Western Railroad Discussion > UP and Japan rail

Is the UP still buying there welded rail from Japan ?????

JLSeale

yes

czuleget Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> yes

Does it come with fake test data?

NYSWSD70M Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> czuleget Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > yes
>
> Does it come with fake test data?


You might want to ask the manufacturer...

billio Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NYSWSD70M Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > czuleget Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > yes
> >
> > Does it come with fake test data?
>
>
> You might want to ask the manufacturer...

Like they would tell you the truth!

Trust, but verify.

Send a few pieces to the lab...

Posted from Android

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Trust, but verify.
>
> Send a few pieces to the lab...
>
> Posted from Android

I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to be taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel, Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad" but they have since gone quiet on the subject.

I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 

How is Lucchini steel from Italy? Do they weld rail somewhere in the U.S. or is that shipped on 1600' ships and loaded on a rail train at a port?

NYSWSD70M Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Trust, but verify.
> >
> > Send a few pieces to the lab...
> >
> > Posted from Android
>
> I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to be
> taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel,
> Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or
> fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out
> saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad"
> but they have since gone quiet on the subject.
>
> I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for
> testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 

Subaru has a very favorable long term customer base. That's a good thing when you can't take the thing apart.

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NYSWSD70M Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Trust, but verify.
> > >
> > > Send a few pieces to the lab...
> > >
> > > Posted from Android
> >
> > I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to
> be
> > taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel,
> > Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or
> > fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out
> > saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad"
> > but they have since gone quiet on the subject.
> >
> > I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for
> > testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 
>
> Subaru has a very favorable long term customer
> base. That's a good thing when you can't take the
> thing apart.

I wonder how they will feel when they (the customer base) finds out Subaru has been falsifying records. Hero to zero in 6 seconds.

NYSWSD70M Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Trust, but verify.
> >
> > Send a few pieces to the lab...
> >
> > Posted from Android
>
> I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to be
> taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel,
> Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or
> fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out
> saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad"
> but they have since gone quiet on the subject.
>
> I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for
> testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 

You have to remember that Kobe Steel's faking (more popular company name: KOBELCO) was done primarily with Aluminum and non-structural powdered steel. While I was over there in Japan recently, I saw other Aluminum manufacturers taking advantage of the scandal and pasting ads (mostly digital) all over the place to grab KOBELCO customers.

Nissan and Subaru faked their quality control process, and it was implied this has been going on for decades.

I'll remind once again that Boeing was (or still is?) a KOBELCO customer for Aluminum. You might want to ask them how they feel.

cchan006 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NYSWSD70M Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Trust, but verify.
> > >
> > > Send a few pieces to the lab...
> > >
> > > Posted from Android
> >
> > I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to
> be
> > taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel,
> > Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or
> > fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out
> > saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad"
> > but they have since gone quiet on the subject.
> >
> > I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for
> > testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 
>
> You have to remember that Kobe Steel's faking
> (more popular company name: KOBELCO) was done
> primarily with Aluminum and non-structural
> powdered steel. While I was over there in Japan
> recently, I saw other Aluminum manufacturers
> taking advantage of the scandal and pasting ads
> (mostly digital) all over the place to grab
> KOBELCO customers.
>
> Nissan and Subaru faked their quality control
> process, and it was implied this has been going on
> for decades.
>
> I'll remind once again that Boeing was (or still
> is?) a KOBELCO customer for Aluminum. You might
> want to ask them how they feel.

With the level of maintenance that aircraft get, I bet they feel fine.
They have always been looking for cracks. And all metal airplanes will crack too.
Just a matter of location and size!

The Pacific Spike arrived in Stockton on the 10th and is due to depart on the 21st.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > I'll remind once again that Boeing was (or
> still
> > is?) a KOBELCO customer for Aluminum. You might
> > want to ask them how they feel.
>
> With the level of maintenance that aircraft get, I
> bet they feel fine.
> They have always been looking for cracks. And all
> metal airplanes will crack too.
> Just a matter of location and size!

And on that note, you would be wrong. I work for an electronic components distributer. All areospace contractor purchasers are sending out questionairs asking if any products they purchased could have contained material from KOBELCO. While I will not even take a guess at how inferior metal could affect a switch or a capaciter and so forth, the areospace industry is indeed concerned.

cchan006 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NYSWSD70M Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Trust, but verify.
> > >
> > > Send a few pieces to the lab...
> > >
> > > Posted from Android
> >
> > I Agree.  However, "Japanese Quality" seems to
> be
> > taking a hit these days.  Takata, Kobe Steel,
> > Nissan, Subaru all caught up in faking or
> > fabricating data.  At first Toyota came out
> > saying that "none of :their Kobe Steel was bad"
> > but they have since gone quiet on the subject.
> >
> > I don't have a test lab to send a Subaru to for
> > testing.  I have to trust the manufacture. 
>
> You have to remember that Kobe Steel's faking
> (more popular company name: KOBELCO) was done
> primarily with Aluminum and non-structural
> powdered steel. While I was over there in Japan
> recently, I saw other Aluminum manufacturers
> taking advantage of the scandal and pasting ads
> (mostly digital) all over the place to grab
> KOBELCO customers.
>
> Nissan and Subaru faked their quality control
> process, and it was implied this has been going on
> for decades.
>
> I'll remind once again that Boeing was (or still
> is?) a KOBELCO customer for Aluminum. You might
> want to ask them how they feel.

The point is they are faking reports, lying and misleading customers - period.  We are to take THEIR word that they were faking it only in aluminum?  Maybe.  Who knows for sure.  If you remember, the Volkswagen TDI scandal was originally confined to the 2.0.  THEY said the 3.0 was fine.

My larger point is, Japanese quality is not what it we were lead to believe or as advertised.

jst3751 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > I'll remind once again that Boeing was (or
> > still
> > > is?) a KOBELCO customer for Aluminum. You
> might
> > > want to ask them how they feel.
> >
> > With the level of maintenance that aircraft get,
> I
> > bet they feel fine.
> > They have always been looking for cracks. And
> all
> > metal airplanes will crack too.
> > Just a matter of location and size!
>
> And on that note, you would be wrong. I work for
> an electronic components distributer. All
> areospace contractor purchasers are sending out
> questionairs asking if any products they purchased
> could have contained material from KOBELCO. While
> I will not even take a guess at how inferior metal
> could affect a switch or a capaciter and so forth,
> the areospace industry is indeed concerned.

Yeah are they going to put a KOBELCO free label next to the door like a GMO free label?

VW and Toyota are the top 2 car manufacturers on the planet...despite big scandals. You don't get that big without making good cars.

exhaustED Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> VW and Toyota are the top 2 car manufacturers on
> the planet...despite big scandals. You don't get
> that big without making good cars.

That can be debated but that number one spot has cost them both dearly.  Toyota's stay at the number on position was short lived and came at the cost of some of their prestige and unit margin.  VW?  Again no one would trade places with them right now when you look at the billion that this scandal will cost.  Some say it isn't just limited to diesel engines.

Besides, the end does not justify the means.  Are they on top because of cheating?  (To be clear, no scandal has appeared at Toyota yet but they have become very quite about Kobe).  Frankly, Toyota has never been an innovator.  In some market they have failed miserably (large American Pickups).  They grew largely on quality (both real and perceived) and great marketing.  What happens if that (the quality product image) is gone?

Becoming number one involves much more than just a good product.

NYSWSD70M Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> exhaustED Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > VW and Toyota are the top 2 car manufacturers
> on
> > the planet...despite big scandals. You don't
> get
> > that big without making good cars.
>
> That can be debated but that number one spot has
> cost them both dearly.  Toyota's stay at the
> number on position was short lived and came at the
> cost of some of their prestige and unit margin. 
> VW?  Again no one would trade places with them
> right now when you look at the billion that this
> scandal will cost.  Some say it isn't just
> limited to diesel engines.
>
> Besides, the end does not justify the means.  Are
> they on top because of cheating?  (To be clear,
> no scandal has appeared at Toyota yet but they
> have become very quite about Kobe).  Frankly,
> Toyota has never been an innovator.  In some
> market they have failed miserably (large American
> Pickups).  They grew largely on quality (both
> real and perceived) and great marketing.  What
> happens if that (the quality product image) is
> gone?
>
> Becoming number one involves much more than just a
> good product.

More than ten years at number one (Toyota) wasn't bad! VW are still looking very strong because fundamentally the scandal affected a lot of cars, but it only actually meant the figures were distorted a relatively small amount. People can forgive that when frankly, on balance they're great cars. Time will tell...

exhaustED Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NYSWSD70M Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > exhaustED Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > VW and Toyota are the top 2 car manufacturers
> > on
> > > the planet...despite big scandals. You don't
> > get
> > > that big without making good cars.
> >
> > That can be debated but that number one spot
> has
> > cost them both dearly.  Toyota's stay at the
> > number on position was short lived and came at
> the
> > cost of some of their prestige and unit
> margin. 
> > VW?  Again no one would trade places with them
> > right now when you look at the billion that
> this
> > scandal will cost.  Some say it isn't just
> > limited to diesel engines.
> >
> > Besides, the end does not justify the means. 
> Are
> > they on top because of cheating?  (To be
> clear,
> > no scandal has appeared at Toyota yet but they
> > have become very quite about Kobe).  Frankly,
> > Toyota has never been an innovator.  In some
> > market they have failed miserably (large
> American
> > Pickups).  They grew largely on quality (both
> > real and perceived) and great marketing.  What
> > happens if that (the quality product
> image) is
> > gone?
> >
> > Becoming number one involves much more than just
> a
> > good product.
>
> More than ten years at number one (Toyota) wasn't
> bad! VW are still looking very strong because
> fundamentally the scandal affected a lot of cars,
> but it only actually meant the figures were
> distorted a relatively small amount. People can
> forgive that when frankly, on balance they're
> great cars. Time will tell...

...at the cost of margin,  They deluded their margins in a quest to be number one which is otherwise mean less.  Even their defects per CWT increased as they spread their engineering talent to build more (lower yield) automobiles.  For years, Ford decided to let GM be number one while they made far more money on lower volume.  In Chrysler's last days as an independent, they were the most profitable automaker in the world and had much lower volume that GM, FMC or Toyota.  Supposedly, volume brings lower cost but you cannot see it in Toyota's yield.  Besides, GM held onto number one from 1981-2007 when few believed that they had the best cars.

With respect to VW, the billions they will spend, loss of engineering and management talent is yet to be calculated.  It's little early to predict the outcome of this game.

Back to GM, (who was number one for how many years - rough 80) decided the cost to be number one wasn't worth the price.  How many Silverado's needed to be sold so they could loose money on Opels?  GM is the healthest that they have been in years.

I do agree completely with "Time will tell".