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Western Railroad Discussion > LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.


Date: 08/04/20 12:24
LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: czuleget

Here is a link to the news from Progressive railroading. 

https://www.progressiverailroading.com/csx/article/liquefied-natural-gas-could-help-railroads-reap-locomotive-benefits-if-regulatory-technical-issues-are-resolved--39693



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/04/20 12:25 by czuleget.



Date: 08/04/20 12:53
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: MP403

That's hardly news. Check the date on that story: 2014.

Railroads don't view LNG as a savior. In fact, trading diesel for LNG is simply substituting one fuel cost risk for another. There also are problems with run-through power if one Class I adopts LNG and others do not.

In other words, this ain't gonna happen.



Date: 08/04/20 13:21
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: goneon66

i think IF it was to be, it WOULD have happened by now............

66



Date: 08/04/20 13:59
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: Lackawanna484

The Florida East Coast seems happy enough with its dual fuel (diesel plus LNG) ES44 units. LNG fuel points at each end of the line.

Berkshire Hathaway is a 40% owner of Pilot Travel Centers, the interstate highway truck stop operator. Which has begun to install natural gas fueling points for over the road trucks. My understanding is the Pilot points are fed by pipeline.

The mechanics of installing fuel points along the BNSF southern transcontinental line wouldn't be too difficult if BNSF saw an opportunity to adopt the technology.  Which it doesn't seem to be under current rules.



Date: 08/04/20 19:47
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: PHall

The biggest issue is LNG infrastructure, or the lack of it. 



Date: 08/05/20 07:55
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: BAB

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Florida East Coast seems happy enough with its
> dual fuel (diesel plus LNG) ES44 units. LNG fuel
> points at each end of the line.
>
> Berkshire Hathaway is a 40% owner of Pilot Travel
> Centers, the interstate highway truck stop
> operator. Which has begun to install natural gas
> fueling points for over the road trucks. My
> understanding is the Pilot points are fed by
> pipeline.
>
> The mechanics of installing fuel points along the
> BNSF southern transcontinental line wouldn't be
> too difficult if BNSF saw an opportunity to adopt
> the technology.  Which it doesn't seem to be
> under current rules.

Know some tranist properties have LNG busses dont know about natural gas. Dual fuel OTR trucks? Or natural gas alone? Have not seen any and about trains, UP tried it long ago and gave up due to many problems one of them fueling as you dont just hook a hose up to the train. Lots of safety issues about where and how its done.  



Date: 08/05/20 08:41
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: czuleget

This Just came out today in the news, that So Cal Gas and Clean Energy Fuels is Suing the State of California for not promoting climate change policy's, Clean Nat Gas called renew called 0 emissions vehicles. Which is cleaner then electric vehicles. The bill passed in the Jerry Brown era is to be reviewed every 4 years and has not been thoroughly reviewed which was in 2019.  Calif. has been hell bent on promoting electric. houses appliances, heating,  public transportation and building out the non polluting electric grids by placing the ugly wind turbines in the Mojave, Beaumont and Altamont pass's.  



Date: 08/05/20 08:44
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: Lackawanna484

BAB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Florida East Coast seems happy enough with
> its
> > dual fuel (diesel plus LNG) ES44 units. LNG
> fuel
> > points at each end of the line.
> >
> > Berkshire Hathaway is a 40% owner of Pilot
> Travel
> > Centers, the interstate highway truck stop
> > operator. Which has begun to install natural
> gas
> > fueling points for over the road trucks. My
> > understanding is the Pilot points are fed by
> > pipeline.
> >
> > The mechanics of installing fuel points along
> the
> > BNSF southern transcontinental line wouldn't be
> > too difficult if BNSF saw an opportunity to
> adopt
> > the technology.  Which it doesn't seem to be
> > under current rules.
>
> Know some tranist properties have LNG busses dont
> know about natural gas. Dual fuel OTR trucks? Or
> natural gas alone? Have not seen any and about
> trains, UP tried it long ago and gave up due to
> many problems one of them fueling as you dont just
> hook a hose up to the train. Lots of safety issues
> about where and how its done.  

Florida East Coast has been running dual fuel ES44 units for several years. Diesel only. Or diesel plus 40%? Natural gas.

Posted from Android



Date: 08/05/20 12:14
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: PHall

BAB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lackawanna484 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Florida East Coast seems happy enough with
> its
> > dual fuel (diesel plus LNG) ES44 units. LNG
> fuel
> > points at each end of the line.
> >
> > Berkshire Hathaway is a 40% owner of Pilot
> Travel
> > Centers, the interstate highway truck stop
> > operator. Which has begun to install natural
> gas
> > fueling points for over the road trucks. My
> > understanding is the Pilot points are fed by
> > pipeline.
> >
> > The mechanics of installing fuel points along
> the
> > BNSF southern transcontinental line wouldn't be
> > too difficult if BNSF saw an opportunity to
> adopt
> > the technology.  Which it doesn't seem to be
> > under current rules.
>
> Know some tranist properties have LNG busses dont
> know about natural gas. Dual fuel OTR trucks? Or
> natural gas alone? Have not seen any and about
> trains, UP tried it long ago and gave up due to
> many problems one of them fueling as you dont just
> hook a hose up to the train. Lots of safety issues
> about where and how its done.  

Most transit busses run on CNG (Compressed Natural Gas). Infrastructure to handle CNG is much easier to build/maintain.
And CNG is what the vast majority of "Natural Gas" powered vehicles use.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/20 22:23 by PHall.



Date: 08/05/20 16:22
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: blueflag

LNG is merely the storage means in the fuel tank, it has to be regasified to burn as natural gas in the prime mover probably no different than CNG.

A small liquifaction unit could be located at each fueling station, however it may not be simple just because it is small. I doubt it is as simple as adding charging stations for electric vehicles.

Posted from Android



Date: 08/05/20 19:35
Re: LNG / Diesel dual fuel, not to be or to Be! in the future.
Author: czuleget

Believe it or not it is simple to build CNG stations and LNG at the same location. Its been being done here in California for over 10 years.  Westport and Cumin's are making the power plants and the regulator system for a OEM engine systems.   Look up Clean Energy Fuels and Westport Innovations.   



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