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Passenger Trains > Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington raceDate: 09/22/14 13:47 Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: GenePoon Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race
Philadelphia Daily News by JENELLE JANCI September 21, 2014 > A FRIENDLY disagreement on Twitter spawned a race between a $78,000 > sports car and an Amtrak express train. > > If only every Twitter debate could be so productive. > > Road vs. Rails chronicled the 440-mile journey yesterday of Amtrak's > high-speed Acela and a 2014 Porsche Panamara from Boston to > Washington, D.C., on social media. > > Transit advocate and graphicmachine partner Matt Staub traveled for > Team Train while car enthusiast and eCommerce manager Kris Nielsen > drove for Team Porsche. > > Staub and Nielsen initiated the car vs. train race last year after > connecting on Twitter. That contest pitted a luxury sedan vs. > Amtrak's Southwest Chief between Kansas City and Chicago. The sedan > won by just eight minutes. > > This year's rematch kicked off at 8:45 a.m. yesterday at Boston's > South Station. Online spectators followed the race on > RoadvsRails.com, interacting with the contestants on Twitter along > the way... The Porsche led until it hit traffic around Baltimore...Team Train ultimately won. The contest is now one-to-one. Full story: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/22/14 13:47 by GenePoon. Date: 09/22/14 14:04 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: Lackawanna484 Good race, nicely played.
Timing the traffic is critical, as any commuter knows. Hit the Cross Bronx or GWB after 3pm and you're dead meat. Baltimore after 4pm, and you're pit beef. DC, south of the station at the 395/495 bowl after 3pm and you'll be there a few hours. Yeah I know it's south of Union Station. Date: 09/22/14 14:07 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: howeld Good for amtrak.
Top Gear on BBC does this all the time. Posted from iPhone Date: 09/22/14 14:26 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: GenePoon Not as good for Amtrak as I would have expected...the car was 25 minutes ahead through New York and
Philadelphia. But as mentioned...probably more depends on traffic than on anything else, but these days traffic can be anywhere! Date: 09/22/14 14:26 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: NewRiverGeorge The true test would be Acela vs. airline, downtown to downtown. Nobody in their right mind drives a car between Boston and Washington.
Date: 09/22/14 15:22 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: GenePoon NewRiverGeorge Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > The true test would be Acela vs. airline, downtown > to downtown. Nobody in their right mind drives a > car between Boston and Washington. ================================================ I often...several times a year...fly between Boston and Washington, and the airline plus ground transport handily beats Acela. Part of that is due to the location of Washington Reagan National Airport, convenient to transit. Boston-Philadelphia has also been a consistent winner for the airliner. Again, there is good rail transit airport-to-Center City. New York is another matter... Date: 09/22/14 17:26 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: CA_Sou_MA_Agent Now, if you REALLY wanted to level the playing field, either have the Porsche make all the stops the train was obligated to protect, or let the train run non-stop between the two cities, as I assume was a luxury the Porsche had.
This would be a good contest between LA and San Diego on a weekend, although the Surfliners are being bogged down with too many stops, especially with all those NCTD "local" stops south of Oceanside. Date: 09/22/14 20:33 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: RuleG Lackawanna484 Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- Hit the Cross Bronx or GWB after 3pm and > you're dead meat. Baltimore after 4pm, and you're > pit beef. So, if you hit Philadelphia traffic at the wrong time, are you cheesesteak? Date: 09/22/14 21:04 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: Wurli1938 NewRiverGeorge Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > The true test would be Acela vs. airline, downtown > to downtown. Nobody in their right mind drives a > car between Boston and Washington. Not even competetive. Air miles are much shorter, and the plane is moving a shorter distance at a much higher speed. Date: 09/23/14 02:17 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: Lackawanna484 RuleG Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Lackawanna484 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > Hit the Cross Bronx or GWB after 3pm and > > you're dead meat. Baltimore after 4pm, and > you're > > pit beef. > > So, if you hit Philadelphia traffic at the wrong > time, are you cheesesteak? Yes. Although I figured many drivers would bypass Philly by taking the NJ Turnpike. The bypass routes around New York City (Tappan Zee bridge, Pal Parkway, etc) and Baltimore add a lot of time and distance to the trip. Date: 09/23/14 06:06 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: Out_Of_Service Lackawanna484 Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > RuleG Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Lackawanna484 Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > Hit the Cross Bronx or GWB after 3pm and > > > you're dead meat. Baltimore after 4pm, and > > you're > > > pit beef. > > > > So, if you hit Philadelphia traffic at the > wrong > > time, are you cheesesteak? > > Yes. Although I figured many drivers would bypass > Philly by taking the NJ Turnpike. The bypass > routes around New York City (Tappan Zee bridge, > Pal Parkway, etc) and Baltimore add a lot of time > and distance to the trip. NJ trpk has major construction and lane closures around exit 7 then goes down to 2 lanes each way south of exit 4 ... 295 get some major backup from Mount Laurel to the 42 freeway southbound during rush hours starting around 7a.m. till 9a.m. then again HEAVY backup starting 3 p.m. to 6 p.m. ... I live a block away from the 295 exit and about a mile away from the exit 3 on the New Jersey Turnpike ... if I'm in a hurry to get somewhere around those times I'm hitting the backroads ... and you don't need to go to Philly to get some good cheese steaks ... all of South Jersey from Philly to the shore is basically cheesesteak territory ... i have a plethora of sandwich food businesses just in my town alone and within a few miles ... some of which can rival any Philadelphia cheesesteak ... Pats and Genos are the two hype hot spot cheesesteak places that you read about and see on TV but to many of the locals they're just iconic landmarks and very overrated Posted from Android Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 09/23/14 06:22 by Out_Of_Service. Date: 09/23/14 08:14 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: toledopatch Agree. The train isn't even attempting to compete between Boston-Washington. But it's got a huge advantage on shorter hauls because of flying's "overhead" time costs related to ground transportation, security clearance, etc.
Date: 09/23/14 12:28 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: trainman630 RuleG Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Lackawanna484 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > Hit the Cross Bronx or GWB after 3pm and > > you're dead meat. Baltimore after 4pm, and > you're > > pit beef. > > So, if you hit Philadelphia traffic at the wrong > time, are you cheesesteak? I surprised they got out of Boston without getting their beans baked. Date: 09/23/14 14:22 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: agentatascadero CA_Sou_MA_Agent Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Now, if you REALLY wanted to level the playing > field, either have the Porsche make all the stops > the train was obligated to protect, or let the > train run non-stop between the two cities, as I > assume was a luxury the Porsche had. > > This would be a good contest between LA and San > Diego on a weekend, although the Surfliners are > being bogged down with too many stops, especially > with all those NCTD "local" stops south of > Oceanside. Regards "competition", you hit the nail squarely on the head. In any contest between a train and auto, if the two do not follow the same "race format" then there really is no contest, so it is imperative that the auto make the same stops as does the train. In any such contest, the auto would have great difficulty being competitive with the progress of that old slow train. For comparative purposes, let's take the express vs the local bus trip, it takes time, and lots of it, to get off that freeway, to the station, and back on the freeway for each stop. AA Stanford White Carmel Valley, CA Date: 09/24/14 06:15 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: Cole42 agentatascadero Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > CA_Sou_MA_Agent Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Now, if you REALLY wanted to level the playing > > field, either have the Porsche make all the > stops > > the train was obligated to protect, or let the > > train run non-stop between the two cities, as I > > assume was a luxury the Porsche had. > > > > This would be a good contest between LA and San > > Diego on a weekend, although the Surfliners are > > being bogged down with too many stops, > especially > > with all those NCTD "local" stops south of > > Oceanside. > > Regards "competition", you hit the nail squarely > on the head. In any contest between a train and > auto, if the two do not follow the same "race > format" then there really is no contest, so it is > imperative that the auto make the same stops as > does the train. In any such contest, the auto > would have great difficulty being competitive with > the progress of that old slow train. For > comparative purposes, let's take the express vs > the local bus trip, it takes time, and lots of it, > to get off that freeway, to the station, and back > on the freeway for each stop. AA But if you are comparing driving Bos-Was to taking the train, it's a fair format as you wouldn't get off at every place the train does. Someone debating which way is faster would look at it this way. Of course there are a lot of variables - rush hour travel is a lot different than middle of the night travel. Date: 09/25/14 22:38 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: CA_Sou_MA_Agent Cole42 Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > But if you are comparing driving Bos-Was to taking > the train, it's a fair format . . . That's debatable. To call it a "race" is almost stretching the definition of the word. "Comparison" might be a better word. I also feel it's pretty bogus to hold marathons and allow the women participants to have a head start over the men just because it's pretty much accepted that men generally run faster in marathons than women. I've also heard they make the Kenyan participants start later than the others because it's a given that the Kenyans will always win anyway. Date: 09/26/14 11:45 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: agentatascadero CA_Sou_MA_Agent Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Cole42 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > But if you are comparing driving Bos-Was to > taking > > the train, it's a fair format . . . > > That's debatable. > > To call it a "race" is almost stretching the > definition of the word. "Comparison" might be a > better word. > > I also feel it's pretty bogus to hold marathons > and allow the women participants to have a head > start over the men just because it's pretty much > accepted that men generally run faster in > marathons than women. I've also heard they make > the Kenyan participants start later than the > others because it's a given that the Kenyans will > always win anyway. Several things...regards that "race", perhaps it is actually impossible to avoid the apples and oranges factor....the train has to make all those stops, unless the car does too, there cannot be any comparison because there is no basis for comparison. If the car gets to make the trip nonstop, then the only relevant comparison would be for the train to run nonstop too. Regards marathon competitions, the measure of the race is the time elapsed for the course....NOT who actually crosses the line in what order. If starts are staggered, the clocks at the finish line match the staggered start times. Women's and men's competitions are seperate, even if run together. AA Stanford White Carmel Valley, CA Date: 09/26/14 18:44 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: CA_Sou_MA_Agent agentatascadero Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Regards marathon competitions, the measure of the race > is the time elapsed for the course....NOT who > actually crosses the line in what order. If > starts are staggered, the clocks at the finish > line match the staggered start times. Women's and > men's competitions are seperate, even if run > together. AA In the March 08, 2005 edition of the LA TIMES, here's what three readers had to say about the competitive advantage that was given to women: Women's Head Start in the L.A. Marathon Re "For Runners, an Ideal Day to Reach Goals," March 7: There are runners; some are men; some are women. They all run with the same equipment. Why are women given a head start advantage? I foresee in the near future that a woman with the right physical characteristics, the motivation to win and a little luck will beat the leading man's time. This time advantage for the women should be eliminated. Donald L. Hager Los Angeles * Might we recommend that you ask the person who came up with the brainchild to run men and women against each other competitively in the L.A. Marathon to retire from the post that gave him or her the power to bring such an idea to fruition. The finishing times fluctuate unpredictably from year to year, even on the same course. This fantasy to have a photo finish with an additional $75,000 in prize money put an unnecessary additional and psychological strain on the athletes. No computer program can compensate for performance differences in humans. Have men compete against men and women against women and let the winners divide the winnings evenly. Heinz and Janice Fischer Long Beach * I am so sorry for poor Lyubov Denisova, the L.A. Marathon women's division winner. I agree with her that the men had a big advantage. It was truly terrible that she and the other elite women runners only had a 15-minute, 50-second head start over the elite men. How are women ever going to be able to prove themselves equal to men without a greater head start? Daryl Smith Chatsworth Date: 09/26/14 20:12 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: agentatascadero CA_Sou_MA_Agent Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > agentatascadero Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Regards marathon competitions, the measure of > the race > > is the time elapsed for the course....NOT who > > actually crosses the line in what order. If > > starts are staggered, the clocks at the finish > > line match the staggered start times. Women's > and > > men's competitions are seperate, even if run > > together. AA > > In the March 08, 2005 edition of the LA TIMES, > here's what three readers had to say about the > competitive advantage that was given to women: > > Women's Head Start in the L.A. Marathon > > Re "For Runners, an Ideal Day to Reach Goals," > March 7: There are runners; some are men; some are > women. They all run with the same equipment. Why > are women given a head start advantage? I foresee > in the near future that a woman with the right > physical characteristics, the motivation to win > and a little luck will beat the leading man's > time. This time advantage for the women should be > eliminated. > > Donald L. Hager > Los Angeles > * > Might we recommend that you ask the person who > came up with the brainchild to run men and women > against each other competitively in the L.A. > Marathon to retire from the post that gave him or > her the power to bring such an idea to fruition. > The finishing times fluctuate unpredictably from > year to year, even on the same course. > > This fantasy to have a photo finish with an > additional $75,000 in prize money put an > unnecessary additional and psychological strain on > the athletes. No computer program can compensate > for performance differences in humans. Have men > compete against men and women against women and > let the winners divide the winnings evenly. > > Heinz and Janice Fischer > Long Beach > * > I am so sorry for poor Lyubov Denisova, the L.A. > Marathon women's division winner. I agree with her > that the men had a big advantage. It was truly > terrible that she and the other elite women > runners only had a 15-minute, 50-second head start > over the elite men. How are women ever going to be > able to prove themselves equal to men without a > greater head start? > > Daryl Smith > Chatsworth So, I made a visit to the LA Marathon website...but do not know how to post a link, sorry...and checked in to the results section, among others, and found ALL results to be determined by elapsed time on the course...as is the case in all marathons, at least those which are sanctioned by the governing authority....there is no such thing as a "head start", just staggered starts to ease the crowding. AA Stanford White Carmel Valley, CA Date: 09/27/14 21:55 Re: Train vs. Porsche: Boston to Washington race Author: CA_Sou_MA_Agent agentatascadero Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > So, I made a visit to the LA Marathon > website...but do not know how to post a link, > sorry...and checked in to the results section, > among others, and found ALL results to be > determined by elapsed time on the course...as is > the case in all marathons, at least those which > are sanctioned by the governing authority....there > is no such thing as a "head start", just staggered > starts to ease the crowding. AA For Runners, an Ideal Day to Reach Goals L.A. Marathon's 25,000 participants enjoy mild conditions while pounding the ground along the 26.2-mile route. March 07, 2005|Natasha Lee, Claudia Zequeira and Rong-Gong Lin II | Times Staff Writers More than 25,000 runners packed the streets of Los Angeles on Sunday for the city's 20th annual marathon, a movable feast of a block party that was capped by an exciting finish among the fastest athletes. For most participants, it was a day to enjoy some sunny and forgivingly mild Southern California weather, as well as a self-propelled tour of famous L.A. neighborhoods. It was also a day to meet personal challenges. "Short of broken bones or blood, I'm not stopping," said Lori Kamler of Huntington Beach, who at 45 was running in her first marathon. Leading the pack at one point was Lyubov Denisova of Russia, one of a handful of elite female athletes who had been given a 15-minute, 50-second head start. That was part of what organizers called "the Challenge": a promise that the first runner -- regardless of gender -- to break the finish-line tape would win a $75,000 bonus prize. Late in the race, Denisova was passed by Kenyan runner Ben Maiyo. Near the 26-mile mark, however, another Kenyan, Mark Saina, overtook Maiyo and won the race with a time of 2:09:35. Speaking through a translator after the race, Denisova -- who set the female course record with a time of 2:26:11 -- expressed bitterness about the way the Challenge was set up. She said she would not return to the L.A. race unless the handicap was lengthened to cover the difference between male and female course records -- about 16 minutes, 45 seconds. Marathon president Bill Burke said determining the handicap is an imperfect science, although he noted that it was arrived at by half a dozen experts on racing statistics. "I'm not quite sure what her gripe is other than the fact that she lost," he said. For most of its history, the L.A. Marathon has been more of an expression of community spirit than a venue for the world's top marathon runners. None of the elite men participating this year held any of the world's 100 fastest marathon times of 2004. That could change. The L.A. Marathon was recently purchased by Devine Racing, which owns marathons in Las Vegas and Salt Lake City. Chairman Chris Devine said last week that potential race sponsors have been talking about paying big money to attract the world's very best athletes to future L.A. Marathons -- a move that could propel the race into the ranks of top-tier marathons such as those in New York, Boston and London. For now, however, the race is mostly about doctors and dishwashers, grandmothers and occasional goofballs and their attempts to conquer 26.2 miles of asphalt. Before the start of the race, Tyrone Armstrong of Hollywood conceded that his 4-pound gorilla costume and bongo drums were going to present a challenge. "It's definitely going to slow me down, but when you're athletic like me it's no sweat," said Armstrong, 33. "I've always wanted to run a marathon, and what better way than in a monkey suit?" The purity of Armstrong's motives was muddled by the fact that he was being paid by Nintendo, which had positioned 50 running apes in the race to promote its new video game, "Donkey Kong Jungle Beat." The participants' journey began at 6th and Figueroa streets downtown, cheered on by boxing great Muhammad Ali and by Mayor James K. Hahn. The course took them past the L.A. Coliseum and through parts of South L.A., the Fairfax district, the Miracle Mile and Koreatown. Unlike last year, when blistering temperatures dulled some of the party atmosphere, runners in Sunday's race faced pleasant temperatures in the mid-50s and 60s. In addition to the main marathon, 18,426 cyclists took part in a separate bike tour. Dozens of athletes also participated in a wheelchair race. The marathon's 6-mile point was at Martin Luther King Jr. Boulevard and Arlington Avenue. Nancy Hoppe, 33, of Huntington Beach, was waiting there with her family, hoping to catch a glimpse of husband Kevin Hoppe. Kevin, she said, got serious about running just six months ago, participating in the 13-mile Huntington Beach marathon in February. "We think he might be hooked," she said. At mile 15, Lea Yost, a 38-year-old physical therapist, walked briskly along La Cienega Boulevard wearing a foam lobster hat. She graciously thanked onlookers who cheered her on with cries of "Go, lobster lady!" "I picked the lobster because I'm clawing my way to the front," she said. Last year, Yost said, she went with a turtle theme. "Because turtles always make it." Clif Braun, 27, decided to stop at Versailles restaurant for a break and a plate of Cuban chicken, rice and plantains after running 15 miles. Braun, a travel agent, said signing up for the race was a spur-of-the-moment decision. "I literally was the last person to sign his name down at the Staples Center before registration ended," he said. Braun admitted he stayed up the night before and did "everything that shouldn't be done before a marathon." Still, he said he had every intention of finishing. "I want to see how far I can go," he said. Nine miles farther along, the Native American Wildhorse Singers offered inspirational chanting and drumming at Olympic Boulevard and 10th Street. The group, made up of Apache, Cherokee and Navajo Indians, has been performing at the marathon for 19 years. In years past, performer Michael Reifel said, a local Native American running club called the Intertribe Roadrunners had fielded as many as 15 runners. But their participation had dwindled of late. "It all started out with supporting the native runners," Reifel said. "Now we're here to support all the runners." Back downtown at the finish line, some runners breezed in, while others limped in pain. Maribah Abiedu, 27, made it in 3 hours, 18 minutes. It was a decent time, she said, but she planned to intensify her training for the next event. Abiedu said she had a cramp in her right leg, and the soles of her feet were tingling with pain. Her next stop, she said, was her couch. "You take the next three to four days off to recover," she said. Aldo Aldana reached the finish line in 8 hours, 24 minutes. A polio survivor, Aldana had covered the entire route on crutches, his left leg pushing up most of his body weight while his weaker right leg dangled to the right on each step. Along the route, spectators called out "You're such an inspiration!" and "Go Aldo!" Aldana, a 30-year-old nursing student from Highland Park, was participating in his 11th L.A. Marathon. He had used a wheelchair for his first eight races, but said he discovered that using crutches was actually easier. Last year the rubber support on the bottom of both crutches broke off at mile 16. But Aldana pushed on and finished in 8 hours, 23 minutes. This year, he said, he came prepared with extra rubber supports. By 4:38 p.m., as Aldana finished, organizers had already started packing up. But as he crossed the finish line, those remaining gave him one last cheer. "Augh," was all he could muster in response as he grinned broadly. emphasis added |