Western Railroad Discussion > UP genset switcher at NRE

The UPY 2005 was indeed built on the underframe and trucks of the former SP 2690, an MP15DC from 1974. The resemblance to an Alco C415 is coincidental, not by design. The cab and sub-base of the SP 2690 were totally rotted out from 30 years of service, not worth rebuilding or even repairing. The decision was made to position the cab roughly midships over the fuel tank to simplify mounting of the twin genset packages. Its unlikely any additional MP- or SW-type units will be converted to genset switchers, more likely future units will be either GE B-boat or EMD GP conversions which will enable mounting three gensets instead of only two. For the UPY 2005, original thought was to use an SW1500, but the MP15DC is 4' longer, the SW1500 frame would have required a cabless unit.

In addition to the cab, the fuel tank was scrapped and replaced with a new design (looks the same) incorporating thicker end, side and bottom sheets, meeting an existing AAR standard used on new road units since 1994 for improved resistance to punctures.

The cab has twin 110 volt RV-style air conditioners, and the cab roof was extended out slightly over both ends to block out as much overhead sunlight and heat as possible without reducing visibility. The unit has a motorized parking brake, mounted in the cab, which is applied and released using push buttons. An extra pair of apply-and-release push buttons are located on the underframe on both sides, so the parking brake can be applied-or-released from inside the cab or on the ground.

As to the earlier comment that the UPY 2005 will create visibility issues for engineers because only three of the four corners are visible ... Most switching today on Class I roads is performed using GP38-2, GP15, etc. type road-switchers with full-height engine carbodies, leaving the engineer with only 2-corner visibility sitting in the engineer's seat.

Each genset is powered by a Cummins 700 HP inline-6 diesel engine, derived from Cummins' largest over-the-road truck diesel engine. The genset package is essentially a self-contained power plant. The fabricated base (which bolts to the locomotive underframe) is tubular steel and also holds engine lube oil as it is automatically drained in small amounts from the engine, replenished automatically, to increase the time between engine oil changes. The top of each genset package is open steel grid, with the antifreeze-equipped radiator under the grid. One of the railroad's requirements was that an individual genset package could be replaced in 8 hours. There are only a handful of connections between the gensets and the locomotive (fuel, air and electrical and control lines).

NRE found that the UPY 2005 could stall one of the FURX (ex-CNW, ex-UP) GP50s in a "tractor pull" test with the two units coupled together and loaded in opposite directions. In one test, the genset switcher actually starting pulling the GP50 backwards. The genset switcher, like the Railpower Green Goat hybrid, uses individual traction motor control, like a GE AC locomotive. If one wheel starts to slip, power is reduced only to that wheel/traction motor, while the other three wheelsets/motors can maintain or increase their load. The UPY 2005 only weighs about 260,000 pounds, but it will outstart and outpull at low speed any of the 277,000 pound GP50s (with Super Series and all 4 motors in permanent parallel circuits).

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wow, thks

greendot Wrote:
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> The UPY 2005 was indeed built on the underframe
> and trucks of the former SP 2690, an MP15DC from
> 1974. The resemblance to an Alco C415 is
> coincidental, not by design. The cab and sub-base
> of the SP 2690 were totally rotted out from 30
> years of service, not worth rebuilding or even
> repairing. The decision was made to position the
> cab roughly midships over the fuel tank to
> simplify mounting of the twin genset packages. Its
> unlikely any additional MP- or SW-type units will
> be converted to genset switchers, more likely
> future units will be either GE B-boat or EMD GP
> conversions which will enable mounting three
> gensets instead of only two. For the UPY 2005,
> original thought was to use an SW1500, but the
> MP15DC is 4' longer, the SW1500 frame would have
> required a cabless unit.
>
> In addition to the cab, the fuel tank was scrapped
> and replaced with a new design (looks the same)
> incorporating thicker end, side and bottom sheets,
> meeting an existing AAR standard used on new road
> units since 1994 for improved resistance to
> punctures.
>
> The cab has twin 110 volt RV-style air
> conditioners, and the cab roof was extended out
> slightly over both ends to block out as much
> overhead sunlight and heat as possible without
> reducing visibility. The unit has a motorized
> parking brake, mounted in the cab, which is
> applied and released using push buttons. An extra
> pair of apply-and-release push buttons are located
> on the underframe on both sides, so the parking
> brake can be applied-or-released from inside the
> cab or on the ground.
>
> As to the earlier comment that the UPY 2005 will
> create visibility issues for engineers because
> only three of the four corners are visible ...
> Most switching today on Class I roads is performed
> using GP38-2, GP15, etc. type road-switchers with
> full-height engine carbodies, leaving the engineer
> with only 2-corner visibility sitting in the
> engineer's seat.
>
> Each genset is powered by a Cummins 700 HP
> inline-6 diesel engine, derived from Cummins'
> largest over-the-road truck diesel engine. The
> genset package is essentially a self-contained
> power plant. The fabricated base (which bolts to
> the locomotive underframe) is tubular steel and
> also holds engine lube oil as it is automatically
> drained in small amounts from the engine,
> replenished automatically, to increase the time
> between engine oil changes. The top of each genset
> package is open steel grid, with the
> antifreeze-equipped radiator under the grid. One
> of the railroad's requirements was that an
> individual genset package could be replaced in 8
> hours. There are only a handful of connections
> between the gensets and the locomotive (fuel, air
> and electrical and control lines).
>
> NRE found that the UPY 2005 could stall one of the
> FURX (ex-CNW, ex-UP) GP50s in a "tractor pull"
> test with the two units coupled together and
> loaded in opposite directions. In one test, the
> genset switcher actually starting pulling the GP50
> backwards. The genset switcher, like the Railpower
> Green Goat hybrid, uses individual traction motor
> control, like a GE AC locomotive. If one wheel
> starts to slip, power is reduced only to that
> wheel/traction motor, while the other three
> wheelsets/motors can maintain or increase their
> load. The UPY 2005 only weighs about 260,000
> pounds, but it will outstart and outpull at low
> speed any of the 277,000 pound GP50s (with Super
> Series and all 4 motors in permanent parallel
> circuits).


I see a bright future for the Duetz air cooled diesel
engine and generator sets in the near future.

Anyone know where this unit will be assigned?

Thanks for the great writeup on 2005...for those interested in seeing the inside of the first UPY unit from RP, #2004, here's a link to a photo slideshow from a tour I was given by the RP tech during Dunsmuir RR Days this year:

http://www.shastarails.com/photos/slideshow.asp?ID=5465&type=update

-Ryan Wilkerson
http://www.shastarails.com

Ryan, What information does the small computer screen mounted on the control stand tell the engineer?

Hey Greendot...U got a larger pic?? That one is only 7k, and is that the before and after?? I mean of the old SP switcher cab, and the new genset in the background?

David.Curlee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ryan, What information does the small computer
> screen mounted on the control stand tell the
> engineer?

I remember looking at it but I'll have to look at the full sized version of the photo to see the details. I'll post a large crop of the photo tonight.
-Ryan

Interesting information. Thanks for posting it.

Is the unit equipped for RCL? I don't see the usual outward indications of it.

A couple questions (don't know if you'll know, but figure I'll ask...):
- Are they MU-capable?
- What kind of maximum speed with any decent pulling power?
- Any idea what the pricetag would be if these hit production quantities? Comparable with a freshly-rebuilt GP7/9 or so?

I'm just thinking these are a really cool concept and wondering if it could eventually make inroads on the more prosperous shortlines. Can't wait to see this thing in person...

Nathan

Kind of reminds me of Baldwin's diesel experiments from the 1940's, large units packed with individual gen-sets.

RyanWilkerson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> David.Curlee Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ryan, What information does the small
> computer
> > screen mounted on the control stand tell the
> > engineer?
>
> I remember looking at it but I'll have to look at
> the full sized version of the photo to see the
> details. I'll post a large crop of the photo
> tonight.
> -Ryan

Sure looks like the load meter to me. Most likely also has charge indications for the batteries....

Craig

I'd like to see how it would do against an SD40-2.

BNSFhogger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'd like to see how it would do against an SD40-2.

Yeah, me too. Does the test with the GP50 say more about the strength of the new switcher, or just how weak the GP50 is?

Here is the first thread with the bigger picture.

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,1018679,1018727#msg-1018727

Ac4400cwgevo
http://store.trainsondvd.biz

sp8192 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey Greendot...U got a larger pic?? That one is
> only 7k, and is that the before and after?? I mean
> of the old SP switcher cab, and the new genset in
> the background?

I'd also like to see how they do with increased speeds. Generating a load of torque for a stalled electric motor is fairly easy. Not that higher speeds are really relevant to pure switching duties, but I'd like to see how that derates. Mainly I want to know if they'd make a decent small roadswitcher in addition to yard goat.

David.Curlee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ryan, What information does the small computer
> screen mounted on the control stand tell the
> engineer?

Here's the closeup of the display of UPY 2004 (brightness and contrast adjusted). The display says "Traction Motor Current" at the top and I believe is says "Amp Hour Depletion" and "DC Bus OFF" on the lower right. Craig had this one pegged without the closeup...
-Ryan

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MtArarat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> I see a bright future for the Duetz air cooled
> diesel
> engine and generator sets in the near future.

In the late 60's and early 70's there was a fella named Art Knight that had 4 or 5 rigs hauling produce into the Pac NW from Calif with Duetz engines. I don't know what happened to Art or his trucks, but I know another driver that drove for him and said they were a lot of problems. I also met an owner operator in Wisc that had one with a second one ordered that liked the way that they pulled and the milage that they got. Those are the only Duetz diesels that I'm even aware of, so I don't see much future here as compared to Europe.


Butch,,,,,,,Hey! where'd the radiator go?

The "stall test" between the genset switcher and the GP50 demonstrated the ability of the genset unit to hold the rail. Each of the four traction motors underneath the UPY 2005 is independently powered and controlled, just like a GE AC unit ... if any one wheelset slips, power to it (and only that motor) is reduced. The GP50, on the other hand, has all 4 traction motors in permanent parallel ... when the Super Series adhesion control detects a slipping wheel, it has to reduce power to all four motors simultaneously.

NRE used a strain gauge coupler on the UPY 2005 to measure the coupler force ... they got around 82,000 to 86,000 pounds when the UPY 2005 and the GP50 were pulling against each other. If you divide 86,000 pounds by the 260,000 pound weight of the UPY 2005, you get 33.1% adhesion. If you divide 86,000 poiunds by the 270,000 pound weight of the GP50, you get 31.8% adhesion. Not much difference, but enough to allow the lighter genset switcher to hold the GP50. During the last test, the GP50 started coming unglued from the rail, at least one wheelset started slipping and giving the characteristic Super Series squeal.