Western Railroad Discussion > What the F

I see this "F" on every loco I see, what is the meaning/history of it?

---

FRONT

Indicates the front of the engine.

If you look on a Switcher, or some NS Engines, it will be on the long hood end.

...
Foamer

According to the conductors, when they replaced the steam engines with diesels, the engineers didn't know which end was the front. So they didn't know if they were coming a-head or backing up.

Of course, if you ask an engineer...

There is a Federal rule someplace that requires the front end of a locomotive to be designated as such. Given that the short hood end is 99.9% of the time going to be the front end, it may seem kind of silly.

However, there were some roads that ran long hood forward, other locomotives were just set up that way - the GN and UP, for example, had some GP-7 & GP-9 power set up that way. The big problem would be on something like the GE 44 ton, which seems to be symetrical around the cab.

Cars have an "A" end and a "B" end and the brake wheel determines that. A locomotive needs the same thing and the "F" for front must have seemed like a logical thing to do.

WOW that is one AWESOME looking unit! Have any more pic's? I would love to see them.

I have also notice the F in a cirlce which is a steel stamping welded onto the engine. This seems to be on older type of units.john1082 wrote:

You know, you guys are probably right by saying that the "F" means the front of the locomotive but I really do find it very difficult to swallow. Of course, if putting the "F" on the front of locomotives to tell someone that it is the front came from our Government, Then it makes sense knowing our Government. I hope that there is a "B" on the back.

Instead of it being factual, I think it's funny and almost insults an individuals intelligence.

Jim

NS 6182 is still a long hood forward set up unit
low nose or not.
Larry

Why would a railroad have a locomotive setup to run long hood forward?
--MagmaJctAz

CFR49-229.11 (a) The letter "F" shall be legibly shown on each side of every locomotive near the end which for identification purposes will be known as the front end. It seems silly until you are working a yard or switching cars and are expected to give signals to tell the engineer to proceed forward or backwards. It would be visually obvious unless the locomotive is around a curve ... it's even worse when working a centercab!

In addition to being used to identify the front for signalling purposes, it's used to reference the location of defects for maintenance purposes. If an engineer puts on his daily inspection report that R4 brakeshoe is thin, it means the 4th axle from the front on the right-hand side (right hand is defined as the side to the engineers right when seated at the controls facing the front).

Steam locomotives are not required to be marked with an "F".

I've seen some diesels marked with an "FR" and "FL" instead of just "F." I presume that's "Front, Right side" and "Front, Left side?"

fwwr5007

Well, some diesels had dual controls, they could be either short hood or long hood lead with the engineer on the right side of the cab in either direction. The F was necessary to define for maintenance purposes, accident investigations and who knows what other purposes the front end of the loco.

Switchmen giving signals to the engineer operating such a dual control locomotive ignored the F and just used 'the engineer's always on the right side of an engine going foreward' method. I don't know what the convention is for NS units where the control stand is more parallel to the side walls of the cab.

There is no back of an unit, it is the rear and some Canadian units are so marked. In fact, they mark all four corners, FR, FL, RR & RL.

During job briefings on NS we set up direction usually and don't go by what the lead engine is.
Larry

ge13031 wrote:

> CFR49-229.11 (a) The letter "F" shall be
> legibly shown on each side of every locomotive
> near the end which for identification purposes
> will be known as the front end.

Some cab cars used in push-pull service also
have an "F" at the cab end. First generation
California Cars have them:

http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/rail/calcars/cabcar.jpg

This was probably more a matter of convenience
or force of habit issue, as cab cars are not
technically "locomotives." Cab cars on other
systems lack the "F."

This ALCO from the Sidney & Lowe RR ex Rock Island, now at the Okla. Railway Museum, has a "F" on the long hood end and a "R" on the short hood end

gwl
http://photosbygreg.20m.com

---