Western Railroad Discussion > UP Brazos Hump Yard

I guess everybody knows by now that UP has postponed the new Hump Yard close to Hearne, TX.  What I didn't know is that they had already laid quite a bit of rail and now, according to a UP conductor friend of mine, is that they are pulling up this rail and using it to extend sidings in West Texas on the Sunset Route.  Can anyboody confirm this?  I thought they just had the base laid out and had not put any track yet  I find it hard to believe they would pull up rail from the yard project instead of just buying new rail for West Texas sidings.  One of these days, they willl definetley need this yard.

Any information would be appreciated.

Randy Lundgren
Elgin, TX

The UP is having the worlds largest HOLD MY BEER contest. Just when you thought you seen it all the UP says HOLD MY BEER watch what we can do now

         Correct, RR's will spend $500,000 of labor money to pickup $350,000 worth of rail and then another $500,000 of labor money to put it back down somewhere else ( example of course ) but really who would care if the numbers are correct because only they know where the costs are being allocated anyway. College business classes these day might spend a lot of time on how to hide various costs. It appears Passenger people use the other program that allows them to charge off the same costs many times in other places no one has heard of to show diners lose $78.50 on every hotdog they serve.                   Hey wait a minute, didn't they spend $500,000 in the first time to lay that rail down. Better than we thought, makin' money now.     ha ha

texchief1 Wrote:
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> I guess everybody knows by now that UP has postponed the new Hump Yard close to Hearne, TX. 

Postponed?  More like "permanently cancelled."  Maybe that's why they came in and cleared out everything that could be used elsewhere.  
 

Just like all the other assets these PSR railroads are storing and scraping - then bragging about it.  One would think a better strategy would be to develop business and use those assets to produce revenue and profits...

I think they are intentionally trying to bankrupt the railroad because they make more money esle where like real estate.

Posted from iPhone

I think they are intentionally trying to bankrupt the railroad because they make more money esle where like real estate.

Posted from iPhone

I'm not surprised they have abandoned building this yard. They current leadership are not big fans of hump yards, and believe flat switching is the way to go. We will see more hump yards closed with more flat switching yards reopened or created. It comes down to cost per car, a hump yard has a higher cost per car humped then a flat switching yard, that's the thinking anyway.

CS

What I have heard is it is the cost of maintaining the hump and power switches.  Seems that would have to be it because when you flat switch it takes more people.

spwolfmtn Wrote:
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> Just like all the other assets these PSR railroads
> are storing and scraping - then bragging about it.
>  One would think a better strategy would be to
> develop business and use those assets to produce
> revenue and profits...

You are obviously not qualified to be a hedge fund manager.

TAW

I would imagine that the nature of the traffic plays a large role. If a manifest train has 100 different cars headed to 100 different destinations, then a hump yard makes sense. If it has ten 10-car blocks, then flat switching wins out.

Maybe with the loss of smaller customers to trucks or intermodal vs. carload traffic, the resulting mix favors flat switching?

tomstp Wrote:
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> What I have heard is it is the cost of maintaining
> the hump and power switches.  Seems that would
> have to be it because when you flat switch it
> takes more people.

Posted from Android

I would submit if the next senior management team at UP favors hump yards; there will be all kinds of data trotted out to support the use of hump yards versus flat switching.

It’s all about what the top folks want the numbers to prove.

Posted from iPhone

To hump or to flat switch is just a management policy.  It will change with management over time.  Kind of like political policy; you may not agree with current policy, but when a new leader comes in, that policy might change to something more favorable to you.  The PSR decisions being made are the current policy; I'll wager that in 10 years, the policy will be something else entirely.

The interesting thing about Brazos was that it was supposed to reduce or eliminate reliance on Davidson in Ft. Worth and Settlegast and Englewood in Houston.  And IIRC, it was supposed to be a bump yard (like Livonia), not a full hump.  Still with power switches, but less retarder necessity etc.  It seems like if Brazos allowed UP to shut down humping operations at two of those three yards, that two for one is still the better trade off.  Guess somebody decided something different; maybe they are going to close one or two of the existing humps anyway (just not announced yet) and see if they can make it work without Brazos (two for 0?).  

 

HomerBedloe Wrote:
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> maybe they are going to close one or two of the existing humps anyway (just not announced yet) and see if they can make it work without Brazos (two for 0?).  

After they're finished driving off all the "loose car" business by providing lousy service, they won't need ANY hump yards, or flat-switched yards, anywhere.   
 

HomerBedloe Wrote:
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> It seems like if Brazos allowed UP to shut down humping operations at two of those three
> yards, that two for one is still the better trade off.  Guess somebody decided something different;

So basically they are saying that humps are bad, but capital spending is even worse.

It's just amazing how Brazos has been erased from the UP PR machine. They just hope everyone else forgets about it too. Kinda of like the proposed Red Rock, AZ yard. Wonder how long before you see land for sale signs at the two locations...

As typical here these days, most of the posters don't know what they are talking about.  Those that post the most usually know the least.  Read the Trains article on Texas.  There is so much growth in that state and the Mexican gateways that more capacity will be needed for many years to come. 

UP rearranged their manifest scheme enough that they could DELAY Brazos Yard for some years, but they aren't going to sell the land.  They reallocated funds this year and next to expand sidings elsewhere.  Apparently it is cheaper to pull up the rails already laid and reuse them in extending sidings elsewhere than buying new rail.  Not a new strategy, it's been done long before PSR.  It isn't at all clear that in the long term Brazos Yard would create enough capacity to close or significantly scale back any yards in Fort Worth, Houston, Dallas, or San Antonio enough for a major land sale.  Too many variables, so it appears that everything is just a guess at this point.   UP has repeatedly said over the last couple of years that Brazos Yard is delayed, not cancelled. 

But I will thank HomerBedloe for trying to inject information instead of tired knee-jerk hot takes.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 12/07/19 13:04 by darkcloud.

What is the current status of the Brazos yard in Hearne?

The railroads pull up rail wherever it is under utilized and relay it.  Here is a track they pulled up on the Powder River line.

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