Western Railroad Discussion > BIG in Barstow

Railway Age is out today with an article on a big, new intermodal facility — dubbed BIG — in Barstow.

Here’s the link:

https://www.railwayage.com/freight/class-i/bnsf-going-big-in-barstow%ef%bf%bc/?fbclid=IwAR1c0jWQEpJMWWVq8Z2LoJfygtcZPIV01bOkGE8veuDaqDtfJQLK8M2dzj0

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I guess the idea is to run "shuttle" trains from the harbor to Barstow...and then sort the containers out by destination at Barstow.

Im assuming that this will get containers out of the port faster??

pdt Wrote:
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> I guess the idea is to run "shuttle" trains from
> the harbor to Barstow...and then sort the
> containers out by destination at Barstow.
>
> Im assuming that this will get containers out of
> the port faster??

I thought the problem was getting the container from the dock to the train since on the dock train loading went away years ago.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pdt Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I guess the idea is to run "shuttle" trains
> from
> > the harbor to Barstow...and then sort the
> > containers out by destination at Barstow.
> >
> > Im assuming that this will get containers out
> of
> > the port faster??
>
> I thought the problem was getting the container
> from the dock to the train since on the dock train
> loading went away years ago.

Drayage has indeed been an issue, but the current yards in LA aren't big enough to handle the incoming traffic either. Makes sense to shuttle to Barstow where they're less pressed for space.

This project is so big that it seems like it will change how the LA ports operate.  Just "get the containers off the docks!" to Barstow, and then deal with them.

UP can only sit back and cry watching all of this.  Their only choice would be to build something similar in the desert along their line east of West Colton or around Yermo, but UP doesn't seem to be in a business explanding mode.  BNSF is spending billions of private dollars to do this project.  Cajon Pass will just become so busy it's hard to imagine.  And the Alameda Corridor trench will finally see the amount of trains it was built to handle.

If I was a young man, I'd try to get in on this employment scene--long term, it's great.  But will BNSF be able to find enough workers given all the labor strife and their extremely strict, some say draconian, attendance policies??  They've got to understand that their blue collar rank-and-file workers are the key to all of this.  "Take care of your employees, and they will take care of you, and your business."  The only way for this to really happen and succeed is to create "win-win" relationships, both among management teams, and among all the union employees.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/22 19:10 by coach.

coach Wrote:
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> 
>
> UP can only sit back and cry watching all of this.
>  Their only choice would be to build something
> similar in the desert along their line east of
> West Colton or around Yermo, but UP doesn't seem
> to be in a business explanding mode.  BNSF is
> spending billions of private dollars to do this
> project.  Cajon Pass will just become so busy
> it's hard to imagine.  And the Alameda Corridor
> trench will finally see the amount of trains it
> was built to handle.
>
They are building one in Mojave. https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,5522021,page=1
 

zorz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PHall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > pdt Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I guess the idea is to run "shuttle" trains
> > from
> > > the harbor to Barstow...and then sort the
> > > containers out by destination at Barstow.
> > >
> > > Im assuming that this will get containers out
> > of
> > > the port faster??
> >
> > I thought the problem was getting the container
> > from the dock to the train since on the dock
> train
> > loading went away years ago.
>
> Drayage has indeed been an issue, but the current
> yards in LA aren't big enough to handle the
> incoming traffic either. Makes sense to shuttle to
> Barstow where they're less pressed for space.

If you think the railroads are clogged now try driving CA 60 and I-15. They're already packed with trucks now, they don't need to add a bunch more.
Plus where do they plan to get the drivers they will need to move the containers to Barstow? They have a hard enough time time just finding the drivers to take the containers to Ontario.

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you think the railroads are clogged now try
> driving CA 60 and I-15. They're already packed
> with trucks now, they don't need to add a bunch
> more.
> Plus where do they plan to get the drivers they
> will need to move the containers to Barstow? They
> have a hard enough time time just finding the
> drivers to take the containers to Ontario.

I guess you didn't actually read what was posted.  The containers will move via train from the ports to Barstow.  If done right, it could result in a significant decrease it trucks in the LA Basin.  Even if a container isn't bound to be sent by rail to its final destination, it will still ride a freight to the desert.  At the worst, there would be no real change in train or truck traffic, just a stop to resuffle the containers between trains.  I highly doubt BNSF is planning to spend 1.5 billion to do the worst.  This could be a massive game changer.

Depending on what UP can arrange with Metrolink for the Mojave project, if you combine the new Cajon
IM traffic with whatever UP might add on their own side the Pass is going to get real busy. The BIG thing 
sounds like BNSF gave up on trying to develop in West Colton, so be it. I can see a real issue in finding
people both for the BIG project and the increase in rail traffic.

Out 

Maybe BNSF will sell  the Colton  Cement property to the UP  or  use it such as a Trailer only facility  or all inbound to be placed on trucks for Sou Cal points.

Interesting days ahead. At my age of 89 will see nothing of it.

Ed



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/22 21:33 by mundo.

Ed the article sounded like they were anxious to get started in Barstow, you might get to see quite a bit of
the "progress". The crews have already been talking about the new "parking" area at Lenwood.

Out 

I hope they can find enough employees to work there. Very ambitious plan.

Adam

30 minutes from victorville (not exactly nowhere with pop of 122,000), and still a decent climate compared to most of the country.
Or if u want to live in Barstow, median house price is 250K.

At the very least, it should get a lot of trucks off the road in SoCal, and relieve port congestion.   I dont see it as a game changer...and how much it is used will depend on the economy, and whatever happens in the future....

I see this plan adding trucks to highways, not eliminating them.    So all containers take the train to the desert.   Then all those that were originally destined to L.A. proper have to take the highways back to the city.    Whereas now they truck them right from the ports to local L.A. destinations.   Today's method involves less mileage with the trucks.    The new way would involve more highway miles, and clog up the 14 Freeway, which is already a two and three lane disaster between the AV and Santa Clarita.   Same can be said for the already clogged 15.   No thanks.



 

Of the containers arriving in LA Harbor by ship:

75% are off loaded and moved by truck and rail.  About a third of the containers are moved out by rail on trains blocked for destinations.  About a third of the containers are delivered in the LA basin.  And a third of the containers are trucked to massive inland warehouses
in Ontario, Rancho Cucamonga, Fontana, and San Bernardino where the goods are warehoused, and reshipped all over North America in 53-foot domestic containers.
the remaing 25% of the containers arriving on ship usually stay on the ship and go to Oakland or Seattle/Tacoma.
There are so many possible destinations and routes that it is nearly impossible to assemble blocked trains for every destination.  In other words, what does a steamship line do with eight containers for Atlanta, or 5 for Minneapolis?    It appears that both the inland ports will be batter able to assemble blocked trains to operate thru Chicago.
Conversly, it may be the intention to load trains of Westbound containers at Barstow arriving in various trains direct to the on dock terminals with reduced switching at LA Harbor.
This could be very interesting.

Norm
 

Norman Orfall
Helendale, CA
TIOGA PASS, a private railcar

Mr-Beechcroft Wrote:
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> I hope they can find enough employees to work
> there. Very ambitious plan.

It will be scabbed out to the lowest bidder.

Fizzboy7 Wrote:
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> I see this plan adding trucks to highways, not
> eliminating them.    So all containers take the
> train to the desert.   Then all those that were
> originally destined to L.A. proper have to take
> the highways back to the city.    Whereas now
> they truck them right from the ports to local L.A.
> destinations.   Today's method involves less
> mileage with the trucks.    The new way would
> involve more highway miles, and clog up the 14
> Freeway, which is already a two and three lane
> disaster between the AV and Santa Clarita. 
>  Same can be said for the already clogged 15. 
>  No thanks.

Both UP and BNSF are building yards for traffic that is not destined for the LA basin (~70% of containers). The 14 and 15 would be more likely to see a decrease in truck traffic than an increase

Great plan for reworking mixed destination railcars at an intermediate lift facility and making solid destination trains from Barstow.  Could get rid of Clovis if this comes to fruition.  Terrible plan for containers that are currently reworked in the Inland Empire would mean they have to reverse dray back down to the Basin for cross docking and the Domestic container would load at San Bernardino or dray back to Barstow.  Good plan for containers that now dray up to Victorville that could rail in this plan, dray back to Victorville, crossdock, and then have a Domestic container dray back up to Barstow.  That will relieve some of the volume issues at San Bernardino.

Pete
Camarillo, CA

You could see Berdoo handling the bulk of the Inland Empire business with the possibiltiy of shuttle
trains back from Barstow if Berdoo is bypased for the first sort. Thing has merits if correctly run but
then so is railroading in general.

Out 
 

I wonder what this does to the proposed Southern California International Gateway, the yard down by the ports that BNSF has been proposing but has been held up in the regulatory process for the last 10-15 years

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