 Class that in 1943 the ATSF management would have preferred to order more diesel electric power. But again other sources explained that there was a shortage of the new diesel technology and it needed to be rationed to the greatest need which was for navel vessels in need of the same type of diesel engines. So the War Production Board ruled that the ATSF could have the "dual service" steam power with 80 inch drivers. Mr. Worley also noted that the WPB also limited the type of steel used for the construction of the 2900 Class to the heavier carbon steel which made the ATSF 2900 Class the most powerful as their weight on drivers exceeded all other 4-8-4's. The irony of that was the lighter weight nickel steel had boilers used on the 3765 and 3776 Class 4-8-4's had problems and most of the boilers had to be replaced just as the ATSF was turning to diesel power. After listening to Santa Fe engineers and firemen describe their experiences run the 2900 Class in passenger and freight service (Wichita, KS convention of the SFRH&MS) I'm convinced they were one of the most versatile and powerful steam locos ever built. True there were more powerful steam locos but could they run at sustained speeds of 90-100 MPH with a string of heavy weight passenger and express cars?
Just a collection of thoughts from reading and listening to different sources. Steve Rippeteau